There is no LFR EPIC adventure planned for GenCon this year.
We are anticipating release of at least 2 more LFR EPIC adventures in 2012, likely with one in the summer.
There is no LFR EPIC adventure planned for GenCon this year.We are anticipating release of at least 2 more LFR EPIC adventures in 2012, likely with one in the summer.
Is there any word on whether there will be an EPIC event available at GenCon this year?
Gen Con is aimed at more entry players, so epic just isn't really a desired event there (nor at Origins, though it'd be _slightly_ easier there perhaps).
Gen Con is aimed at more entry players, so epic just isn't really a desired event there (nor at Origins, though it'd be _slightly_ easier there perhaps).
Gen Con is aimed at more entry players, so epic just isn't really a desired event there (nor at Origins, though it'd be _slightly_ easier there perhaps).
Desired by whom?
A group of ten of us met pretty much every weekend for 4 months back in 2009 to advance our characters to Paragon tier in time for GenCon that year -- we'd have likely done something similar this past year for 2012 if there was going to be any Epic play at GenCon.
If the organizers don't want the trouble of having to try to staff Epic (and even Paragon) tables in addition to the Heroic tables, that's one thing. But it seems like something of a self-fulfulling prophecy to say 'hey, we don't run any Epic and barely any Paragon, and we don't see any demand for it, so we don't see the need to add any'.
In fairness, there is one Paragon adventure at GenCon2012, and people who are motivated to do so can probably put together more, or even some Epic, during free-play times. Also, offering 'old' Paragon or Epic mods next to 'new' Heroic mods likely does a disservice to the older mods, since odds are if you're going to GenCon with a character of the appropriate level, you may already have played the older mods.
Doesn't make it any less disappointing not to see support for the higher tiers.
-- Pauper
Desired by whom?A group of ten of us met pretty much every weekend for 4 months back in 2009 to advance our characters to Paragon tier in time for GenCon that year -- we'd have likely done something similar this past year for 2012 if there was going
The LFR campaign is a provider; Dave Christ (Baldman Games) is the man running the organized play presence for WotC. Dave has a limited amount of space, tables, and DMs (even if the numbers are large compared to most cons) for the size of the convention & player base. Gencon has a very high percentage of new players and players who only come out once a year, so WotC wants to cater to that demographic at Gencon. DDXP is the con that caters to the hard core, advanced gamer in organized play (what was once called the RPGA). Origins is somewhere in between. Since Dave is our customer, we deliver what he orders. Dave is like the retailer and aims to maximize his business, and every year he does. If you have a complaint about his plan, go to Baldman Games and discuss it with Dave.
Personally I think his choices are very good, even if he does not cater to me.
Keith
The LFR campaign is a provider; Dave Christ (Baldman Games) is the man running the organized play presence for WotC. Dave has a limited amount of space, tables, and DMs (even if the numbers are large compared to most cons) for the size of the convent
Gencon has a very high percentage of new players and players who only come out once a year, so WotC wants to cater to that demographic at Gencon.
My problem is that these two groups are not necessarily the same.
New players? Sure -- GenCon is the big game convention of the year and you're going to get new players. But 'players who only come out once a year' includes me and a good number of the folks in our area who play regularly in our local LFR, at regional cons, and even online. A lot of folks who are told that D&DXP caters to the 'hardcore' organized-play player don't want to give up going to GenCon to go to D&DXP to play the characters we'd rather play, and since we don't live in Indiana and have to consider things like our jobs and our families, we don't really have a chance to do both except in very rare cases.
I don't want to gripe too much, because I'm sure organizing all the LFR at a huge con is a massive challenge (it's a big challenge just to put together the three monthly tables we run locally sometimes), and the Baldman does a good job of it based on the last few GenCons I've attended. I just wish that, instead of a 6/1/0 split between heroic/paragon/epic tier adventures, the distribution was more like 4/2/1 -- still lots of heroic for the newbies, but a better selection of higher-level modules to satisfy the folks who've been around awhile.
Maybe that's been tried and wasn't as successful, I don't know. I only know what I'd like to see.
-- Pauper
My problem is that these two groups are not necessarily the same.New players? Sure -- GenCon is the big game convention of the year and you're going to get new players. But 'players who only come out once a year' includes me and a good number of the
I'll also note that offering an EPIC adventure ties up that DM with one adventure (and one table) for an entire day (since all EPICs are three-rounders). ISTR that Dave prefers to have his DMs prepping multiple adventures, and be able to be flexible in what they run from slot to slot. In addition, many of Dave's DMs may not be skilled at (or willing to) run an EPIC adventure.
Plus, an EPIC (unlike a Heroic or Paragon adventure) is written for one particular character level. The organizer has to hope that there's going to be a sufficient number of players who are ready to play that new EPIC (i.e., they've already played the previous EPICs), and that they're free on the day that the EPIC is being run (i.e., no conflicts against other events, even non-LFR events, being run on that day).
Is there some demand for EPIC at GenCon? Well, certainly, as this thread proves. Is there sufficient demand to warrant putting resources there, knowing that those are resouces which don't go elsewhere? That, I can't answer, though it wouldn't surprise me if the answer is "no".
