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Jun 23, 2012 -- 8:57PM, Undrhil wrote:

We just ran this mod on Friday and I was playing a Shaman|Warlord character.

From what I understand of the Shaman's Spirit Companion, enemies cannot enter its square.  That is from the power Call Spirit Companion, not a general rule of conjurations.  Also, it is not a creature (but it can be attacked by melee or ranged attacks.)

Spoiler: Show

There is a siege tower in the final combat of this mod which is a huge "creature".  I summoned my spirit companion into a square directly in front of the siege tower, one square up, fully expecting the siege tower to not be able to advance, since enemies cannot enter the square of the spirit companion.  The DM said "No, you aren't breaking this mod that easily" and moved the tower over the spirit companion anyway.

So, my question is: should the siege tower be able to move past my spirit companion like that?  Or would it have to go around the spirit companion?

I don't think that what your DM did is strictly wrong - there are a couple different rules exceptions at work here (although I've found in my personal experience that whenever my response to a situation is "you're not breaking the adventure this easily", I need to take a step back and analyze whether I'm taking a healthy approach to DMing).

I think if faced with the same situation as the DM, I'd split the difference. I would use the crush attack on the spirit; if I did enough damage to destroy the spirit, I'd move through it, and if I didn't do enough damage, I'd stop and try to go around next time I had a move action. That allows the spirit to maintain its presence as a conjured obstacle but still honor the rules exception that allows the spirit to be destroyed with damage (unlike a normal conjuration) and the siege tower's rules exception that allows it to move through enemies.

Jun 24, 2012 -- 10:45AM, Mommy_was_an_Orc wrote:

Jun 24, 2012 -- 10:32AM, JohnduBois wrote:

I think if faced with the same situation as the DM, I'd split the difference. I would use the crush attack on the spirit; if I did enough damage to destroy the spirit, I'd move through it, and if I didn't do enough damage, I'd stop and try to go around next time I had a move action. That allows the spirit to maintain its presence as a conjured obstacle but still honor the rules exception that allows the spirit to be destroyed with damage (unlike a normal conjuration) and the siege tower's rules exception that allows it to move through enemies.

That gets into a worse scenario than the actual one. 4 or 0 move is worse than 3 move.

Are you getting 3 move from the "move around" scenario?

Also, I think it depends on your definition of "worse". I think (from my general philosophy on DMing as a whole) that letting the dice determine which rules quirk (the spirit companion behaving like a creature in many ways but technically being a conjuration vs the siege tower being able to move through creatures) takes precedence is "better" solution that either denying a player a creative solution to the tactical problem or letting a minor action at-will power change the entire landscape of the combat.

But I also think that this is the kind of situation where DME is exceptionally important. You can, as. DM, either closely examine the rules to determine what the rules say "should happen" (and probably still come up with something arguable) or determine on the fly what makes sense and is the most fun for everyone involved. The posters in this thread - and those I know are DMs I would actively seek in as DMs at a convention and players I'd heavily consider playtest input from - have provided a number of possible ways to address the situation, all of which, as the adventure's writing director, I'd consider appropriate ways to handle the situation.