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4 months ago ::
Jan 19, 2013 - 9:29AM
#11
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A Ranger with the ability to not be surprised can easily allow the entire party to not be surprised.
A good way to handle it would be to allow the "surprise round" to consist of the enemies moving up and becoming visible to the no-longer-surprised PCs.
This eliminates the need for a surprise round and still allows the PCs to act normally on their turn with enemies in-sight.
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4 months ago ::
Jan 19, 2013 - 2:32PM
#12
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Date Joined:
Apr 15, 2007
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Alternately, you can do what I did, and remove surprise from the game. I kept noticing a trend: if players get a surprise round (which is rare), most of the time, all they tend to do is move.
If monsters get a surprise round (which is much more common), they always seem to get a free hit in there. There are issues with how combats start, often, encounters will begin with the monsters in optimal range to attack on their turn, and the party stuck in a 3 x 3 area.
Which just isn't realistic- initiative should be rolled the minute either side sees a threat, not "you get to the perfect spot in the area for the entire party to get attacked, but nowhere near the monsters".
Which means that a character roll init the instant he comes within line of sight to an enemy. And vice versa, since the game pretty much assumes you can identify an enemy on sight.
It doesn't help that the actual system to determine surprise, using passive perception, is almost never used in actual games (a lot of published adventures are written as if the author doesn't even know there ARE rules to determine surprise), which is mainly the reason players jump on Alertness or other anti-surprise abilities in the first place.
"You can always judge a man by the quality of his enemies." -The Doctor, Remembrance of the Daleks
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4 months ago ::
Jan 19, 2013 - 4:57PM
#13
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Date Joined:
Aug 15, 2011
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BTW, you can't ready an action outside of the formal combat turn structure.
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4 months ago ::
Jan 19, 2013 - 6:28PM
#14
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BTW, you can't ready an action outside of the formal combat turn structure.
???
DM: "You hear goblin voices on the other side of the door. They sound like they are getting closer."
Player: "I stand to the side of the door and ready Pinning Strike, which I'll use on the first goblin to walk through the door."
or
Player: "I smash all the barrels, and knock over the shelf, looking for anything valuable."
DM: "The barrels are full of vinegry wine. The shelf had nothing but cheap pottery, now broken all over the floor."
Player: "I kick open the door to the next room."
DM: "The two goblin archers across the room release their arrows."
Seems pretty legit to me...
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4 months ago ::
Jan 19, 2013 - 7:24PM
#15
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Date Joined:
Apr 15, 2007
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In fact, the last season of encounters, the final battle opened with readied actions from the enemies. Which of course, led to our Ranger dying in the middle of his first turn. Solos with "make two basic attacks as a standard action" probably shouldn't be allowed to ready said standard action, that's all I'm saying!
"You can always judge a man by the quality of his enemies." -The Doctor, Remembrance of the Daleks
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4 months ago ::
Jan 19, 2013 - 8:06PM
#16
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Date Joined:
Aug 15, 2011
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BTW, you can't ready an action outside of the formal combat turn structure.
???
DM: "You hear goblin voices on the other side of the door. They sound like they are getting closer."
Player: "I stand to the side of the door and ready Pinning Strike, which I'll use on the first goblin to walk through the door."
or
Player: "I smash all the barrels, and knock over the shelf, looking for anything valuable."
DM: "The barrels are full of vinegry wine. The shelf had nothing but cheap pottery, now broken all over the floor."
Player: "I kick open the door to the next room."
DM: "The two goblin archers across the room release their arrows."
Seems pretty legit to me...
No, that would be the time to call for an initiative check. They don't get to pre-empt the whole combat sequence.
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4 months ago ::
Jan 20, 2013 - 6:42AM
#17
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Initiative checks before combat occurs?
I don't know what the RAW is on these, but to ready an action after combat is started would rarely be useful.
The above examples I gave are perfectly allowable at my table, even if I were running an official LFR game. The danger with readying an action is that once combat starts, you lose your turn if the trigger you state never occurs.
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4 months ago ::
Jan 21, 2013 - 1:28PM
#18
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Date Joined:
Aug 20, 2003
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Initiative checks before combat occurs?
I don't know what the RAW is on these, but to ready an action after combat is started would rarely be useful.
The above examples I gave are perfectly allowable at my table, even if I were running an official LFR game. The danger with readying an action is that once combat starts, you lose your turn if the trigger you state never occurs.
Readying an action in combat definitely has its uses in cases where you don't want to use Delay action (or can't) for one reason or another. If I remember correctly the one case I had was I used a minor action to activate boots of freedom of movement but still failed the save so I was immobilzed, so I readied an action to attack the first enemy the wizard moved into my melee range. Another scenario is for my Shaman to ready to use healing spirit after another ally has moved near his spirit companion to maximize the healing given to the party.
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4 months ago ::
Jan 21, 2013 - 3:21PM
#19
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My understanding about readying actions was that you cannot use a minor and then ready your standard for later. You have to commit all your actions to your one readied action.
We have and will continue to allow readied actions outside of combat, but rarely does any of my players make use of that.
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4 months ago ::
Jan 21, 2013 - 3:25PM
#20
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Date Joined:
Oct 28, 2010
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Your understanding is incorrect, you are conflating ready with delay.
If you delay, your entire turn happens later in the initiative order.
If you ready, you spend your standard action to do it (regardless of which action type the action you ready is, so it still costs you a standard to ready a minor-action power), and later spend your immediate action in response to a trigger of your choice when you readied, to take an action which you decided upon when you readied.
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