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4 months ago ::
Feb 04, 2013 - 8:52PM
#11
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Date Joined:
Nov 18, 2004
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I would agree with reversible spells as well, there's really no reason not to have them other than to cater to people who didn't actually read the description.
It also significantly helps with the limited spell slots thing, and really encourages players to come up with creative solutions to problems by giving them that bundled utility.
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4 months ago ::
Feb 04, 2013 - 9:38PM
#12
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the way to controll the power of these spells is to not change them, you have to memorize either version and who knows if that is the right choice thats what controlls the power.
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4 months ago ::
Feb 04, 2013 - 9:46PM
#13
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Date Joined:
Jun 28, 2006
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the way to controll the power of these spells is to not change them, you have to memorize either version and who knows if that is the right choice thats what controlls the power.
I would prefer if you didn't have to choose when preparing them. Most of these spells are too situational to begin with. How often do you really need stone to flesh? Or transmute mud to rock?
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4 months ago ::
Feb 04, 2013 - 10:07PM
#14
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then make scolls of them once you know the spell. or memorize them when you rest to fix a petrified character
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4 months ago ::
Feb 05, 2013 - 5:06AM
#15
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Date Joined:
Apr 10, 2009
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I don't think it is necessary -as the game stands right now.
After all - when you prepared spells you had to choose the 'flavor' you prepared. So its only real value was that it increased the wizard's flexibility without taking up slots in the number of spells known. Since we have no limit on the number of spells known (at present) it doesn't serve any useful purpose.
Drawbacks include:
If we get limits on spells know, I will revisit this opinion. However, I think that the effect of allowing spells to exist in higher level spell slots already opens up space in the 'known spells list' and thus this change isn't necessary.
But it depends on where they set the limits, if they set limits. If they go with something as low as my preference (either IntMod per level or Twice Preparation Slots) - then, yeah, I"ll probably be in favor of reverseable spells. But if they go with values two or three times higher than that (as many have suggested) - then, no - I don't think they need this feature.
Regardless - what I do think makes a better rule is something like the following: You acknowledge that there is a relationship between certain spells. You give the players a chance to try to bring about the opposite effect with a very difficult arcana check (with, at best, nothing happening if they fail). Thus if they really need the opposite effect from the spell, they can try to alter their magic on the fly - but it is not a 'typical use' of the spell. In fact - I would suggest that this not even require exact opposites - but that magic in general can be adapted on the fly with difficult or higher arcana checks.
Carl
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4 months ago ::
Feb 05, 2013 - 5:12AM
#16
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Date Joined:
Jun 22, 2010
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All these scenarios could be addressed by have a mechanic to cancel spells based on what the wizard has memorized or is in their spellbook. It would be based on a contest of skills including based on the casters level and/or ability score, or would be automatic if it is the caster's own spell. The benefit of a memorized spell is you can do it immediately, while doing it from the spell book would be a ritual affect.
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4 months ago ::
Feb 05, 2013 - 6:25AM
#17
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Date Joined:
Jan 10, 2012
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I would agree with reversible spells as well, there's really no reason not to have them other than to cater to people who didn't actually read the description.
It also significantly helps with the limited spell slots thing, and really encourages players to come up with creative solutions to problems by giving them that bundled utility.
If I recal in AD&D you had to memorize it in reverse.
Reversible spells saves trees.
There is no point in wasting space in the PHB with spells like Light/Darkness, Knock/Lock, etc.
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4 months ago ::
Feb 05, 2013 - 7:14AM
#18
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+1 to reversable spells.
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my builds
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F-111 Interdictor Long (200+ squares) distance ally teleporter. With some warlord stuff. Broken in a plot way, not a power way.
Thought Switch Higher level build that grants upto 14 attacks on turn 1. If your allies play along, it's broken.
Elven Critters Crit op with crit generation. 5 of these will end anything. Broken.
King Fisher Does an excellent job at keeping an enemy disabled in a few ways. Strong.
Boominator Fun catch-22 booming blade build with either strong or completely broken damage depending on your reading.
Very Distracting Warlock Lot's of dazing and major penalties to hit. Overpowered.
Pocket Protector Pixie Stealth Knight. Maximizing the defender's aura by being in an ally's/enemy's square.
Yakuza NinjIntimiAdin: Perma-stealth Striker that offers a little protection for ally's, and can intimidate bloodied enemies. Very Strong.
Chargeburgler with cheese Ranged attacks at the end of a charge along with perma-stealth. Solid, could be overpowered if tweaked.
Void Defender Defends giving a penalty to hit anyone but him, then removing himself from play. Can get somewhat broken in epic.
Scry and Die Attacking from around corners, while staying hidden. Moderate to broken, depending on the situation.
Skimisher Fly in, attack, and fly away. Also prevents enemies from coming close. Moderate to Broken depending on the enemy, but shouldn't make the game un-fun, as the rest of your team is at risk, and you have enough weaknesses.
Indestructible Simply won't die, even if you sleep though combat.
Sir Robin (Bravely Charge Away) He automatically slows and pushes an enemy (5 squares), while charging away. Hard to rate it's power level, since it's terrain dependent.
Death's Gatekeeper A fun twist on a healic, making your party "unkillable". Overpowered to Broken, but shouldn't actually make the game un-fun, just TPK proof.
Death's Gatekeeper mk2, (Stealth Edition) Make your party "unkillable", and you hidden, while doing solid damage. Stronger then the above, but also easier for a DM to shut down. Broken, until your DM get's enough of it.
Domination and Death Dominate everything then kill them quickly. Only works @ 30, but is broken multiple ways.
Battlemind Mc Prone-Daze Protecting your allies by keeping enemies away. Quite powerful.
The Retaliator Getting hit deals more damage to the enemy then you receive yourself, and you can take plenty of hits. Heavy item dependency, Broken.
Dead Kobold Transit Teleports 98 squares a turn, and can bring someone along for the ride. Not fully built, so i can't judge the power
Psilent Guardian Protect your allies, while being invisible. Overpowered, possibly broken
Unnamed Avenger|Runepriest/Hammer of Vengance Do lot's of damage while boosting your teams. Strong to slightly overpowered.
Charedent BarrageA charging ardent. Fine in a normal team, overpowered if there are 2 together, and easily broken in teams of 5.
Super Knight A tough, sticky, high damage knight. Strong.
Super Duper Knight Basically the same as super knight, only far more broken.
Mora, the unkillable avenger Solid damage, while being neigh indestuctable. Overpowered, but not broken.
Swordburst Maximus At-Will Close Burst 3 that slide and prones. Protects allies with off actions. Strong, possibly over powered with the right party.
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