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5 months ago ::
Jan 06, 2013 - 4:25PM
#1
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Hello, me and some some friends started playing dnd last year. Our DM choosed the standard array to determine our abilities, stating that adventurers should not have a negative score since they experiment a lot of thing, and so, kinda touch all domains. However, the more i read in this forum, the more i think that these scores are overall bad, especially for hybrid characters who need a co-primary. The same goes for some characters who multiclass. By example, a fighter with dex as secondairy wielding hide who a 14 instead of a 16 get less ac, less reflex, less initiation and less effects or dmg on some of his powers. It also affects his acrobatics, stealth and thievery skills if he's trained in these.
Yet, our DM think that having a -1 in an ability score doesn't hurt much. He's he right? Am I simply overestimating the weight of a weaker stat?
Sorry if i did some mistakes. I do not main english.
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5 months ago ::
Jan 06, 2013 - 4:32PM
#2
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Date Joined:
Jun 19, 2004
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Not terrible base, but it is sub-optimal. You could make a nearly-as-powerful character with those stats but it won't be anything that would work well in these forums.
Currently working on making a Dex based defender. Check it out hereSpoiler:
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Also, I've recently done an episode on "Refluffing". You can check that out here
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5 months ago ::
Jan 06, 2013 - 4:38PM
#3
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Date Joined:
Aug 15, 2011
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The best way I can think of to answer that involves two ESPN sports anchors and one of their team catchphrases.
"Is that bad?"
"It's not good."
It's not terrible, but it's not great, either. It's just kind of ... there.
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5 months ago ::
Jan 06, 2013 - 4:49PM
#4
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It's red, meaning there is no reason to ever take it. That just says it's worse, not how bad it is though. In terms of how bad a decision it is, I'd consider it prohibitively terrible for dual-attack-stat hybrids (who basically always are already fighting an uphill battle), merely pointless for everyone else.
Put in simplest terms, a 10 and an 8 are equally worthless, so you always take the 8, if only so you can have a second 13 somewhere else.
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5 months ago ::
Jan 06, 2013 - 5:29PM
#5
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Point your DM to the 22 point buy option, it can produce the same array your DM listed, and many others. This gives players many more options for creating characters.
This is CharOp. We not only assume block-of-tofu monsters, but also block-of-tofu DMs.
One reach cheese'd threatening reach Spiked Chain shuts down any non-teleporting quarterback.
You're already refluffing, what not refluff to something that doesn't suck?
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5 months ago ::
Jan 06, 2013 - 6:34PM
#6
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Date Joined:
Aug 31, 2009
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Our DM choosed the standard array to determine our abilities, stating that adventurers should not have a negative score since they experiment a lot of thing
Yet, our DM think that having a -1 in an ability score doesn't hurt much.
If the DM thinks -1 is not important, why won't he let you start with an 8?
D&D is a team game. It's okay to have a weakness in certain areas as long as someone else in your party can cover it. A barbarian doesn't need to be smart when he's got a wizard right beside him.
But yes, that array is ok. Just not the best.
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5 months ago ::
Jan 06, 2013 - 6:41PM
#7
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Date Joined:
Jan 27, 2009
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In a home game i usually utilize the 16/14/14/13/10/8 stat line. Good primary and decent secondary and you get to round out your NADs. This is good when you get stat bumps to your primary and secondary but a lot harder for Humans unless going for a DEX or Int primary class.
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5 months ago ::
Jan 06, 2013 - 8:17PM
#8
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Date Joined:
Nov 16, 2007
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All standard array will do, is remove a bunch of builds off the table. If your DM is so concerned about the well roundedness of an adventurer, he can just let everyone bump their 8 into 10 for free, problem solved. Not having a pair of 16's takes a lot of builds out of the equation, particularly those that rely on their secondary stat for AC. Also some people like playing a low stat. I think your DM is doing a disservice to the player's bredth of 4e options by dictating the standard array.
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5 months ago ::
Jan 06, 2013 - 9:16PM
#9
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All standard array will do, is remove a bunch of builds off the table. If your DM is so concerned about the well roundedness of an adventurer, he can just let everyone bump their 8 into 10 for free, problem solved. Not having a pair of 16's takes a lot of builds out of the equation, particularly those that rely on their secondary stat for AC. Also some people like playing a low stat. I think your DM is doing a disservice to the player's bredth of 4e options by dictating the standard array.
This
All classes that wear light armor and do not use Dex or Int as a primary stat are getting screwed out of some AC. (Rangers, barbarians, Avengers, to name a few).
Classes that are highly specialised, only use a single stat, and perhaps would prefer to start with an 18 will also lose some of their appeal.
Also, classes that depend on imposing an effect based on their seconday stat will have trouble.
In all, please use the 22 point buy, it allows for various combinations of arrays.
Please point out to the DM that once one starts messing with the basic math of it all, you should adjust everything, and that includes skill challenges and monsters.
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5 months ago ::
Jan 06, 2013 - 10:13PM
#10
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Date Joined:
Dec 11, 2007
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Having a 10 instead of an 8 just means you suck slightly less. You still suck. That +0 isn't gonna make a ton of difference (It won't matter for NADs, since only one score can be 8 anyways, it won't matter for attacks). At most for skills, but even then it's only a 1 difference in skills you weren't gonna bother with anyways. Dump scores are dump scores for a reason. There's not a single mathematical justification for giving up a +1 in your secondary/second primary stat in favor of a +1 in your most useless stat.
Aside of all the mechanical reasons, it doesn't even make sense in a fluff kind of way. Not all adventurers experiment with everything. An 8 simply indicates a character is below average in something. Not horrible, not crapsack, just below average. Why would every single adventurer be above average in every single stat? Furthermore, characters become more interesting with flaws, even if it's small statistical ones like this. They touch all domains? Why would a Rageblood Barbarian bother touching upon domains as silly as Wisdom (Philosophy, insight, etc.)? There's a ton more arguments you could use to justify having an 8 in a score.
tl;dr: By forcing your characters to touch on all domains, he's making you suck.
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