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6 months ago ::
Dec 09, 2012 - 11:45AM
#31
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@scynthal: matter of versatility
in the end, i'm modifying briefly the psicarnum warrior to match my unarmed fetish and tash, i guess it will be enough for the campaign. thanks to everyone.
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6 months ago ::
Dec 09, 2012 - 5:16PM
#32
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Date Joined:
May 23, 2012
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Well... regardless of the insane standards you set CJ, I've got to say that my party (a low dps one) with the Bard/Crusader has faced things far above our CR (RT could be more specific, but it's like CR+5 or better) and come out virtually unscathed. They're all balanced characters with potent defensive abilities as well as offensive synergy. Few but the most defensive oriented encounters last more than two rounds in that game, not for lack of RT's strategy. The most recent encounter we faced was pretty clever and probably lasted a grand total of 5 rounds, but I could be wrong, it may have lasted longer. It involved different monster types, including some more tank like undead and some stealthy attackers that used them as bait to break up our ranks. My experience in D&D, and other Table top, as well as MMO's (From where the term DPS comes), tells me one thing... everyone's DPS. If your character can't do whatever it is they do (Tank, Heal, Control, Skill Monkey) well, AND dps effectively they're probably letting the party down in encounters frequently. This discussion, as well as so many others comes back to RT's Breaking the Four Boxes thread.
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6 months ago ::
Dec 09, 2012 - 7:10PM
#33
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Date Joined:
May 19, 2010
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Well... regardless of the insane standards you set CJ, I've got to say that my party (a low dps one) with the Bard/Crusader has faced things far above our CR (RT could be more specific, but it's like CR+5 or better) and come out virtually unscathed. They're all balanced characters with potent defensive abilities as well as offensive synergy. Few but the most defensive oriented encounters last more than two rounds in that game, not for lack of RT's strategy.
Then RT must have been being nice. Or you have a well-built full-caster.
The most recent encounter we faced was pretty clever and probably lasted a grand total of 5 rounds, but I could be wrong, it may have lasted longer. It involved different monster types, including some more tank like undead and some stealthy attackers that used them as bait to break up our ranks.
Sounds easy and simple. I'm not seeing what this has to do with your poor DPS, though.
My experience in D&D, and other Table top, as well as MMO's (From where the term DPS comes), tells me one thing... everyone's DPS. If your character can't do whatever it is they do (Tank, Heal, Control, Skill Monkey) well, AND dps effectively they're probably letting the party down in encounters frequently. This discussion, as well as so many others comes back to RT's Breaking the Four Boxes thread.
Look, it's fine to not focus on damage. That's totally okay if that's how you want to play. It's just that, if you actually care to optimize damage in the slightest, you should aim to one-shot enemies. This is because there is no functional difference between a wounded enemy and an enemy at full health.
Now, moving on, the idea of a skill monkey is absurd. Laughable, even. So much so that I'm not going to go any further. Same with the idea of a healer. And I've already recently gone over why tanks don't work like you appear to think they do. In real play, with even the barest hint of optimization, there are only two catergories: Those who win, and those who make sure the enemies know they're dead.
Oh, and a "controller" really shouldn't bother doing damage. It wastes resources that could be used to instawin another fight.
I am ORCutus of Borg, 3 of 6. Resistance... is futile. Your life as it has been... is over. From this time forward... you will service... us.
Resident flaming Frickin' Awesome Guy
Flamboyant Flamer of the House of Trolls
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6 months ago ::
Dec 09, 2012 - 8:11PM
#34
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Date Joined:
May 23, 2012
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Clearly you didn't read the article. I'm not at all arguing the need for the four roles I mentioned, I'm in fact saying it's silly to put each party member into one of those roles :p
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6 months ago ::
Dec 10, 2012 - 7:22AM
#35
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Date Joined:
Sep 25, 2005
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CJ, I want to be the first to thank you. Until you started trolling frequenting this section of the boards, I had no idea that D&D was designed to be played with nothing but highly optimized wizards after level 5 because everything else is TEH SUXX0RZ!!1!eleventy1!. I mean, I thought I was having fun playing that highly unopyimized dwarf Scout/Favored Soul for 3 years, but you set me straight (disappointed about that, aren't you?  )! No, now I know that in any game that goes past level 5, if I'm not playing a tinfoil celerity wizard, ahmduinitrong.
