Community

While I'm still covered in work at the moment, I expect to have time from next week to start looking for options to sustain and grow this forum.  I'm stickying this thread as a place for anyone who has suggestions to write in.

One suggestion that was floated by both Wolfpack and myself is to eliminate the "Seasons."  For one, they no longer have the significance they once did, since there are no prizes to award (everyone has custom avatars, and custom titles apparently can't be easily added anymore).  Furthermore,  they emphasize too much the idea that there is a time to be here and for games to sart.  This implies that someone arriving in the middle of the season is unable to join in the fun for upwards of 6 months.

Another thing that I think would help would be the reintroduction of short-run games.  The most famous in the past was 3CM (3 Card Magic, often called 3CB/3 Card Blind on other forums).   The advantage of games like this is that they're always running.  There are numerous variants (many can be seen on the mtgsalvation forums).  The difficulty, of course, is that these type of games tend to require a host with a lot of time on his or her hands, especially as the number of players increases.  It would be great if we could find other games that could also fill this kind of role.  In the past, I know we've even run games with very little Magic connection, like Magic Mao and even Connect 4.  Of course, staying closer to Magic is more likely to draw in an audience on this forum, but we can allow some flexibility.

Please post any other thoughts that you have!

I agree that getting rid of the seasons would be a good idea.

3CM was fun in the past and I would be glad to see its return. Maybe there would be less work for the host if players compiled their results themselves with the host only doublechecking if there are inconsistencies?

Also I think we should get the Puzzles back into Magic Puzzles, Fun and Games. I know that creating Magic based puzzles is a lot of work, but maybe we could start by reviving the old What Card Am I Honestly Thinking Of thread. It was a simple and fun game without too much work for any involved.

What about an achievement system, like in XBOX 360 games?  We could even steal some of the acheivements from DotP.  Make some of our own.  Maybe instead of complex scoring for season winners, we just release some new acheivements each season?

3CM: A player judged game can certainly work; still needs a GM to resolve disputes, but that is a much easier job.  Plus I imagine we'll be starting with fewer people.  One thing that we do that is pretty different from other places I've seen is the rotating banned list, as well as allowing players to choose the next round's format.

Puzzles are great.  I've personally never enjoyed "guessing" games, but I think you're right that they're a good way to bring people back to the forum on a regular basis.

Achievements: I don't have (nor have I ever used) an XBOX 360, but I think I know what you mean based on online games with achievements.  I'm not quite sure how that would work in this instance...do you have any examples?

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Before I start any sort of advertising (like posting on other forums, or putting MPFG into my sig), I think it would be good to at least line up some people to host some initial games.  Right now, I can comfortably host up to 2 more 6-8 player games.  I think it's good to have a variety of play styles (limited, constructed, wacky, non-Magic, puzzles, etc.).  While I think we can easily do away with seasons (possibly replacing them with some other form of long-term scoring system), it would be good to have a "grand opening" of sorts. 

Jul 21, 2010 -- 1:42AM, Qwyrxian wrote:

3CM: A player judged game can certainly work; still needs a GM to resolve disputes, but that is a much easier job.  Plus I imagine we'll be starting with fewer people.  One thing that we do that is pretty different from other places I've seen is the rotating banned list, as well as allowing players to choose the next round's format.

3CM would be a lovely idea to bring back. We'll have to did up the old thread to find the formats list as I seem to have misplaced the master text file I had though.

Jul 21, 2010 -- 1:42AM, Qwyrxian wrote:

Puzzles are great.  I've personally never enjoyed "guessing" games, but I think you're right that they're a good way to bring people back to the forum on a regular basis.

Achievements: I don't have (nor have I ever used) an XBOX 360, but I think I know what you mean based on online games with achievements.  I'm not quite sure how that would work in this instance...do you have any examples?

I also would like some examples of achievements as I am struggling to come up with many practical ones off the top of my head. In any event this can come later if we use it, although I am partial to the idea.

Jul 21, 2010 -- 1:42AM, Qwyrxian wrote:

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Before I start any sort of advertising (like posting on other forums, or putting MPFG into my sig), I think it would be good to at least line up some people to host some initial games.  Right now, I can comfortably host up to 2 more 6-8 player games.  I think it's good to have a variety of play styles (limited, constructed, wacky, non-Magic, puzzles, etc.).  While I think we can easily do away with seasons (possibly replacing them with some other form of long-term scoring system), it would be good to have a "grand opening" of sorts. 

