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6 months ago ::
Dec 12, 2012 - 4:47PM
#1
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Date Joined:
Dec 16, 2011
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Well guys, I just noticed something... Save throws are quite the game breakers. I mean, most of the best encounter and dialies are based on Save Throws: They cause important changes in the pace of battle that can turn the tides, but they can quickly be gone and wasted by a save throw. Same with players, it ussualy makes the game far easier than it should be. My bet is, should I somehow add higher or lower difficulties to save throws deppending on the situation? Say, Hunter's bear trap could be a life saver if it didn't ended so easily...
Then we have Temp. HP. Yeah, they could make the battle quite diferent stacked, but I mean... many powers give Temp. Hp based on secondary status modifiers, say, a Wildblood Warden with Strength of Earth could be earing only ONE misserable Temp HP., which is in fact laughable. I mean, wouldn't it be better if Temporal HP. Actually could stack such as with the Vigorous Fighter? It's not like the status bonuses would greatly grow over time either...
Lastly, should I make Dialy Item Powers, Encunter Item Powers Intsead? I mean, they're not game breaking :/
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6 months ago ::
Dec 12, 2012 - 5:00PM
#2
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Save throws are quite the game breakers.
No, they aren't.
I mean, wouldn't it be better if Temporal HP. Actually could stack such as with the Vigorous Fighter?
No. That's a bad idea, and that IS gamebreaking.
Lastly, should I make Dialy Item Powers, Encunter Item Powers Intsead? I mean, they're not game breaking :/
No. And they can be.
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6 months ago ::
Dec 12, 2012 - 6:08PM
#3
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Date Joined:
Dec 16, 2011
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Save throws are quite the game breakers.
No, they aren't.
I mean, wouldn't it be better if Temporal HP. Actually could stack such as with the Vigorous Fighter?
No. That's a bad idea, and that IS gamebreaking.
Lastly, should I make Dialy Item Powers, Encunter Item Powers Intsead? I mean, they're not game breaking :/
No. And they can be.
So, would you consider the Vigorous Fighter a broken build?
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6 months ago ::
Dec 12, 2012 - 6:09PM
#4
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So, would you consider the Vigorous Fighter a broken build?
First: "Battlerager", not "Vigorous".
Second: It doesn't stack temp HP. It *used to*, but that was *changed*. Because it was broken.
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6 months ago ::
Dec 13, 2012 - 5:55AM
#5
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Date Joined:
Sep 25, 2011
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Here's a simple way to understand why saves aren't broken even though they are easy to make:
A "save ends" power will probably affect its victim once. (55% chance that they save at the end of their turn after suffering its effects).
Power effects are balanced by this assumption. It is supposed to affect the target once.
There is a decent chance (45%) it will affect the target twice. This is quite powerful, and it means the power-user has "beaten the odds" and gotten an extra round of effects in. Bravo!
The chance it will affect the target three times, or four times, or more decreases drastically after that. Anything after the first or second round is a huge benefit for the power-user.
Don't think of it as old 2E, where powers were supposed to last eight or ten or a dozen rounds. These powers are balanced for just one round, possibly two.
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6 months ago ::
Dec 13, 2012 - 6:37AM
#6
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Date Joined:
Nov 30, 2012
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The part where I'm also leaning towards an adjustment to saving throws is when a power has save ends on a hit and until the end of your next turn on a miss.
Now, depending on initiative order, and whether the enemy is an elite or solo, a miss could be preferable more often than not.
Otherwise, I pretty much agree that the design intent seems to have save ends powers affect the target for 1 round, 2 at most.
While it can seem rather short, I think it balances things out when you are on the receiving side.
On THP stacking... really depends if you're trying to optimize THP generation, or if you have the occasional power that generates some.
The former can really unbalance an encounter while in the later case, it probably doesn't matter and could stack.
