Tiers and feats for multiclassing made it very unappealing to me to multiclass. 1st edition and 2nd edition multiclassing was also pretty unappealing. You were often way behind. 3 edition had the most 'love' for the multi-classer, but maybe simply limit it to just two or three classes at most. It wasn't until you added multiple prestige classes with multiple classes did the munchkin army arrive. Even then it was sometimes fun to see the circus. But the tier system and the old way of doing...
View full commentTiers and feats for multiclassing made it very unappealing to me to multiclass. 1st edition and 2nd edition multiclassing was also pretty unappealing. You were often way behind. 3 edition had the most 'love' for the multi-classer, but maybe simply limit it to just two or three classes at most. It wasn't until you added multiple prestige classes with multiple classes did the munchkin army arrive. Even then it was sometimes fun to see the circus. But the tier system and the old way of doing it, I don't think it encourages unique builds. The goal here is unique builds. Allow the freedom or creativity here and give the DM some tools and mechanics on limiting the frequency and numbers of classes and prestige classes one can multi-class with.
Nalehw and Schwarg: The issue brought up about a multiclass wizard 5/Cleric 5 not being effective in a level encounter had me thinking. The first 3e campaign I was in (to learn the system), I played a multi class wizard/cleric as I liked half elf druid/wizards in 1e/2e. I was VERY effective in the campaign, even though I was only able to cast low level spells- my 5d6 fireballs still did damage and my 3d8+5 cure spells still helped the party. I agree all the prestige classes really amped...
View full commentNalehw and Schwarg: The issue brought up about a multiclass wizard 5/Cleric 5 not being effective in a level encounter had me thinking. The first 3e campaign I was in (to learn the system), I played a multi class wizard/cleric as I liked half elf druid/wizards in 1e/2e. I was VERY effective in the campaign, even though I was only able to cast low level spells- my 5d6 fireballs still did damage and my 3d8+5 cure spells still helped the party.
I agree all the prestige classes really amped up the munchkins... my group had a bout with cherry picking. Fortunately, it had settled down after a while, but I had a few players keep asking me if they could use a prestige class (spell, feat, weapon, etc.) from one of he many splat books that I really had no use for. I ended up going through all the books I had for 3e and made a final ruling on what I would allow, putting the lists in a binder for the players to look up (I included some gameworld and house rules information for them as well). It has worked out fine.
As for 4e, my regular group read through the books and wouldn't touch it. I had to try it out with a different group as a player. After one campaign- about a dozen sessions, I never went back.
Getting back to the question about multi classing, I am ok with a 1e/2e concept (although it was somewhat bulky) or a 3e concept, but with restrictions on the number of classes- maybe 2 or 3 at most. Instead of prestige classes, the concept of the kit from 2e seemed to work better- adding flavor, but not too much detail so that characters can develop their characters as individuals, not cardboard cutouts.
bounded accuracy still confuses me 4e is being prematurely burried like a character out of Poe for the unforgivable crimeof 'not being D&D' enough yet every version of D&D has always had attacks get better with level. how does bounded accuracy not make Next even more "not D&D" than 4e?
4e is being prematurely burried like a character out of Poe for the unforgivable crimeof 'not being D&D' enough yet every version of D&D has always had attacks get better with level.
how does bounded accuracy not make Next even more "not D&D" than 4e?
I think part of the reason you are confused is because you perhaps think bounded accuracy means that attacks rolls do NOT improve with levels. They do. Just much slower. This is actually a lesson learned FROM 4E, not a regression. This is moving the ball forward into a better game (hopefully). The problem with 4E (as some saw it, and this apparently includes the 5E designers) was that the numbers scaled up too fast. This made for very high numbers as you went up in levels. It made mental math...
View full commentI think part of the reason you are confused is because you perhaps think bounded accuracy means that attacks rolls do NOT improve with levels. They do. Just much slower. This is actually a lesson learned FROM 4E, not a regression. This is moving the ball forward into a better game (hopefully). The problem with 4E (as some saw it, and this apparently includes the 5E designers) was that the numbers scaled up too fast. This made for very high numbers as you went up in levels. It made mental math more cumbersome and generally took away from immersion and gameplay. Part of the "it's not D&D" feel that 4E had came from every class/race combo increasing its hit roll at the exact same rate, or being able to use any ability score to determine your ability to land a blow. There was a lot of good in that system, and it's being retained in NEXT (for example, using different ability scores to determing you magical to hit bonus). BUt the bad is being excised. In general, I think they're doing a good job. My problem is how they're achieving this. They've basically moved all the scaling out of the to-hit numbers and into the damage numbers. So whatever benefit they achieve in one area, there will likely be a corresponding drawback somewhere else. I'm hoping they figure it out and implement it better than it's current state.