I think it's pretty clear we're getting rid of the season system, in fact it's gone now, no more need to worry about it, what we need from here (and are getting, thanks guys) are ideas of new scoring systems that can be jumped into at any time and don't run on set schedules. In any event we definately need to get some games going, some people to join said games, and some sort of fun machine where everyone that enters leaves feeling they've had fun.....okay maybe not the fun machine but the other comments still stand.

#1) We may want to steer away from multuplayer games at first, until we get a solid group of active players.  If we don't there's a very good chance they lag into inexistance.

#2) Achievements (examples all based on DotP)

-The Spark (Win a game): 10 points
-Life Preserver (Increase your life total to 30 or more in single player, or 60 or more in Two-Headed Giant/EDH): 10 points
-Magic the Puzzling (Complete a Challenge/Puzzle): 10 points
-Devastator (Deal 20 combat damage to a player in a single turn in a game): 10 points
-Defender of Foriys (Win a Two-Headed Giant game): 10 points
-Duelist (Win 5 games): 15 points
-Puzzling Master(Complete 5 Challenges/Puzzles): 15 points
-Duel Master (Win 10 games): 20 points
-Overkill (Control creatures with a total power of 75 or more): 15 points
-Puzzling Grandmaster (Complete 10 Challenges/Puzzles): 20 points 
-Last One Standing (Win a FFA game): 15 points
-Overflowing Harvest (Put 8 lands onto the battlefield in one turn): 15 points

I'm thinking that we should make one big push to try to get more players.  To do that, we need games ready to be run.  In order to have time to prepare, we could set our "Grand Re-Opening" a while from now, say, September 1 (tentative date).   Can I get an idea of how many people here may be willing to host games/puzzles, and of what type? 

I myself, am willing to host 2 new 6-8 player games (2 player games in a tournament format, I mean, not multiplayer games).  I may possibly (but not certainly) be willing to organize 3CM, with the caveat that the main match checking will be done by the players--my role will be to organize info, keep running scores, collect decks, etc.

Jul 28, 2010 -- 7:17PM, Qwyrxian wrote:

I'm thinking that we should make one big push to try to get more players.  To do that, we need games ready to be run.  In order to have time to prepare, we could set our "Grand Re-Opening" a while from now, say, September 1 (tentative date).   Can I get an idea of how many people here may be willing to host games/puzzles, and of what type? 

I myself, am willing to host 2 new 6-8 player games (2 player games in a tournament format, I mean, not multiplayer games).  I may possibly (but not certainly) be willing to organize 3CM, with the caveat that the main match checking will be done by the players--my role will be to organize info, keep running scores, collect decks, etc.

I'll run one game, maybe a game of Archenemy.

Jul 29, 2010 -- 8:56AM, stinkyjoeterry wrote:

Jul 28, 2010 -- 7:17PM, Qwyrxian wrote:

I'm thinking that we should make one big push to try to get more players.  To do that, we need games ready to be run.  In order to have time to prepare, we could set our "Grand Re-Opening" a while from now, say, September 1 (tentative date).   Can I get an idea of how many people here may be willing to host games/puzzles, and of what type? 

I myself, am willing to host 2 new 6-8 player games (2 player games in a tournament format, I mean, not multiplayer games).  I may possibly (but not certainly) be willing to organize 3CM, with the caveat that the main match checking will be done by the players--my role will be to organize info, keep running scores, collect decks, etc.

I'll run one game, maybe a game of Archenemy.

Correction... EDH Archenemy

How's the revival plans coming?

To be honest, I haven't worked on it much.  My thought was to begin a revival by having a date to start hosting a bunch of games, then find some way to advertisement that start date.  However, so far, we have only you and myself volunteering to host games.  That does not a revival make.  I mean, I suppose we can try to do a rolling start, where we get a few games running, then do advertising, then hopefully some new people can also be convinced to run games...but it seems unlikely.

So, in other words, I've been putting off thinking about it too much because it's depressing and I don't know how we can succeed.    I don't feel like I see a means yet to accomplish people joining....

But maybe the only solution is just to try to start.  In that case, we should probably target, maybe, the second week of September. 

