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3 months ago ::
Feb 19, 2013 - 9:21AM
#1
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Date Joined:
Jan 21, 2013
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Hello everoyne, as many sensible people now know, Wizards are bad. Wizards at low level are basically useless in a party. Low level damage, have to long rest after basically every single encounter to be useful, die very easily, and lacking anything to do when their spells are down. My suggestions:
- Include an intelligence modifier to cantrips. Maybe doubling at a certain level (I'm thinking level 4 would be a fair and balanced level.)
- Vastly increase the amount of low level spells a wizard can cast. (By level 4 wizards should be able to cast a level 1 spell every round of combat almost.)
- Make cantrips stronger without making low level spells obsolete.
Alternatively:
- Get rid of the current spellcasting system.
Moderated by
Dragonette
on Feb 20, 2013 - 08:49AM
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3 months ago ::
Feb 19, 2013 - 9:33AM
#2
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Date Joined:
Nov 21, 2012
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All they need is more spell slots. Cantrips would be too powerful with an ability mod. They should have to rely on their actual spells to deal more damage.
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3 months ago ::
Feb 19, 2013 - 9:37AM
#3
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Date Joined:
Jan 21, 2013
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All they need is more spell slots. Cantrips would be too powerful with an ability mod. They should have to rely on their actual spells to deal more damage.
In this case, I would recommend giving them some sort of magical damage dice so that their damage is on par with a fighter or barbarians.
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3 months ago ::
Feb 19, 2013 - 9:50AM
#4
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Date Joined:
May 27, 2012
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I would recommend a damage increase to their spells, until they do as much damage as the fighter's basic attack for that level. So, for example, a fireball should deal damage equal to a level 5 fighter using a greatsword + Martial Damage Dice; while meteor swarm would deal damage equal to a level 17 fighter using a greatsword + Martial Damage Dice. Let the ability to hit multiple targets balance out the once-per-day limitation, so the wizard remains the best at dealing with groups but isn't strictly inferior (merely endurance-limited) against a single target.
Then, wizard at-will damage should be bumped up to about 80% of fighter at-will damage. You could just improve cantrip damage, though personally I am a fan of giving them +Martial Damage and letting them go to town with a staff or darts.
The metagame is not the game.
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3 months ago ::
Feb 19, 2013 - 10:56AM
#5
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Date Joined:
May 12, 2009
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A Wizard should NOT deal as much damage as a melee fighter, the biggest difference being that melee comes with the innate risk of being in the front lines, taking all the damage Wizards at will damage should be around slightly less than what a ranged fighter or ranged rogue can output, as they carry the same reduced risks as you do Next Wizard at will damage should be LESS then them, because their primary task should be AoE damage and utility from using powerful limited usage spells, and they are still the kings of AoE damage The problem is not exactly that wizards aren't hitting hard enough, its that melee damage is too high at the moment
Moderated by
Dragonette
on Feb 20, 2013 - 08:49AM
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3 months ago ::
Feb 19, 2013 - 12:15PM
#6
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Date Joined:
Jan 28, 2013
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A Wizard should NOT deal as much damage as a melee fighter, the biggest difference being that melee comes with the innate risk of being in the front lines, taking all the damage
Wizards at will damage should be around slightly less than what a ranged fighter or ranged rogue can output, as they carry the same reduced risks as you do
Next Wizard at will damage should be LESS then them, because their primary task should be AoE damage and utility from using powerful limited usage spells, and they are still the kings of AoE damage
The problem is not exactly that wizards aren't hitting hard enough, its that melee damage is too high at the moment
+1 to all of this.
