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10 months ago ::
Aug 21, 2012 - 7:00AM
#31
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Date Joined:
Apr 14, 2010
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I'm going to get a T-shirt printed up that reads:
"We fought a dragon and all I got to do is make skill checks."
This made me laugh 
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10 months ago ::
Aug 21, 2012 - 7:17AM
#32
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Date Joined:
Aug 10, 2007
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Mine reads: "I fought some PCs and all I did was lie still while they coup-de-grace'd me."
On a more constructive note, if you don't like alternative challenges during combat, you can ask your DM to modify the encounter to fit your play style. For example, remove the obelisks and give the dragon an extra set of actions each round and triple his hit points - if that would make the encounter appropriately challenging in a fun way for your group's play style.
Dan Anderson
@EpicUthrac
Living Forgotten Realms Calimshan Writing Director
Living Forgotten Realms Epic Writing Director
Meet me at TotalConfusion:
http://www.totalcon.com/RolePlaying.html
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10 months ago ::
Aug 21, 2012 - 8:25AM
#33
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The current trend of "combat nearly impossible unless skill challenge performed" combat&skill challenges means that frequently I'm stuck doing the skill challenge, even if I don't want to.
I can understand that, especially since several of my LFR PCs are "skill monkeys". I do think that "combat with a skill challenge baked in" changes things up (for a while, there were a ton of "combats with really punitive terrain effects"), but recent LFR adventures have used the combat+skill challenge idea an awful lot (when I was at Origins, it seemed like every adventure had at least one). I don't want to see the idea overused to the point where it becomes the norm, or something that players dread.
"Of course [Richard] has a knife. He always has a knife. We all have knives. It's 1183, and we're barbarians!" - Eleanor of Aquitaine, "The Lion in Winter"
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10 months ago ::
Aug 21, 2012 - 9:34AM
#34
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Date Joined:
Nov 23, 2003
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Mine reads: "I fought some PCs and all I did was lie still while they coup-de-grace'd me."
That could work. I might buy both of those... 
Realized I never said anything about the parts I liked... Good difficulty on most of the riddles. (A nitpick on one that the clear-to-me answer was "fish", which wasn't the desired answer. And the last one has many words that fit as well as others... And I know that when I run it, I'll be massively toning down the "screw it, I'll just act while dazed" damage in the interests of keeping play going). I thought the first combat played really well.
I really liked the setup of the 2nd combat... but I was the hyber-mobile skill monkey in it, so maybe that doesn't count. (Why Yes, I Will be completely hidden when I teleport over to the McGuffin, pick it up, and teleport away like a little girl). I LIKE it when a specialized stunt/trick/etc can skip the meat of the occassional encounter. I think that's a good thing... and wish it happened a little more often. The really-really "fluffy bunny" damage made perfect story-sense to me, so didn't bug me in the least. The combat seemed to flow well for the others too.
In the third combat, my reaction at the time had nothing to do with the setup that's been talked about here, and more to do with the feeling that the BBEG's damage numbers were just too low. As a solo, it's expected to replace 4 monters output across the round... and I don't think it did that. Maybe the minor-action attack should structured differently (more damage, more immediate effect instead of a sustaining effect?) But I really just wanted to boost the big AoE blast... and that's one I'll have to think about when I prep this to run it.
Overall: good mod. One of the better Kick-down-the-door-and-take-the-stuff mods out there.
"Nice assumptions. Completely wrong assumptions, but by jove if being incorrect stopped people from making idiotic statements, we wouldn't have modern internet subculture." Kerrus
Practical gameplay runs by neither RAW or RAI, but rather "A Compromise Between The Gist Of The Rule As I Recall Getting The Impression Of It That One Time I Read It And What Jerry Says He Remembers, Whatever, We'll Look It Up Later If Any Of Us Still Give A Damn." Erachima
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10 months ago ::
Aug 21, 2012 - 11:41AM
#35
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Mine reads: "I fought some PCs and all I did was lie still while they coup-de-grace'd me."
Now now, only the first attack after the Knockout is a coup de grace. (After that the monster is no longer unconscious, thus cannot be CdG'd.)
But I hear what you're saying.
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10 months ago ::
Aug 21, 2012 - 11:48AM
#36
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- Senior Volunteer Community Lead
Date Joined:
Aug 19, 2007
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He might be referring to the "I sleep you, with a -15 to your save" trick. Or the battlemind unconscious. Or...
Solos have a tough time not being status effected into the floor.
Keith Richmond
Living Forgotten Realms Epic Writing Director
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10 months ago ::
Aug 22, 2012 - 7:22AM
#37
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Date Joined:
Aug 10, 2007
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Of course, in the old days, dragons had their action denial built right in. Can you imagine if the dragon was modeled after Xenro? 
Dan Anderson
@EpicUthrac
Living Forgotten Realms Calimshan Writing Director
Living Forgotten Realms Epic Writing Director
Meet me at TotalConfusion:
http://www.totalcon.com/RolePlaying.html
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10 months ago ::
Aug 22, 2012 - 7:59AM
#38
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- Senior Volunteer Community Lead
Date Joined:
Aug 19, 2007
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Yeah, it's an interesting design standard we've got... we're removing stuns, dominates, unconsciouses and stuff away so folks get to play, but then we're making them make skill checks Glancing at it, I do think the action economy is a little rude on this one. Move up to obelisk, fail check, get pushed away and take damage. Standard Easy, Minor Hard, and a restriction you can only get one success per round (but no punitive damage/movement), and I suspect it would have eased past some of the complaints. Though it, obviously enough, would have also been easier More and more, I think if we expect a group to make standard actions, we should use the Easy difficulty, though. Wasting standard actions sucks.
Keith Richmond
Living Forgotten Realms Epic Writing Director
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10 months ago ::
Aug 22, 2012 - 9:37AM
#39
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I think if we expect a group to make standard actions, we should use the Easy difficulty, though. Wasting standard actions sucks.
Hear, hear!
Another mechanic I have used is to provide a scaling bonus to the PC for each unsuccessful check he makes. Kind of like an automatic "Aid Another" so that the PC eventually must succeed on the skill check.
Round1 - PC makes check at his raw skill bonus, fails
Round2 - PC makes check at +2, fails
Round3 - PC makes check at +4, fails
etc.
Or use +1, +2, +3... or +4, +8, +12... whatever fits your vision of how long you want the PC to spend making skill checks.
The bonuses represent the PC ascending the learning curve for "interact with dragon's obelisks" or whatever task the skill check represents.
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10 months ago ::
Aug 22, 2012 - 11:08AM
#40
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- Senior Volunteer Community Lead
Date Joined:
Aug 19, 2007
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One I'm about to use, so I'm still toying with, for a challenge that requires a lot of checks:
Minor Action
Initial: Easy
After 1 Success: Moderate
After 2 Successes: Hard
After 3+ Successes: Either impossible, or keep increasing DC by 10 each time
That way you end up spreading the love, and it's not one person making 8 of 12 checks. Or worse.
Keith Richmond
Living Forgotten Realms Epic Writing Director
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