Aug 11, 2010 -- 8:36PM, Qwyrxian wrote:

To be honest, I haven't worked on it much.  My thought was to begin a revival by having a date to start hosting a bunch of games, then find some way to advertisement that start date.  However, so far, we have only you and myself volunteering to host games.  That does not a revival make.  I mean, I suppose we can try to do a rolling start, where we get a few games running, then do advertising, then hopefully some new people can also be convinced to run games...but it seems unlikely.

So, in other words, I've been putting off thinking about it too much because it's depressing and I don't know how we can succeed.    I don't feel like I see a means yet to accomplish people joining....

But maybe the only solution is just to try to start.  In that case, we should probably target, maybe, the second week of September. 

I know one thing that kind of killed my participation was that I found myself swamped and unable to keep up, so maybe starting slowly would be the best approach.  Let's get enough people to get one big game going and as interest increases we can add more games.

Maybe there should be a game-request thread or something stickied where people can sit in a queue of some sort and we can start games on demand.

I have a game idea I've been thinking of trying...It's a very long experience, and I might want one other person to help me with their opinions, but I think it'll be an interesting sort of contest.

Aug 25, 2010 -- 12:35PM, tgva8889 wrote:

I have a game idea I've been thinking of trying...It's a very long experience, and I might want one other person to help me with their opinions, but I think it'll be an interesting sort of contest.

I'd be happy to provide suggestions; you can pm me or post here (depending on whether or not the info needs to be secret).

I'm going to (try to) run 2 games; one will be a relatively straightforward sealed variant, something related to M11, some type of small but simple spin, something that can get started as soon as there are enough people.  I'l also make a second game, either constructed or pre-constructed, with some unusual rules; I have no idea what, yet, but i'll take a look through game variants in the next few days.  I'm still considering running 3CM with each player responsible for running their own matches; I'll decide that in the next few days.

I think the best thing to do, then, is, once we're ready, get the sign-up threads open, but indicate that the game won't start for, say, a few weeks. Then we can work on getting the message out to other parts of the forums, through direct posts, signatures, etc.  I actually don't post all that much on the boards anymore, but some is better than none.  Having the game threads open first seems like a good idea because then we can all have direct links any time we mention them.

I plan on taking deck submissions.  I figure it will be best to have a second judge, rather than just have me judging.

In that case I'm happy to help judge if you like.

I think what I'll run are these:

• M11 Sealed, with the following additional rule: Each player has an ''emblem'' with the following ability: 0: Exile a card that you just drew face down.  Choose a card from your sideboard and add it to your hand.  Play this ability only once each game.
• Standard Constructed, with a deck construction twist: Players submit decks that are legal now (i.e., Alara block, Zendikar block, M10, M11).  The first game that players start after the format changes (October 19?  something like that), players must change their deck so that it is legal in the new format (i.e., Zendikar block, M11, Scars of Mirrodin).

Do those look okay, interesting, and do-able?  I'd run both as single or double elimination, max 8 players each.

Any judging help would be appreciated.  I'll let you know once I've got most of the ideas set out so you can develop your own judging criteria.

The Standard seems just really aggravating, unless there's a limit to the cards you can change or something.  I mean, playing Mythic until I can't then playing something else really good seems really annoying.  And if someone plays a deck with a central card that rotates and isn't replaced with something else, their deck might get screwed, and it might not even be something super-competetive, either.  Maybe if there's, like, a limit to the cards you can have that will rotate or something?  Not sure how to not make that annoying to play.  You'll probably find some interested, though.

The Sealed seems cool, although I'm not sure how interesting or special that particular bonus will be.  I do like it a lot more than the Standard, though.

I'm still on for EDH Archenemy (4 vs. 1), but we still haven't solved the problem of us 3 being the only people that post here.

Aug 30, 2010 -- 12:33AM, tgva8889 wrote:

Any judging help would be appreciated.  I'll let you know once I've got most of the ideas set out so you can develop your own judging criteria.

The Standard seems just really aggravating, unless there's a limit to the cards you can change or something.  I mean, playing Mythic until I can't then playing something else really good seems really annoying.  And if someone plays a deck with a central card that rotates and isn't replaced with something else, their deck might get screwed, and it might not even be something super-competetive, either.  Maybe if there's, like, a limit to the cards you can have that will rotate or something?  Not sure how to not make that annoying to play.  You'll probably find some interested, though.