Moderated by
Dragonette
on Feb 20, 2013 - 08:50AM
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3 months ago ::
Feb 19, 2013 - 12:32PM
#7
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Date Joined:
Sep 20, 2004
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A Wizard should NOT deal as much damage as a melee fighter, the biggest difference being that melee comes with the innate risk of being in the front lines, taking all the damage
Wizards at will damage should be around slightly less than what a ranged fighter or ranged rogue can output, as they carry the same reduced risks as you do
Next Wizard at will damage should be LESS then them, because their primary task should be AoE damage and utility from using powerful limited usage spells, and they are still the kings of AoE damage
The problem is not exactly that wizards aren't hitting hard enough, its that melee damage is too high at the moment
+1. Before they do anything to wizards we need to see what the martial classes look like after the next packet. Then we can start comparing power. Right now, martial classes are scheduled for some very major changes. MDD will become WDD. The overall damage dealt by martial classes will be nerfed. Meanwhile, the entire system of powers used by fighter`s is about to change. Considering the very valid points raised by the post I just quoted, once we see those changes take effect wizard`s might not need any buffs.
Moderated by
Dragonette
on Feb 20, 2013 - 08:50AM
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3 months ago ::
Feb 19, 2013 - 12:53PM
#8
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Date Joined:
Nov 21, 2012
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A Wizard should NOT deal as much damage as a melee fighter, the biggest difference being that melee comes with the innate risk of being in the front lines, taking all the damage
Wizards at will damage should be around slightly less than what a ranged fighter or ranged rogue can output, as they carry the same reduced risks as you do
Next Wizard at will damage should be LESS then them, because their primary task should be AoE damage and utility from using powerful limited usage spells, and they are still the kings of AoE damage
The problem is not exactly that wizards aren't hitting hard enough, its that melee damage is too high at the moment
+1. Before they do anything to wizards we need to see what the martial classes look like after the next packet. Then we can start comparing power. Right now, martial classes are scheduled for some very major changes. MDD will become WDD. The overall damage dealt by martial classes will be nerfed. Meanwhile, the entire system of powers used by fighter`s is about to change. Considering the very valid points raised by the post I just quoted, once we see those changes take effect wizard`s might not need any buffs.
Agreed. I'd rather see the warriors' power lowered than the casters' raised, and that might just be what we get when the next packet comes out two years from now.
Moderated by
Dragonette
on Feb 20, 2013 - 08:51AM
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3 months ago ::
Feb 19, 2013 - 1:07PM
#9
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Date Joined:
Feb 15, 2013
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I have to admit, I am surprised that they are clinging to, what is essentially the 3.0 spellcasting system.
D&DN seems to be using 3.X as its springboard, but there is a great opportunity here to really retool the way spells are cast.
The "spells per day" economy is okay, but it isn't flexible and it comes with all of the same old problems. Couple that with spells that scale less than ever, and you will end up with a lot of useless spell slots by the time you hit lvl 9 spells.
Some other resource used to manage spell casting would be really welcome in my view... and then the tactical management of that resource (whether it refreshed on a per encounter basis or after short or even long rests) could govern all of the damage scaling issues. Class features could add daily boosts, metamagic effects, etc..
The power scaling of magic has regularly come up as a point of concern across all editions of D&D. If you are giving physical classes a resource like MDD, why not extend that same courtesy to casters? It doesn't need to be a dice pool exactly, but something dynamic and easily quantifiable.
The strategic and tactical ramifications could be a wonderful thing to play with, and its not like a spellcasting resource is a stretch. I would also love to see ways to push that resource even further, draining the very health of the caster....
Just using nerfed versions of 3.0 spells that don't scale..... is not very appealing. And furthermore, for any Wizard fans, there is nothing being offered by D&D Next at this point in time.
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3 months ago ::
Feb 19, 2013 - 1:22PM
#10
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Date Joined:
Jan 29, 2013
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Currently, a wizard's spells are essentially a customizable list of once-per-day abilities. Why not change this up a bit?
I could see an alternative approach that keeps spell selection the same, but gradually changes spells from once-per-day to once-per-encounter, and eventually to at-will like a cantrip. As an example, your highest two spell levels accessable could operate as once-per-day abilities, the next two spell levels accessable could operate once-per-encounter, while any spell levels below would function like a cantrip.
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