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6 months ago ::
Dec 14, 2012 - 4:30PM
#221
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The vast majority of choices that a player makes during a campaign don't actually matter.
Holy crap that's a bad campaign then
I'm on a journey of enlightenment, learning and self-improvement. A journey towards mastery. A journey that will never end.
If you challenge me, prepare to be challenged. If you have something to offer as a fellow student, I will accept it. If you call yourself a master, prepare to be humbled. If you seek me, look to the path. I will be traveling it. #SuperDungeonMasterIITurbo
My blog and stuff http://dmingtowin.blogspot.com/
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6 months ago ::
Dec 14, 2012 - 4:33PM
#222
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Date Joined:
Dec 22, 2010
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The vast majority of choices that a player makes during a campaign don't actually matter.
Holy crap that's a bad campaign then
Because choosing to move to square A to attack an enemy monster makes such a differrence compared to moving to square B, one square to the north of A.
The vast majority of decisions are not plot-changing.
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6 months ago ::
Dec 14, 2012 - 4:38PM
#223
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Date Joined:
Jun 19, 2004
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The vast majority of choices that a player makes during a campaign don't actually matter.
Holy crap that's a bad campaign then
Because choosing to move to square A to attack an enemy monster makes such a differrence compared to moving to square B, one square to the north of A.
The vast majority of decisions are not plot-changing.
And if you make square A or B only have something if they step in A or B then you are doing it wrong too. It must be in either A or B, but there is never any reason to have it not decided until the player acts.... /sarcasm
Currently working on making a Dex based defender. Check it out hereSpoiler:
Show
Need a few pre-generated characters for a one-shot you are running? Want to get a baseline for what an effective build for a class you aren't familiar with? Check out the Pregen thread here
If ever you are interested what it sounds like to be at my table check out my blog and podcast here
Also, I've recently done an episode on "Refluffing". You can check that out here
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6 months ago ::
Dec 14, 2012 - 4:40PM
#224
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Date Joined:
Jun 19, 2004
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What your post boils down to is that sometimes your players are going to damn well see what you lovingly expertly crafted and come hell or high water, regardless what they choose, they're going to damn well get to that point to experience it.
Railroading.
Gotcha. I understand.
I also understand it makes you feel "dirty" to realize that or to have it put in plain language...but it is what it is. You use the illusion of choice to have your players run into something you have "scripted". That is a textbook example of railroading.
Which would be a great example if the players were forced through encounters /set pieces and information instead of merely introduced to them. It would also make LOADS of sense of I didn't build these set pieces (after the first level or two) completely around what the players want to see.
You are right, I want the players to be able to interact with the encounter that I built to further their objectives for their PC. Now, whether they choose to do it or not is entirely up to them, but where the encounter actually is in the game world / storyline is the Illusion.
I'd give an example of good vs bad Ichoice if I thought anyone wouldn't both label them as bad without giving thought either way  .
If at any point, a choice presented to me doesn't actually matter, then it's bad. Since that is the nature of railroading (iChoice) then yes it's inherently bad.
Also, who said the choice didn't matter? Your choice sets a lot of things in place. For instance there should be adifference between encounter the goblin patrol in the north pass as opposed to the south pass. If they get GP North it is returning from looting a town they recently hit, if they get GP South it is on the way to scout a town they are about to hit or some such thing.
Currently working on making a Dex based defender. Check it out hereSpoiler:
Show
Need a few pre-generated characters for a one-shot you are running? Want to get a baseline for what an effective build for a class you aren't familiar with? Check out the Pregen thread here
If ever you are interested what it sounds like to be at my table check out my blog and podcast here
Also, I've recently done an episode on "Refluffing". You can check that out here
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6 months ago ::
Dec 14, 2012 - 4:46PM
#225
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The vast majority of choices that a player makes during a campaign don't actually matter.
Holy crap that's a bad campaign then
Because choosing to move to square A to attack an enemy monster makes such a differrence compared to moving to square B, one square to the north of A.
The vast majority of decisions are not plot-changing.
Wow. How telling is it that you immediately default to speaking about roleplaying purely in combat terms? You've completely missed the point.