"Today's headlines and history's judgment are rarely the same. If you are too attentive to the former, you will most certainly not do the hard work of securing the latter." -Condoleezza Rice
"My fellow Americans... I've just signed legislation that will outlaw Russia forever. Bombing begins in five minutes." - Ronald Reagan
This user has been brought to you by the letters "O-R-C" and the numbers "2, 3, 4, and 6"
Resident Pithed-Off Dragon
Buttler of the House of Trolls
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6 months ago ::
Dec 10, 2012 - 7:27AM
#36
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i've always been fairly concerned about melee limits. psionic warrior suffers some restrictions about supernatural stuff. I've found protection for death effects, mind affecting ones. I guess against ethereal/ incorporeal the solution is ghost touch equip. and will have to tweak things a bit to suit my unarmed playstyle. I miss a couple of things. I've seen that there's no specific rule for re-acquiring a psicrystal after it's destroyed and there's no 24-hour power empowerment. Following the psycarnum build it looks like i have to spend some turns on boosting low-term buffs and i have to start chewing the mechanics yet. I feel there's an incredible loss of power without the 2-hander build since cobalt power, lion's charge and power attack are not as effective as planned in the archetype. Should i replace those feats completely? Like grabbing a practiced manfiester for smoothing out the gap caused by the 2 level spent in monk? A better choice for lion's charge?
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6 months ago ::
Dec 10, 2012 - 7:50AM
#37
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Date Joined:
May 23, 2012
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A lot of Psy War buffs are hour/level in duration. Consider that by level 8 (hey look a bonus feat) you can Extend Power those to 16 hours (basically a whole day of up time). Regarding the whole ethereal opponent thing, also the Armor and Shield buffs Inertial Armor, and Force Screen both work (they're Force effects), as does Defensive Precog (adds to touch ac).
I'll also agree regarding Tashalatora that you can take it or leave it. It's good defensively, and offensively yes you can combine a full unarmed attack with all your other claw and tenticle attacks as one gigantic full attack (even using lions charge!)
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6 months ago ::
Dec 10, 2012 - 9:03AM
#38
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Date Joined:
May 19, 2010
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Clearly you didn't read the article. I'm not at all arguing the need for the four roles I mentioned, I'm in fact saying it's silly to put each party member into one of those roles :p
And I am saying that those roles simply do not exist.
CJ, I want to be the first to thank you. Until you started trolling frequenting this section of the boards, I had no idea that D&D was designed to be played with nothing but highly optimized wizards after level 5 because everything else is TEH SUXX0RZ!!1!eleventy1!. I mean, I thought I was having fun playing that highly unopyimized dwarf Scout/Favored Soul for 3 years, but you set me straight (disappointed about that, aren't you? )! No, now I know that in any game that goes past level 5, if I'm not playing a tinfoil celerity wizard, ahmduinitrong.
First off, yes, I am seriously disappointed. I mean, I've had fun playing fighters and knights before, but Favored Soul/Scout? 
And you need to differentiate between optimized and unoptimized. If one is attempting to optimize, melee will end up being either a gish, ToB, or a charger. Or a CoDZilla. And wizards really are better than everyone. However, if you're having fun with your fireball-throwing focused evoker, that's fine. It's just not optimized.
I'll also agree regarding Tashalatora that you can take it or leave it. It's good defensively, and offensively yes you can combine a full unarmed attack with all your other claw and tenticle attacks as one gigantic full attack (even using lions charge!)
Tash is only good free. Monks get it free-ish. Psywars don't. So, not worth it.
Would now be a bad time to bring up stacking PLC?
I am ORCutus of Borg, 3 of 6. Resistance... is futile. Your life as it has been... is over. From this time forward... you will service... us.
Resident flaming Frickin' Awesome Guy
Flamboyant Flamer of the House of Trolls
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6 months ago ::
Dec 10, 2012 - 10:38AM
#39
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i'm going unarmed 2 monk / 18 psywarr so i'm getting it for free
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6 months ago ::
Dec 12, 2012 - 3:23AM
#40
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i've always been fairly concerned about melee limits. psionic warrior suffers some restrictions about supernatural stuff. I've found protection for death effects, mind affecting ones. I guess against ethereal/ incorporeal the solution is ghost touch equip. and will have to tweak things a bit to suit my unarmed playstyle. I miss a couple of things. I've seen that there's no specific rule for re-acquiring a psicrystal after it's destroyed and there's no 24-hour power empowerment.
Following the psycarnum build it looks like i have to spend some turns on boosting low-term buffs and i have to start chewing the mechanics yet. I feel there's an incredible loss of power without the 2-hander build since cobalt power, lion's charge and power attack are not as effective as planned in the archetype.
Should i replace those feats completely? Like grabbing a practiced manfiester for smoothing out the gap caused by the 2 level spent in monk?
A better choice for lion's charge?
any other opinion about these poitns?
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