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5 months ago ::
Jan 11, 2013 - 9:26AM
#51
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Date Joined:
Aug 28, 2005
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Interesting Poll, but do you mean "Core" as in assumed in all games, or "Core" as in the PHB?
Nobody ever means "core" as in assumed in all games. There has never been and will never be any race ever that is assumed to be in all games.
Umm... yes they have. I have seen it stated in the past that the core classes and races we are testing are assumed to be in almost every game. That's not to say that they can't be removed, such as Cleric in Dark Sun, only that the game design assumes that they are available. That is why they are the ones in the playtest.
Almost =/= All.
So, you answered your own concern. Anybody who has every actually said "all" is simply wrong.
Why, yes, as a matter of fact I am the Unfailing Arbiter of All That Is Good Design (Even More So Than The Actual Developers) TMSpeaking of things that were badly designed, please check out this thread for my Minotaur fix. What have the critics said, you ask? "If any of my players ask to play a Minotaur, I'm definitely offering this as an alternative to the official version." - EmpactWB "If I ever feel like playing a Minotaur I'll know where to look!" - Undrave "WoTC if you are reading this - please take this guy's advice." - Ferol_Debtor_of_Torm "Really full of win. A minotaur that is actually attractive for more than just melee classes." - Cpt_Micha Also, check out my recent GENASI variant! If you've ever wished that your Fire Genasi could actually set stuff on fire, your Water Genasi could actually swim, or your Wind Genasi could at least glide, then look no further. Finally, check out my OPTIONS FOR EVERYONE article, an effort to give unique support to the races that WotC keeps forgetting about. Includes new racial feature options for the Changeling, Deva, Githzerai, Gnoll, Gnome, Goliath, Half-Orc, Kalashtar, Minotaur, Shadar-Kai, Thri-Kreen, Warforged and more!
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5 months ago ::
Jan 11, 2013 - 9:51AM
#52
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Don't forget genetics, though.
Were a dog and a cat to mate, you wouldn't have a half-dog/half-cat born.
:P
even if it looks nothing like a dog or cat it would still be born of a dog and cat so dogcatborn would be perfectly reasonable. Of course petborn or GeneralTsoborn would work as well.
Love 4e? Concerned about its future? join the Old Guard of 4th EditionReality Refracted: Social ContractsD & D: A Documentary Kickstarter ( http://kck.st/SyKNzf) 
Dreaming the Impossible Dream
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Imagine a world where the first-time D&D player rolls stats, picks a race, picks a class, picks an alignment, and buys gear to create a character. Imagine if an experienced player, maybe the person helping our theoretical player learn the ropes, could also make a character by rolling ability scores and picking a race, class, feat, skills, class features, spells or powers, and so on. Those two players used different paths to build characters, but the system design allows them to play at the same table. -Mearl
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5 months ago ::
Jan 11, 2013 - 9:57AM
#53
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Date Joined:
Nov 28, 2009
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I picked the first four, + Dragonborn,Tiefling, Warforged and Shifters. ( though I could do without changlings )
Though I don't often play the first four myself, I think they belong and are great races that new players can connect with.
Dragonborn are my favorite race to play personally.
the next three are just races I like and I see played well, obviously everyone's will have different ideas on that,
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5 months ago ::
Jan 11, 2013 - 10:27AM
#54
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Date Joined:
Aug 13, 2004
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I don't understand the shifter/changeling thing.
Changeling is a classic fantasy archetype, which is not the case of the 1/4 wolf + 3/4 human.
"They are making it clear that when modern design and common sense come into conflict with tradition, tradition wins." - thecasualoblivion
"Vancian isn't broken, you just have to set your game to the wizard's clock!" - Oxybe
"In many ways, making a new edition of D&D is alot like trying to sell a car to the Amish." - Dwarfslayer
"Encounters are the heart of the AD&D game" - PHB AD&D 2nd edition.
"you shouldn't even bother trying to become like me." - Gary Gygax (Elfcrusher confirmed)
"Feel free to claim I said anything you like. How's someone going to call you out on it? Are they going to be all like, 'I know all of the things that Gary said, and that's not one of them?'"
- Gary Gygax
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5 months ago ::
Jan 11, 2013 - 10:36AM
#55
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Date Joined:
May 27, 2012
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Don't forget genetics, though.
Were a dog and a cat to mate, you wouldn't have a half-dog/half-cat born.
It really depends on how genetically similar elves and orcs actually are to humans. After all, if a mastiff was to mate with chihuahua, you would most certainly get a half-mastiff/half-chihuahua.
That's really the sort of thing which could easily vary by setting, though. I mean, in some settings, an orc might be a type of sentient fungus.
The metagame is not the game.
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5 months ago ::
Jan 11, 2013 - 11:01AM
#56
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Date Joined:
Aug 31, 2007
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I would like to have all the racs from all the PHB1 except half-*. I would rather see mechanics to be able to make any race combination.
The idea sounds good, but I have never seen any such rules that really worked in practice. It isn't the conceptual issue of genetics, because given enough magic that isn't really an issue.