Also those aren't choices. There are statistically optimal tactics in combat. It can ALL be boiled down to numbers, placement, probability and other known quantities. Hence, those sort of things in combat are NOT choices...they are strategic decisions based on the skill level of the person playing. It is not a "choice" for a character.
EDIT: I'll also add that even a decision made in combat has IMMEDIATE repercussions that matter. I mean that is painfully obvious. If you move to target A and attack Target A then you do not do damage to Target B. That is immediate, proveable consequences.
I'm on a journey of enlightenment, learning and self-improvement. A journey towards mastery. A journey that will never end.
If you challenge me, prepare to be challenged. If you have something to offer as a fellow student, I will accept it. If you call yourself a master, prepare to be humbled. If you seek me, look to the path. I will be traveling it. #SuperDungeonMasterIITurbo
My blog and stuff http://dmingtowin.blogspot.com/
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6 months ago ::
Dec 14, 2012 - 4:47PM
#226
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Also, who said the choice didn't matter? Your choice sets a lot of things in place. For instance there should be adifference between encounter the goblin patrol in the north pass as opposed to the south pass. If they get GP North it is returning from looting a town they recently hit, if they get GP South it is on the way to scout a town they are about to hit or some such thing.
Those are two different things and therefore not magician-switch.
I'm on a journey of enlightenment, learning and self-improvement. A journey towards mastery. A journey that will never end.
If you challenge me, prepare to be challenged. If you have something to offer as a fellow student, I will accept it. If you call yourself a master, prepare to be humbled. If you seek me, look to the path. I will be traveling it. #SuperDungeonMasterIITurbo
My blog and stuff http://dmingtowin.blogspot.com/
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6 months ago ::
Dec 14, 2012 - 4:55PM
#227
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Date Joined:
May 14, 2010
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The most simple answer is just make another NPC. They got lucky, they kill it, big deal.
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6 months ago ::
Dec 14, 2012 - 4:56PM
#228
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Date Joined:
Jun 19, 2004
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Except that is the example of Ichoice. They will encounter a Goblin Patrol either way and not both. The encounter mutates to match what the players pick. That is the Ichoice I've been discussing this entire time.
Currently working on making a Dex based defender. Check it out hereSpoiler:
Show
Need a few pre-generated characters for a one-shot you are running? Want to get a baseline for what an effective build for a class you aren't familiar with? Check out the Pregen thread here
If ever you are interested what it sounds like to be at my table check out my blog and podcast here
Also, I've recently done an episode on "Refluffing". You can check that out here
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6 months ago ::
Dec 14, 2012 - 4:57PM
#229
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The most simple answer is just make another NPC. They got lucky, they kill it, big deal.
Big bad evil dudes never do that!
I mean you don't just replace Darth Maul with Darth Tyranus I mean General Grievous I mean Darth Vader I mean Executor Sedriss I mean...oh wait...
I'm on a journey of enlightenment, learning and self-improvement. A journey towards mastery. A journey that will never end.
If you challenge me, prepare to be challenged. If you have something to offer as a fellow student, I will accept it. If you call yourself a master, prepare to be humbled. If you seek me, look to the path. I will be traveling it. #SuperDungeonMasterIITurbo
My blog and stuff http://dmingtowin.blogspot.com/
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6 months ago ::
Dec 14, 2012 - 4:59PM
#230
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Except that is the example of Ichoice. They will encounter a Goblin Patrol either way and not both. The encounter mutates to match what the players pick. That is the Ichoice I've been discussing this entire time.
Did you arbitrarily DECIDE what they run into? Or was it already in place? If it is in place then it is not iChoice because options have outcomes. However, you COULD still be railroading by setting up identical encounters that cannot be avoided.
If the players are able to make decisions and actually impact what they run into and how they run into it then that is neither iChoice nor railroading.
I'm on a journey of enlightenment, learning and self-improvement. A journey towards mastery. A journey that will never end.
If you challenge me, prepare to be challenged. If you have something to offer as a fellow student, I will accept it. If you call yourself a master, prepare to be humbled. If you seek me, look to the path. I will be traveling it. #SuperDungeonMasterIITurbo
My blog and stuff http://dmingtowin.blogspot.com/
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