Ultimately, I'd like to see this edition tread lightly with setting dependent material. This includes things like the social details of races, languages and the like. A lot of this material is OK for a 'default setting', but some thought should go into how this will interact with setting material. This is a general comment that extends to PC things like race fluff, language, and alignment.
View full commentUltimately, I'd like to see this edition tread lightly with setting dependent material. This includes things like the social details of races, languages and the like. A lot of this material is OK for a 'default setting', but some thought should go into how this will interact with setting material.
This is a general comment that extends to PC things like race fluff, language, and alignment.
The only thing I really don't like about the stat block is the average damage stat. I guarantee I will never use that rule, and it will only get in my way. I'd prefer that you stick with the old school damage dice plus modifiers only.
Should all elves be the same body type? No, of course not. Should some elves be fat? Yes. But What is fat for an elf? It isn't the same as what is fat for a human or a dwarf. An Obese elf may well have a similar body type to a plump human. Just look at real world animals... I'll use different breeds of dogs for examples. A fat greyhound isn't very fat compared to a bulldog. .. it is still fat for its breed but the "natural" body shape of a greyhound is so thin to begin with that...
View full commentShould all elves be the same body type? No, of course not. Should some elves be fat? Yes. But What is fat for an elf? It isn't the same as what is fat for a human or a dwarf. An Obese elf may well have a similar body type to a plump human.
Just look at real world animals... I'll use different breeds of dogs for examples. A fat greyhound isn't very fat compared to a bulldog. .. it is still fat for its breed but the "natural" body shape of a greyhound is so thin to begin with that the scale is very different.
So Elves should have a range of body types from thin (which would appear dangerously anorexic for a human... apart from the bones not poking out so much) to fat (which would look slightly overweight for a human). If you really want to display dangerous weight catagories then you could go further... but I don't think those kinds of weights should be commonly depicted.
I would love to see variations in bodytypes among all non-humans, not just the standards like dwarve and elf. I think the tendency to label any somewhat significant variation a subtype to be kinda ridiculous. Races should be allowed some realistic variation while still being consider part of the same group of elves or lizardmen. consideration should always be taken to what their specific race ideal is though, lest they lose the uniqueness that makes them an identifiably non-human race. ...
View full commentI would love to see variations in bodytypes among all non-humans, not just the standards like dwarve and elf. I think the tendency to label any somewhat significant variation a subtype to be kinda ridiculous. Races should be allowed some realistic variation while still being consider part of the same group of elves or lizardmen. consideration should always be taken to what their specific race ideal is though, lest they lose the uniqueness that makes them an identifiably non-human race.
As for monster variation, I would adore seeing more of that. I'd actually like the regional owlbear thing. I like the feeling of a worldwide setting with all manner of creatures adapted to all manner of biomes.
Wow, this is as solid a piece of world-building advice as I've ever heard. I've been a longtime fan of the old Dungeoncraft series of articles, and this is a worthy addition for designing cities. I love the starting point and natural flow from there.
"Why not just have no-nonsense swords +1, and magic items straight out of the rulebooks? Why earrings of lordly might or ale casks of the blinding strike? Well, because it's more fun, that's why." I reverse the question and direct it to the powers-that-be. Why have non-nonsense swords +1? The math of the game has become a component examined under a microscope by character optimizers. It is understood with such precision that an entire Board devoted to this aspect of the game has...
View full comment"Why not just have no-nonsense swords +1, and magic items straight out of the rulebooks? Why earrings of lordly might or ale casks of the blinding strike? Well, because it's more fun, that's why."
I reverse the question and direct it to the powers-that-be.
Why have non-nonsense swords +1?