On Daily item powers as encounter powers.... proceed with care is my only advice. Again, it propbably doesn't matter with benign items but could really unbalance things when abused.
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6 months ago ::
Dec 13, 2012 - 7:13AM
#7
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Temporal HP.
Is this time traveling HP?
Or HP for learning new laungages, visual identification and long term memory?
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my builds
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F-111 Interdictor Long (200+ squares) distance ally teleporter. With some warlord stuff. Broken in a plot way, not a power way.
Thought Switch Higher level build that grants upto 14 attacks on turn 1. If your allies play along, it's broken.
Elven Critters Crit op with crit generation. 5 of these will end anything. Broken.
King Fisher Does an excellent job at keeping an enemy disabled in a few ways. Strong.
Boominator Fun catch-22 booming blade build with either strong or completely broken damage depending on your reading.
Very Distracting Warlock Lot's of dazing and major penalties to hit. Overpowered.
Pocket Protector Pixie Stealth Knight. Maximizing the defender's aura by being in an ally's/enemy's square.
Yakuza NinjIntimiAdin: Perma-stealth Striker that offers a little protection for ally's, and can intimidate bloodied enemies. Very Strong.
Chargeburgler with cheese Ranged attacks at the end of a charge along with perma-stealth. Solid, could be overpowered if tweaked.
Void Defender Defends giving a penalty to hit anyone but him, then removing himself from play. Can get somewhat broken in epic.
Scry and Die Attacking from around corners, while staying hidden. Moderate to broken, depending on the situation.
Skimisher Fly in, attack, and fly away. Also prevents enemies from coming close. Moderate to Broken depending on the enemy, but shouldn't make the game un-fun, as the rest of your team is at risk, and you have enough weaknesses.
Indestructible Simply won't die, even if you sleep though combat.
Sir Robin (Bravely Charge Away) He automatically slows and pushes an enemy (5 squares), while charging away. Hard to rate it's power level, since it's terrain dependent.
Death's Gatekeeper A fun twist on a healic, making your party "unkillable". Overpowered to Broken, but shouldn't actually make the game un-fun, just TPK proof.
Death's Gatekeeper mk2, (Stealth Edition) Make your party "unkillable", and you hidden, while doing solid damage. Stronger then the above, but also easier for a DM to shut down. Broken, until your DM get's enough of it.
Domination and Death Dominate everything then kill them quickly. Only works @ 30, but is broken multiple ways.
Battlemind Mc Prone-Daze Protecting your allies by keeping enemies away. Quite powerful.
The Retaliator Getting hit deals more damage to the enemy then you receive yourself, and you can take plenty of hits. Heavy item dependency, Broken.
Dead Kobold Transit Teleports 98 squares a turn, and can bring someone along for the ride. Not fully built, so i can't judge the power
Psilent Guardian Protect your allies, while being invisible. Overpowered, possibly broken
Unnamed Avenger|Runepriest/Hammer of Vengance Do lot's of damage while boosting your teams. Strong to slightly overpowered.
Charedent BarrageA charging ardent. Fine in a normal team, overpowered if there are 2 together, and easily broken in teams of 5.
Super Knight A tough, sticky, high damage knight. Strong.
Super Duper Knight Basically the same as super knight, only far more broken.
Mora, the unkillable avenger Solid damage, while being neigh indestuctable. Overpowered, but not broken.
Swordburst Maximus At-Will Close Burst 3 that slide and prones. Protects allies with off actions. Strong, possibly over powered with the right party.
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6 months ago ::
Dec 14, 2012 - 6:07AM
#8
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Date Joined:
Jun 21, 2008
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The part where I'm also leaning towards an adjustment to saving throws is when a power has save ends on a hit and until the end of your next turn on a miss.
Now, depending on initiative order, and whether the enemy is an elite or solo, a miss could be preferable more often than not.
An easy fix for this would be to have BOTH until end of (caster's) next turn AND Save Ends occur when a Save Ends effect is applied.
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