The real issue is that a set of rules for half races would be insanely complex, because the half races are not just a 50/50 mix of their parents abilities. Sometimes they get all of a parents abilties, sometimes they get a watered down version, some abilities they don't get at all, and sometimes they have somethign else entirely.
I don't understand the shifter/changeling thing.
Changeling is a classic fantasy archetype, which is not the case of the 1/4 wolf + 3/4 human.
Shifter is the almost werewolf race in the same way a dragonborn lets you sort of play a dragon. They work by taking the concept and watering it down into something that can be fit into the game without breaking the normal game balance.
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5 months ago ::
Jan 11, 2013 - 11:52AM
#57
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I'd love to see a lot of other races as well, particularly merfolk as I love underwater adventures and HATE aquatic elves...
I completely agree. It's actually really surprising to me that they haven't ever to my knowledge created a Merfolk race that was actually playable in non-aquatic campaigns. It's not like it would be hard to. Just give them "fins to feet" as an at-will racial power / spell-like ability / whatever, and you're good, especially saying not all member of the race have it but those that are appropriate to be playable probably do.
I always wanted to play a mermaid but never have because they cannot use land. It would be cool for a breed of mermaids to exist that can use land.
I can really see 2 general ways to accomplish that.
1) their tails can change to legs on land.
2) They are capable of slithering on their tails on land, like the naga from WoW.
Why Mechanics-Alignment Integration is Bad
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so why even play a fighter if you can play the paladin the exact same way behaviorally and get added power to boot. "Paladin" is about accepting better game-enhancing mechanics at the price of more rigid in game behavior.
Really? So it goes something like this?
Fighter: "I want to be a paladin."
NPC: "Really?"
Fighter: "Yes."
NPC: "Very well." Starts reading from a holy book while still in-character "Do you accept having to choose and stick to the lawful good alignment, eventhough neither of us actually knows that it exists or what it is?"
Fighter: "I do."
NPC: "Do you reject good game balance because you accidentally rolled a high Charisma?"
Fighter: "What?"
NPC: "I don't know what it means either."
Fighter: "Oh. Umm, ok I do."
NPC: "In the name of all that is metagamey and broken, accept these better game enhancing mechanics."
Fighter: "These what?"
NPC: "Just get out there and try to fulfill a million different people's notion of good while not violating and part of any of them."
So the system is designed such that every single hit needs to be described to avoid confusion? Here's a scenario. The players are nudists, everybody in the world are nudists, it's not weird, it's totally normal in this land. They are naked and they fight drakes taking damage throughout, but healing up with surges. Later they meet the guy who raised the drakes.
Part 1: I didn't describe any of the hits. What does he see?
Part 2: Lets say I described the drakes as biting the players, yet they healed up. What does he see?
D20 Modern Toon PC Race.
Mecha Pilot's Skill Challenge Emporium.
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5 months ago ::
Jan 11, 2013 - 12:09PM
#58
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Date Joined:
Aug 18, 2007
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Don't forget genetics, though.
Were a dog and a cat to mate, you wouldn't have a half-dog/half-cat born.
It really depends on how genetically similar elves and orcs actually are to humans. After all, if a mastiff was to mate with chihuahua, you would most certainly get a half-mastiff/half-chihuahua.
That's really the sort of thing which could easily vary by setting, though. I mean, in some settings, an orc might be a type of sentient fungus.
Crossing a chihuahua with a mastiff if done in vitro is POSSIBLE but not at all certain, and very often it matters which breed is the sperm and which is the ovum.
Dog genetics are unique because the scale of traits is so vast.
There are no other mammals on the planet that exhibit the varied phenotypes that artificial selection in dogs produce. Farmers would love it if you had a range of phenotypes for cows, but it is just not possible.
It is impossible to look at D&D races and monsters and races and make it square with biology. It won't happen.
If we have Half orcs, and half elves as classically described than essentially the biological differences between orcs, elves, and humans are negligible. There are plenty instances in D&D novels and such of Half Elves being biological parents, and there are examples of Half orcs breeding together. If this is the case and they can breed, then all orcs, humans, and elves are the same species.
Its best to leave the biological principles out of the discussion of D&D Monsters and races. I read many developers attempts at getting the monsters to conform to science and cringe. Creationism is a laughable idea in the real world, but it is the best mechanism to use in a fantasy world with no consistent logic between the monsters and the races.
CAMRA preserves and protects real ale from the homogenization of modern beer production.
D&D Grognards are the CAMRA of D&D!
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5 months ago ::
Jan 11, 2013 - 12:15PM
#59
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Date Joined:
Aug 15, 2011
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Well, we're stuck with humans, elves, dwarves, and halflings. I could live without them, personally, but I know better than to think we can jettison them.
Tieflings and Dragonborn should definitely be in.
If we're going for an even 8, I'd go with Warforged and Shifters.
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5 months ago ::
Jan 11, 2013 - 12:17PM
#60
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Date Joined:
May 27, 2012
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If this is the case and they can breed, then all orcs, humans, and elves are the same species.
Yeah, that's pretty much the take-away. The different "races" are all just races of the same species, and fantasy fiction is just incredibly racist. Not that there's anything wrong with that, in this context.
And since I'm a rocket scientist rather than a biologist, I will stop analyzing at that point.
The metagame is not the game.
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