The math of the game has become a component examined under a microscope by character optimizers. It is understood with such precision that an entire Board devoted to this aspect of the game has consistently identified exactly what "plus" a PC needs for his (or her) armor, weapon, and neck item (in 4e; earlier editions had different must haves in addition to the requisite armor and weapon) at exactly what level to maintain pace with or mastery over the math of the game.
Magic items become a game of accounting acquisition rather than wondrous and fun. Sure, that +1 sword *can* have a magical flaming property (and these properties are also factored into CharOp recommendations, but with far less consensus), but in the end, the +1 (or +2 through +6) is the "must have" and the flaming property becomes the fun part.
The result of this is that a game balanced with the assumption of PCs without +X magic items becomes a cakewalk for those with them, and a game balanced with the assumption of PCs with such items becomes a TPK for those without them.
Remove the +X items from the game entirely and balance on the assumption that a level 6 PC is a level 6 PC. No +X items to give, non +X items to abuse, and no +X items to acquire. Then the flaming sword becomes special because it is a magical sword.
In the module Bree-Yark says its the equivalent of "hey rube" - a traditional shout of alarm amongst carnival folk (see wikipedia). I'm not sure if this is intended to be an insult, as the author of the article suggests.
I think it's pretty safe to say that the (subconscious, to be generous) motivation for humanoid monsters for thousands of years of mythology has been other ethnic groups and the fear of the (human) outsider. Your same concerns have been leveled against Tolkien, the black-n-white Nosferatu movie, and so on. There are all sorts of symbols, systems of government, demons (named after other people's gods) etc. used by fantasy settings that can start to be disturbing if you are aware of their...
View full commentI think it's pretty safe to say that the (subconscious, to be generous) motivation for humanoid monsters for thousands of years of mythology has been other ethnic groups and the fear of the (human) outsider. Your same concerns have been leveled against Tolkien, the black-n-white Nosferatu movie, and so on. There are all sorts of symbols, systems of government, demons (named after other people's gods) etc. used by fantasy settings that can start to be disturbing if you are aware of their origins.
IMO nothing in fantasy has to have any undertones until you start giving those to it. Goblins are imaginary, so IMO it's safe to make them "sentient vermin". If one can get past the "undertones" of a game where killing things is the most common problem solving skill, then one can probably manage to enjoy the other tropes of fantasy (however educated your enjoyment is).
Ummm...why not just keep it simple, ala the original 1st or second version of the AD&D game. I see it far too often that the issue is trying to be over complicated, or trying to overdefine the mechanics instead of the story. There were a bunch of additional appendices with the second edition that were there for DM's to utilize, so in essence i'd leave it up to them. Keep the system as it is, or was....
Because not everyone likes Vancian magic. I personally prefer spell points, because it provides a way to limit the power of spellcasters while, for me at least, it makes it a bit more fun to play as.
I suspect the disparity between racial ability score boosts will accelerate power creep. Nonhuman races will inevitably get mechanical options that are better than Human options, in order to “balance” the races better. But then the Human will use the better Nonhuman options as a baseline for new Human options. And the armsraces soar up from there.
Giving humans a blanket +1 to ability scores is a pathetic attempt to pander to Pathfinder power gamers. The way they're described it would be more appropriate to give them a +1 to Charisma, and go back to the extra skill or feat rationale of Third Edition*. On a related note, allowing elves to roll Perception with advantage is a little more than saying they're not often surprised. That, especially combined with the fact that low-light vision is overpowered for them and underpowered for...
View full commentGiving humans a blanket +1 to ability scores is a pathetic attempt to pander to Pathfinder power gamers. The way they're described it would be more appropriate to give them a +1 to Charisma, and go back to the extra skill or feat rationale of Third Edition*.
On a related note, allowing elves to roll Perception with advantage is a little more than saying they're not often surprised. That, especially combined with the fact that low-light vision is overpowered for them and underpowered for dwarves, starts off the wack arms race almost just as much.
*I think they get an extra skill in Fourth but I never bought that Players Handbook, and the point is not worth trying to decipher that edition's mangled SRD. People should want to play humans for the idealistic vision that they are newcomers to the world, elves for their contradictory jaded and naturalistic worldview, or dwarves because they are gruff curmudgeons.
In the first playtest packet, it was mentioned under "magic attacks" on the pre-generated wizard character. In the more recent playtest packet, the pre-generated wizard does not seem to get that bonus, as his magic missile damage is listed as 1d4+1 (not 1d4+4).
