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So, I'm interested in making some sort of melee ninja-type character.  Basically I want a Dex monkey with high Stealth and high DPR.

I'm not sure which to go with: Rogue or Thief.  Both have ways to Stealth with just cover/concealment.

Which is easier to do permastealth with?  I'd like to be able to use the tactic of being stealthed, darting in for the attack (gaining CA because of Stealth), then moving away to stealth again and do it all again next turn.

You realize that permastealth encourages your DM to focus fire (generally a Bad Thing), right?

I do.  I've had that conversation many times with people on the forums.  My builds are normally more thought processes or themed builds.  Most of them never see the light of day.

I was rewatching Batman Begins the other day and was inspired to make a melee Stealth build.  I've made plenty of ranged perma-stealth builds, but never a melee one.

For what it's worth, the Master Thief PP for the Thief class is the only way to get true perma-stealth, remaining hidden even when attacking. So if you want the enemy to NEVER know where you are, then that would be the way to go. Otherwise you have to rely on things that let you move as a separate action after you attack so you can re-hide, but even then the enemy will know the square you became hidden in unless you can move again once hidden...

Yeah, that's how I feel as well.

I'd be ok with the enemy still "knowing" what square I was in.  Our DM doesn't usually waste an enemies turn by trying to attack stealth builds, even if they technically know the last square it was in.  After all, if you were a rational enemy, would you want to risk wasting a turn to make an attack against somewhere that you think an enemy was in when you could attack an enemy you can see?

So, if a Rogue could reliably stealth after attack, I'd be ok with it.  That would still mean always using an attack with movement built in though.

Just curious:  has anyone ever looked into a Rogue build that uses a Khopesh, using Versatile Duelist?  It seems like it could be a decent build to combine both heavy blade and axe support, but maybe not as good as just sticking with a light blade.

Feb 10, 2013 -- 4:59PM, RaizielDragon wrote:

Just curious:  has anyone ever looked into a Rogue build that uses a Khopesh, using Versatile Duelist?  It seems like it could be a decent build to combine both heavy blade and axe support, but maybe not as good as just sticking with a light blade.

Seems like an awful lot of investment just to decrease your hit rate by 10%. Versatile Duelist has its obvious use (HBO + Deft Strike + Ghostwalker Style), but what axe support are you refering to that would be relevant here? Note also that VD does not function at all with Thieves (specifically requires Rogue Powers).

Also, I'm gonna favor Cunning Sneak over Thief on this one, because if you're going to make your other party members be focus fired more often, you might as well have a credible nova (aka real encounter and daily powers) to make up for it.

Eladrin hybrid fey warlock executioner assassin?  At paragon levels, there's an eladrin fey warlock feat makes you invisible when you hit your cursed target, and there's an assassin feat lets you make hide check as a free action when you become invisible, then move while hidden and invisible and nobody knows where you are.  Respectable DPR from hybrid warlock and executioner striker features both stacking on Eldritch strike, which can be used with a rapier for assorted light blade shenans.  Ki focus proficiency keeps you up to date on enhancement mods for weapon and implement attacks until you can spare a feat to make light blades implements.  Rogue multiclass can add some useful bits to the pile (surprising charge, 2d6 extra spike damage per encounter, power swap for knockout if you can manage an attack calaber dex - though be warned, the builder doesn't handle power swaps so well on hybrid characters, especially hybrid executioners that traded some of their dailies for poison use, so you might have to use the 'houserule' option to add the power and just leave the slot you were going to trade for it empty).

Out of combat, you can get shadowwalk for a feat and darting shadow and shadow blend as at will utilities for stealth while moving or standing still, and can pick up executioner poisons in place of daily powers to have something interesting to do with all that stealth when you aren't using it to stab enemies in the back with a sword.  Eladrin don't have darkvision naturally, which is something you might want for a stealther, but there is an assassin paragon feat to pick that up as well.

Pixie is a prime race.

High DPR from perma-stealth builds come from getting OA's more then anything else.