The Sealed seems cool, although I'm not sure how interesting or special that particular bonus will be.  I do like it a lot more than the Standard, though.

Oh, glad you misunderstood that, because it shows I wasn't clear.  My point is that you may only replace the cards that are no longer legal.  Essentially, you have to build your deck with some thought of the future in mind, knowing you'll have to replace some portion of it.  For example, you could choose to run Mythic, which could basically just transform into Dredge-uh-vine post rotation with small alterations, or you could run Jund, and basically have to have an entirely new deck post-rotation.  It's kind-of like imagining that someone is on a budget, but for some reason can't wait til October to play Standard.  So they invest in a deck now, but try to keep it as post-October as possible to minimize their cost/effort in buying new cards.

Still, I'll see if I can think of something else as an alternative. I'm looking for a hook that makes the game different than normal Standard, but that isn't so wacky that no one joins. 

As to stj's comment, it's certainly true that if we don't get more players, we have either rename the group Qwy/Tgv/Sjt's hangout, or give up.  My thought is that we set up the threads with games first so that way when we start referring peope here, if they come, at least they see something to join.  Other than just direct advertising in a few forums (I'm thinking Magic General, some of the other play-by-post forums, and then specific forums for each game, like the Limited forum for the sealed game).  I'll change over my signature with links, but, like I said, I don't post much anymore, so it won't really bring up the visibility too much.

I'm still here.

I think we really have no other choice than to start with small 2-player games to get people to actually come here.

I'll play in pretty much any limited format, and EDH Archenemy seems fun as well.

I don't see myself hosting any new games, but I'm up for a match of Mindmaster at any time (I love Mindmaster)

EDH Archenemy would be fun, but it would take a while.  And I'm fairly certain we could break the format in half.

I don't post much anywhere else, either, but I could start looking into getting back into other threads if I find I have time.  I am working on some other things that might belong elsewhere.

Aug 30, 2010 -- 8:19PM, tgva8889 wrote:

EDH Archenemy would be fun, but it would take a while.  And I'm fairly certain we could break the format in half.

I don't post much anywhere else, either, but I could start looking into getting back into other threads if I find I have time.  I am working on some other things that might belong elsewhere.

I don't think the players would share their decks with the others before so they can't plan to break it.  Also I would only allow them 20 life each and 40 for the archenemy.

I think we need to make a Roll-Call thread with the list of the upcoming games.

Aug 30, 2010 -- 10:52PM, stinkyjoeterry wrote:

I don't think the players would share their decks with the others before so they can't plan to break it.  Also I would only allow them 20 life each and 40 for the archenemy.

I think we need to make a Roll-Call thread with the list of the upcoming games.

The Archenemy has the easiest time, then, since not only do they have a starting life advantage, but they also get schemes.  Which is a ridiculously huge advantage.

Aug 31, 2010 -- 2:31AM, tgva8889 wrote:

Aug 30, 2010 -- 10:52PM, stinkyjoeterry wrote:

I don't think the players would share their decks with the others before so they can't plan to break it.  Also I would only allow them 20 life each and 40 for the archenemy.

I think we need to make a Roll-Call thread with the list of the upcoming games.

The Archenemy has the easiest time, then, since not only do they have a starting life advantage, but they also get schemes.  Which is a ridiculously huge advantage.

But it is 4 (80 life total) vs. 1 (40 Life total)

They also get, depending on their Schemes:

Extra turns.
Mana Acceleration.
Ridiculous amounts of card draw.
Free opponent's creatures.
The ability to nuke someone's board.

And many, many other very broken things.  Getting that every one of your turns is pretty big in EDH.  Even with a bunch of other players trying to kill you together, it will take a great deal of effort on their side to pose a threat.

EDH is a format that's all about taking down many opponents.  In the average game, it's still 80 life total vs. 40 life total, because you usually play with at least 3 people.  The end result is generally that one player does something really huge and everyone dies.  It becomes a lot easier to be that one player if you've got Schemes.

It's worth a shot.  I just feel like it could be easily broken, is all.  I think we should try it anyways.  I'm just letting you know, there will probably be people who come in with the intent to break it.

Aug 31, 2010 -- 11:14PM, tgva8889 wrote:

They also get, depending on their Schemes:

Extra turns.
Mana Acceleration.
Ridiculous amounts of card draw.
Free opponent's creatures.
The ability to nuke someone's board.