"Keep in mind that we’re still working out these mechanics, but we’d also like it if a player could choose how many spells of the various frequencies to memorize. Want to play a 4E-style wizard? Prepare some spells that refresh after 10 minutes, some spells that don’t come back until the end of the day, and some spells that you can cast at-will. Want to play a classic pure-1E-style wizard? Only prepare spells that refresh at the end of the day." Music to my ears. This was the one thing,...
View full comment"Keep in mind that we’re still working out these mechanics, but we’d also like it if a player could choose how many spells of the various frequencies to memorize. Want to play a 4E-style wizard? Prepare some spells that refresh after 10 minutes, some spells that don’t come back until the end of the day, and some spells that you can cast at-will. Want to play a classic pure-1E-style wizard? Only prepare spells that refresh at the end of the day."
Music to my ears. This was the one thing, even before news of Next came out, that I wanted in the next edition. To me, it seemed like the perfect way to bridge the gap between people who liked editions 3 and prior, with Vancian only options, and 4e, with the AEDU set up, and even people like me, who would prefer to scrap with the D part of AEDU entirely. The only thing that would make it more awesome would be some confirmation that a mechanic could be in play to allow a wizard to swap out the "refresh in 10 minute" spells, which was one of my first house-rule ideas for 4e (which sadly didn't work too well, with 4e's set up, but could do well in Next.)
Lots of things were broken about it, but tons of people absolutely *loved* it anyway, because but made it practical to achieve all sorts of character concepts you could never have made otherwise. So if they can design an *optional* system that has built in mechanics for fixing game balance issues while still giving folks the things they love about having that flexibility, as far as I'm concerned, that's the best of both worlds. But already in Next, you can do a lot of things with...
View full commentLots of things were broken about it, but tons of people absolutely *loved* it anyway, because but made it practical to achieve all sorts of character concepts you could never have made otherwise. So if they can design an *optional* system that has built in mechanics for fixing game balance issues while still giving folks the things they love about having that flexibility, as far as I'm concerned, that's the best of both worlds.
But already in Next, you can do a lot of things with specialties that required multiclassing in 3e, so hopefully it will be much more rare, even when allowed.
Actually, with separate advancement rules for multiclass characters, it sounds like a compromise with hybrids -- much more flexible than just playing a hybrid (you many more degrees you can use to balance your mixture of classes), but much more level-scaled than 3E, which resembles a hybrid.
I like a big dumb ogre as much as the next guy, but the occasional cunning ogre makes for great story telling. Someone has to lead the band/tribe. I am totally OK with ogre mages being a separate thing, but they should be a subspecies of ogre, related to onis but not 100% identical there either. Possibly born as ogres under great auspices.
View full commentI like a big dumb ogre as much as the next guy, but the occasional cunning ogre makes for great story telling. Someone has to lead the band/tribe.
I am totally OK with ogre mages being a separate thing, but they should be a subspecies of ogre, related to onis but not 100% identical there either. Possibly born as ogres under great auspices.
Ogre magi aren't that difficult if you make one slight tweak: they act like Sorcerers instead of Wizards. Their powers are innate and come from practice & natural skill, rather than education.
The way my current group decided on the naming convention, is to reverse the naming - the "Abominations" (powerful snake-like beings) are called Purebloods, and the "Purebloods" (human-like yuan-ti) are the Abominations. The way the names are right now, you'd think it's the other way around - where the Purebloods are the top tier and Abominations are the manual labor rejects. And what to call the hybrid middle tier - I don't care. I'm not offended by the term "half-breed" or...
View full commentThe way my current group decided on the naming convention, is to reverse the naming - the "Abominations" (powerful snake-like beings) are called Purebloods, and the "Purebloods" (human-like yuan-ti) are the Abominations.
The way the names are right now, you'd think it's the other way around - where the Purebloods are the top tier and Abominations are the manual labor rejects.
And what to call the hybrid middle tier - I don't care. I'm not offended by the term "half-breed" or "half-blood" - it makes sense to call them that, after all. If it bothers you so much that a fantasy being is called a certain way, that's more your own problem than the game's (as in, seeing offense in something where non need be found).
