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5 months ago ::
Jan 01, 2013 - 12:46PM
#41
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Paladin of Asmodeus.
Paladin of Bane.
Paladin of Tiamat.
Need more?
I see what you're getting at, but I still have difficulty seeing how a Paladin's peculiar ability set exemplifies any of these. An evil cleric could pick spells and abilities much more in line with being a petitioner of an evil dragon god Tiamat. I just don't see the flavor of the paladin's abilities particularly suited for the task.
I'd really like to see blackguard become a base class though... with similar, but different abilities. I wouldn't want to see a good blackguard, though.
Why not? Lay on hands? The very fact that so many of us can fail to agree on this means that giving the players the choice is /clearly/ the right option.
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5 months ago ::
Jan 01, 2013 - 1:12PM
#42
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Date Joined:
Jun 19, 2004
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Paladin of Asmodeus.
Paladin of Bane.
Paladin of Tiamat.
Need more?
I see what you're getting at, but I still have difficulty seeing how a Paladin's peculiar ability set exemplifies any of these. An evil cleric could pick spells and abilities much more in line with being a petitioner of an evil dragon god Tiamat. I just don't see the flavor of the paladin's abilities particularly suited for the task.
I'd really like to see blackguard become a base class though... with similar, but different abilities. I wouldn't want to see a good blackguard, though.
Blackguard is a class? Its a type of paladin.
Also, good and evil are so relative that it can't really be codified into rules or laws. That is most of the problem with alignment. You also ignored the example I gave.
Currently working on making a Dex based defender. Check it out hereSpoiler:
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Need a few pre-generated characters for a one-shot you are running? Want to get a baseline for what an effective build for a class you aren't familiar with? Check out the Pregen thread here
If ever you are interested what it sounds like to be at my table check out my blog and podcast here
Also, I've recently done an episode on "Refluffing". You can check that out here
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5 months ago ::
Jan 01, 2013 - 2:10PM
#43
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Date Joined:
May 19, 2011
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Paladin of Asmodeus.
Paladin of Bane.
Paladin of Tiamat.
Need more?
I see what you're getting at, but I still have difficulty seeing how a Paladin's peculiar ability set exemplifies any of these. An evil cleric could pick spells and abilities much more in line with being a petitioner of an evil dragon god Tiamat. I just don't see the flavor of the paladin's abilities particularly suited for the task.
I'd really like to see blackguard become a base class though... with similar, but different abilities. I wouldn't want to see a good blackguard, though.
I'm playing a good Blackguard right now. He doesn't care much for rules and is a horribly violent sociopath, but he does his bets to do the right thing and is extremely loyal to his allies(to the point where he singe-handedly beat a villain into paste for killing one of his allies).
As far as non-LG Paladins, how about a Lawful Evil Paladin who decides the best way to enforce law and order is by force? He takes over the kingdom, seeing the current rulership as too corrupt to rule properly and upholds every law he passes with an iron fist, meeting any objections or violations of the law with extreme force, turning his kingdom into a complete dictatorship, and amassing himself an army to bring his ideals of law and order to the rest of the world, whether the world wants it or not.
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5 months ago ::
Jan 01, 2013 - 2:12PM
#44
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Date Joined:
May 14, 2010
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A paladin is just a heavily-armored warrior of a god. Any god. No alignment bullcrap needed.
My paladin serve no god. He is lawful because he is honorable and he is good because he do what is right. His powers come from his heart and he use it to become a shining beacon of hope for all that is good.
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5 months ago ::
Jan 01, 2013 - 4:06PM
#45
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Date Joined:
May 19, 2011
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A paladin is just a heavily-armored warrior of a god. Any god. No alignment bullcrap needed.
My paladin serve no god. He is lawful because he is honorable and he is good because he do what is right. His powers come from his heart and he use it to become a shining beacon of hope for all that is good.
Which is why I prefer the idea that the Paladin is the champion of an ideal or cause instead of a god in particular. He can be a champion of a god, or to his alignment, or to a certain way of living, etc.
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5 months ago ::
Jan 01, 2013 - 6:31PM
#46
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A paladin is just a heavily-armored warrior of a god. Any god. No alignment bullcrap needed.
My paladin serve no god. He is lawful because he is honorable and he is good because he do what is right. His powers come from his heart and he use it to become a shining beacon of hope for all that is good.
There's nothing at all wrong with your approach. The only thing wrong imo, is telling others that their approach is wrong.
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5 months ago ::
Jan 01, 2013 - 6:33PM
#47
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A paladin is just a heavily-armored warrior of a god. Any god. No alignment bullcrap needed.
My paladin serve no god. He is lawful because he is honorable and he is good because he do what is right. His powers come from his heart and he use it to become a shining beacon of hope for all that is good.
That's fine.
Someone else's paladin, however, may not be any of that, and what you fail to recognize, consistently to the point where I have to assume you're being willfully ignorant, is that other people should have the option to play their characters their way as well.
Another day, another three or four entries to my Ignore List.
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5 months ago ::
Jan 01, 2013 - 7:20PM
#48
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Salla, I'm not entirely sure what you're saying. It sounds like you want people be able to play their character anyway they want, but that they shouldn't be allowed to use alignment to do so, am I misunderstanding something?
A character sheet is a player's love letter to the DM. If someone wants to do something and they want to do it well, let them. Encourage them. Have fun with it. -Unknown
An adventure is a DM's love letter to the players. If the DM wants something to happen in the game, let it. Encourage the DM. Have fun with it. -Centauri I'd love for input as to what it should be rather than arguments against why I shouldn't have it at all. -lialwyn Best defense that I've read in favor of having alignment systems as an option
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However, if some people are heavily benefiting from the inclusion of alignment, then it would behoove those that AREN'T to listen up and pay attention to how those benefits are being created and enjoyed, no? -YagamiFire
But equally important would be for those who do enjoy those benefits to entertain the possibility that other people do not value those benefits equally or, possibly, do not see them as benefits in the first place. -wrecan
That makes sense. However, it is not fair to continually attack those that benefit for being, somehow, deviant for deriving enjoyment from something that you cannot. Instead, alignment is continually attacked...it is demonized...and those that use it are lumped in with it.
I think there is more merit in a situation where someone says "This doesn't work! It's broken!" and the reply is "Actually it works fine for me. Have you considered your approach might be causing it?" than a situation where someone says "I use this system and the way I use it works really well!" and the back and forth is "No! It is a broken bad system!" because the former posits that improvement could be made...the latter only undermines the enjoyment of the person who is using alignment. -YagamiFire
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5 months ago ::
Jan 01, 2013 - 7:30PM
#49
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Salla, I'm not entirely sure what you're saying. It sounds like you want people be able to play their character anyway they want, but that they shouldn't be allowed to use alignment to do so, am I misunderstanding something?
I'm saying alignment is bull. It's cumbersome, archaic, and an impediment to roleplay. If you can describe your character's personality with two words, it ain't much of a personality. It's a needless, pointless restriction that needs to die in a fire.
Another day, another three or four entries to my Ignore List.
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5 months ago ::
Jan 01, 2013 - 7:48PM
#50
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Date Joined:
Sep 19, 2007
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Salla, I'm not entirely sure what you're saying. It sounds like you want people be able to play their character anyway they want, but that they shouldn't be allowed to use alignment to do so, am I misunderstanding something?
He is saying that everyone should be allowed to play their characters the way they want to. The developers or other players should not be allowed to use alignment to tell players how they should be playing their characters.
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