And many, many other very broken things.  Getting that every one of your turns is pretty big in EDH.  Even with a bunch of other players trying to kill you together, it will take a great deal of effort on their side to pose a threat.

EDH is a format that's all about taking down many opponents.  In the average game, it's still 80 life total vs. 40 life total, because you usually play with at least 3 people.  The end result is generally that one player does something really huge and everyone dies.  It becomes a lot easier to be that one player if you've got Schemes.

It's worth a shot.  I just feel like it could be easily broken, is all.  I think we should try it anyways.  I'm just letting you know, there will probably be people who come in with the intent to break it.

So you are saying the archenemy has too big of an advantage?  Then we give everyone 40 life.  Would that fix it? or Everyone 40 life and archenemy 60 life?

Life totals don't matter all that nuch.  EDH games that I've experienced end in one big play, not a bunch of smaller ones.  Bigger life totals won't help the Archenemy not set up their silly game-ending combo.  And you can always kill with Generals, so it doesn't make much difference.

Well, I think I'm going to start a game.  I don't see a "Grand Re-Opening" materializing anytime soon, so let's at least get some foot traffic.

Hey guys, if you're still looking to reinvigorate this place I've got some ideas. Promotional games have been the saving grace for my group, Paranoia Paradise. Currently, we're seeing a surge like I've not seen even during the Gleemax era. Really, the problem is the fact that our groups have lost their visibility, thus no one even knows we exist. Promos are definitely the key to grabbing new blood. I can definitely see you guys running some promo games like 3CM in Magic General. I think the best promos would be the short/simple puzzle/games that used to be a staple of MPFG. Feel free to run any promos you wish in the Posting Games section of Paranoia Paradise, its a special place we've set aside for non mafia games sort of like the old Rec Room forum. I have a feeling you'd get a few converts at least. YMtC would also be a good place to grab some new players if you could like of an appropriate game. I've always felt MPFG, YMtC, Px2, & the old Rec Room were connected by a core group of posters, and it saddens me to this place suffer when Px2, a child of MPFG, is doing so well.

Nov 16, 2010 -- 7:39PM, Zipperflesh wrote:

Hey guys, if you're still looking to reinvigorate this place I've got some ideas. Promotional games have been the saving grace for my group, Paranoia Paradise. Currently, we're seeing a surge like I've not seen even during the Gleemax era. Really, the problem is the fact that our groups have lost their visibility, thus no one even knows we exist. Promos are definitely the key to grabbing new blood. I can definitely see you guys running some promo games like 3CM in Magic General. I think the best promos would be the short/simple puzzle/games that used to be a staple of MPFG. Feel free to run any promos you wish in the Posting Games section of Paranoia Paradise, its a special place we've set aside for non mafia games sort of like the old Rec Room forum. I have a feeling you'd get a few converts at least. YMtC would also be a good place to grab some new players if you could like of an appropriate game. I've always felt MPFG, YMtC, Px2, & the old Rec Room were connected by a core group of posters, and it saddens me to this place suffer when Px2, a child of MPFG, is doing so well.

I know I said I'd try...but somewhere over the past few months my enthusiasm for MPFG has run out.  Perhaps there are things we could do to bring people in, but it would be a temporary fix at best, as we will never have permanent visibility.  Furthermore, in my personal case, I am now spending a ridiculous amount of time on other internet work (Wikipedia, to be precise), such that I'm no longer as compelled to be here all the time.  Plus, I'm sure part of it has to do with me not wanting to only host games, rather than play in them as well....

When I accepted Wolfpack's offer to GM, I did have the intention to try to revive the board, but it over time it felt like it wasn't so much reviving as nearly beginning anew.  I think Zipperflesh's approach is a good one, if others would like to try to bring people in.  And maybe if I saw more people around, and hosting games, maybe I'd recapture the spirit myself....

Again, my apologies for losing my zeal and not doing more...

No, I completely understand how you feel. I felt the same way as I watched my group wither and die. Then one day I decided I was going to try to do something to fix it. I have no idea if it will last, but so far it seems to be working.

The secret to being visible is to have a lot of people posting in your games. Every thread that gets bumped shows up on the front page. There is a direct correlation to the number of posts your group sees and the number of people it draws in.