I'll also note that offering an EPIC adventure ties up that DM with one adventure (and one table) for an entire day (since all EPICs are three-rounders). ISTR that Dave prefers to have his DMs prepping multiple adventures, and be able to be flexibl
Is there any word on whether there will be an EPIC event available at GenCon this year?
Why would you want ot play EPIC at GenCon? When I think of all of the "bad judges" and "bad tables" I have endured at conventions, I can't imagine risking such as experience for 12 hours of straight play. That's just asking for a customer service nightmare!
So, here's what you do. Get 5 of your friends who want to play EPIC so you have a table of 6 players. Your 1/4 badge cost and tickets for this 3-round event at GenCon is going to run a total of $50 each, so estimate $300 for your table.
Would the best local DM your know run an EPIC adventure for your group for $300? I bet they'd do it for a lot less . . .
For a really great experience, you could contact the author (or the greatest convention DM you played with at GenCon). Someone in your group probably has a guest room . . . use that $300 to fly the author out to your location, house him, feed him . . . and be confident that you'll get a great EPIC experience with the person who wrote the adventure and is excited about sharing their work! {Plus, experience in having run the adventure previously.}
Or, you know, show up at the convention and risk get seated with a player who's never heard of LFR but bought a ticket because the adventure sounded interesting, and potentially a DM who got wrangled at the last minute to cover your table, and really didn't prepare well and would rather be doing something else.
>>>>><<<<<
As an aside, I think conventions are great opportunities to meet new people, learn about new playstyles, and interact with the larger community that is D&D. That said, locking a full day into one table with people I play with anyway doesn't feel like a good return on my travel investment. One of the strengths of DDXP is that I get to play with campaign staff, which IMHO is worth the expense!
Why would you want ot play EPIC at GenCon? When I think of all of the "bad judges" and "bad tables" I have endured at conventions, I can't imagine risking such as experience for 12 hours of straight play. That's just asking for a customer service nig
One of the strengths of DDXP is that I get to play with campaign staff, which IMHO is worth the expense!
By "play with campaign staff", are you referring to getting to sit down and game with campaign staff, or having a table full of campaign staff - after Greg said we weren't allowed to attack the kraken anymore - go sit at an empty table to attack the kraken again anyway?
By "play with campaign staff", are you referring to getting to sit down and game with campaign staff, or having a table full of campaign staff - after Greg said we weren't allowed to attack the kraken anymore - go sit at an empty table to attack the
By "play with campaign staff", are you referring to getting to sit down and game with campaign staff, or having a table full of campaign staff - after Greg said we weren't allowed to attack the kraken anymore - go sit at an empty table to attack the kraken again anyway?
Plus, an EPIC (unlike a Heroic or Paragon adventure) is written for one particular character level. The organizer has to hope that there's going to be a sufficient number of players who are ready to play that new EPIC (i.e., they've already played the previous EPICs), and that they're free on the day that the EPIC is being run (i.e., no conflicts against other events, even non-LFR events, being run on that day).
In theory, the first part of this objection shouldn't really be an issue, since the Epic Campaign rules specifically allow a character to advance an existing Epic character to whatever level the adventure is playing at, then 'de-advance' afterward to play earlier Epic adventures. If a new Epic adventure were to be released at GenCon, I'd expect that any LFR player with an Epic character would at least consider playing it, given that rule. I'm guessing the rule exists specifically to enable convention play, and I wonder if most people prefer to play the Epic modules in sequence, which would work against that.
As for the second part of the objection, I wonder how many folks are planning to sign up to play only one or two of the three WATE modules being released at GenCon -- playing the entire series to gain the major quest award entails exactly the same length of commitment as an Epic module, albeit with the option to play the three rounds in different timeslots rather than having to sign up for three 'connected' slots to make sure you have the same characters and DM for the entire run.
From an organizer perspective, I could see where three one-round modules with a common thread would be easier to schedule than a single three-round module.
-- Pauper
In theory, the first part of this objection shouldn't really be an issue, since the Epic Campaign rules specifically allow a character to advance an existing Epic character to whatever level the adventure is playing at, then 'de-advance' afterward to
As I understand it, the biggest issue is with judges. Judges have to drop out all the time for one reason or another. At DDXP where there are limited other things to do, you can sometimes find a DM to fill in. That is much harder to do at Gen Con where people to be scheduled for nearly ever slot and there is a lot less flexibility.
As I understand it, the biggest issue is with judges. Judges have to drop out all the time for one reason or another. At DDXP where there are limited other things to do, you can sometimes find a DM to fill in. That is much harder to do at Gen Con whe
I think it is extremely wise to avoid Epic play at GenCon.
One of the key drivers for starting higher level characters was so people with tickets can play in any GenCon game.
Do we really want people building level 21+ characters?
I think it is extremely wise to avoid Epic play at GenCon.One of the key drivers for starting higher level characterswas so people with tickets can play in any GenCon game.Do we really want people building level 21+ characters?