I always had the purebloods leading the yuan-ti. The abominations may have been the strongest and most alien, but they followed the commands purebloods. I think 4E got it right, when the anathema went made and were thrown down and imprisoned. I like this version of yuan-ti.
I never liked Kobolds as reptiles, I always preferred the dog people from 2e. Otherwise to barrow from Palladium, I like the idea that kobolds are smart, very smart. I'm fine with the other two.
View full commentI never liked Kobolds as reptiles, I always preferred the dog people from 2e. Otherwise to barrow from Palladium, I like the idea that kobolds are smart, very smart.
"A pensive Ardyn grumbles and scratches at his scaly chin, thinking long and hard about the fate of the hated enemy trapped within the aquatic vessel. Suddenly a deep gargle from within Ardyn's throat culminates in a sharp, bright, elemental blast aimed at the vessel and a loud crash echoes through the smokey blast. The air hangs heavy with choking smoke and you all struggle to catch your breath or to see the result of Ardyn's decision. Moments later the smoke is dispelled by a brisk flap or...
View full comment"A pensive Ardyn grumbles and scratches at his scaly chin, thinking long and hard about the fate of the hated enemy trapped within the aquatic vessel. Suddenly a deep gargle from within Ardyn's throat culminates in a sharp, bright, elemental blast aimed at the vessel and a loud crash echoes through the smokey blast. The air hangs heavy with choking smoke and you all struggle to catch your breath or to see the result of Ardyn's decision. Moments later the smoke is dispelled by a brisk flap or two from Ardyn's wings, their leathery, webbed wings creating a snapping sound in the air like a fatigued slave driver's whip hand. And there, arms braced over the edge of the vessels hull, lays a fatigued enemy gasping laboriously for air..."
Here is some info toward a folklore accurate Goblin. Altho many nature spirits translate into English as “goblins”, most of the stories about the actual Goblin come from Britain during the Romantic Era, late 1800s. The D&D Goblin can match up well with the folklore, especially when a player race. • Typically: Very high Dexterity, high Intelligence, low Strength, low Charisma, very low Wisdom. Goblins are stealthy and surprisingly spry. They are knowledgeable and clever, but...
View full commentHere is some info toward a folklore accurate Goblin. Altho many nature spirits translate into English as “goblins”, most of the stories about the actual Goblin come from Britain during the Romantic Era, late 1800s.
The D&D Goblin can match up well with the folklore, especially when a player race.
• Typically: Very high Dexterity, high Intelligence, low Strength, low Charisma, very low Wisdom.
Goblins are stealthy and surprisingly spry. They are knowledgeable and clever, but tend to be oblivious to the obvious that is going on in front of them. They are capricious, cowardly, and difficult to take seriously. They are small, and their Strength suffers proportionally.
• The Goblins are fey, so a connection to magic is a given. They are knowledgeable about magic, and often use rituals.
• They have a vicious sense of humor, typically playing pranks that are mean, harmful, and fatal.
• They (most of them) hate Humans, and seek to destroy Humans in amusing ways.
• In physical appearance, they are small and grotesque. They lack toes, and find the sight of toes offensive and sickening.
• The Goblins see themselves as much more refined than Humans, which is humorous.
• Nocturnal with darkvision and sensitivity to sunlight.
• Goblins live in caves and mines, with a Goblin King, plus intrigues of the royal court.
• Goblins abduct children. This can be a good plot hook, especially for low-level adventures. The adventurers need to rescue the children before they suffer the ritual that traps them into goblinhood. This is how Goblins increase their numbers, especially as spouses, slaves, and armies.
• But the most interesting Goblin trait is ...
Singing and poetry (specifically rhymes?) repels Goblins, till out of earshot. This is a quirky and fun trait that can make encounters with Goblin vivid and memorable. A great way to lighten the mood while in the context of evil monsters. It is necessary to come up with a balanced mechanic to represent this, but an
Al-Qadim (aka Arabian Adventures)
Birthright
Blackmoor
Dark Sun
Dragonlance
Eberron
Forgotten Realms
Greyhawk
Hollow World
Jakandor
Kara-Tur (aka Oriental Adventures)
Maztica
Mystara (aka The Known World) -includes Savage Coast and Red Steel sub-settings
Planescape
Ravenloft -includes Masque of the Red Death sub-setting
Spelljammer
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I agree all the prestige classes really amped...
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