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5 months ago ::
Dec 17, 2012 - 11:52AM
#301
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Date Joined:
Dec 13, 2012
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One way to improve communication between us and R&D would be for them to post on the D&D Next forum.
Yeah, pretty much...it feels like they are on the top of their ivory tower, only reacting on the little they can notice from up there without really knowing the why at some point...
As a long, LONG, time game forums lurker, let me just say that more developer interaction on boards is fine to a point. But too much can be terrible. I always use the WoW general forums for this example. During Wrath they decided to communicate on the forums, and since then every thread has basically become "Hey blizzard, what are you doing?" and waiting on a blue response. It has killed most of the actual discussion on the boards as everyone just waits until a blue posts. Threads live or die based on whether or not a dev responds. It's actually pretty tragic.
Moral of the story is this. Too little communication? Bad. Too much? Also bad.
Would that even be a bad thing?
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5 months ago ::
Dec 17, 2012 - 11:52AM
#302
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Date Joined:
Oct 23, 2012
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I don't think it makes any sense to pollute the development team's morale by having them interface with the tiny percenatage of people who have little else to do then sit on here and complain. Instead, they should just do their job with the highly sophiticated playtest system they are currently using.
The forums, much like it is for us, is 95% a waste of time. Forums attract the outliers, and the extremes, people just fuming with the need to needlessy vent their self-indulged views. It would be a huge disservice to the customer, to weigh the voice of the forumites in any way higher then what everyone else gets in the playtest survey system.
THat's not to say it's not a great way to attract new ideas, see arguments and how they unfold. it's safe to presume that attitudes in the forum are not remotely similiar to the actual market's attitudes, and vice versa.
My mind is a deal-breaker.
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5 months ago ::
Dec 17, 2012 - 11:53AM
#303
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Date Joined:
Jun 17, 2010
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No, it's safe to presume that attitudes in the forum are not necessarily similar to the actual market's attitudes, but to presume that they're not similar is equally faulty logic.
D&D Next = D&D: Quantum Edition
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5 months ago ::
Dec 17, 2012 - 11:54AM
#304
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Date Joined:
Dec 13, 2012
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No, they'd just have to learn from Blizzard.
With the number of people here who very clearly seem to hate at least some if not all of the developers, and/or the entire concept of having DDN in the first place, I respectfully disagree.
A heavily moderated sub-forum would be best, I think. And, if someone does attempt to post nothing more than "This is evil, and X sucks, and the developers don't know what they're doing!" they get an explanation and a temporary ban. If they do it again, the ban would be permanent.
Yes, I know that's heavy handed, but if they state this is the case up front, then nobody has any right to complain if they then turn around and do it anyway and then get banned for it.
Criticism is fine - in fact, that's the entire point of a playtest. Destructive criticism involving nothing more than "X sucks!" where X is the playtest or, worse, a person, should not be tolerated.
This excuse doesn't work. Bad posts would be moderated. Personal attacks are against the CoC. People wouldn't be able to do much more than say they do or don't like something.
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5 months ago ::
Dec 17, 2012 - 11:55AM
#305
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Date Joined:
May 24, 2012
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No, I wasn't referencing only the WoW boards
Sorry, somebody else was, then. There are a couple conversations in different threads that seem to be about the same thing. Your assessment of the Blizzard forums is spot on. I stopped going because they were useless as a tool for finding REAL information.
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5 months ago ::
Dec 17, 2012 - 11:57AM
#306
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Date Joined:
Oct 23, 2012
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No, it's safe to presume that attitudes in the forum are not necessarily similar to the actual market's attitudes, but to presume that they're not similar is equally faulty logic.
I'm saying what's safe, not what's true. Not reacting to the forums is safe. Forum could be a perfect representation of the total audience, it's just not a valid way to presume your hitting the wider audience.
Make sense?
My mind is a deal-breaker.
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5 months ago ::
Dec 17, 2012 - 11:57AM
#307
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Date Joined:
Dec 13, 2012
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I don't think it makes any sense to pollute the development team's morale by having them interface with the tiny percenatage of people who have little else to do then sit on here and complain. Instead, they should just do their job with the highly sophiticated playtest system they are currently using.
The forums, much like it is for us, is 95% a waste of time. Forums attract the outliers, and the extremes, people just fuming with the need to needlessy vent their self-indulged views. It would be a huge disservice to the customer, to weigh the voice of the forumites in any way higher then what everyone else gets in the playtest survey system.
THat's not to say it's not a great way to attract new ideas, see arguments and how they unfold. it's safe to presume that attitudes in the forum are not remotely similiar to the actual market's attitudes, and vice versa.
So now you are saying everyone that posts on the forums is bad. Yeah, I wouldn't want the developers exposed to constant stereotyping that goes on here.
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5 months ago ::
Dec 17, 2012 - 12:00PM
#308
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Date Joined:
Jan 23, 2012
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This excuse doesn't work. Bad posts would be moderated. Personal attacks are against the CoC. People wouldn't be able to do much more than say they do or don't like something.
It's not an excuse, just an opinion based on things I have seen around here since the playtest was announced. I have seen more than one person suggest that the developers need to come on the forums, and put up with any degree of abuse in order to start to get folks' trust back.
It's exactly that type of opinion that I'm aiming to head off, because it is neither productive nor is it conducive to actually formulating any positive relationship between the designers and the fans. It is only poison.
For those confused on how DDN's modular rules might work, this may provide some insight: http://www.tor.com/blogs/2012/11/the-world-of-darkness-shines-when-it-abandons-canon
@mikemearls: Uhhh... do you really not see all the 3e/4e that's basically the entire core system?
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5 months ago ::
Dec 17, 2012 - 12:03PM
#309
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Date Joined:
Oct 23, 2012
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I don't think it makes any sense to pollute the development team's morale by having them interface with the tiny percenatage of people who have little else to do then sit on here and complain. Instead, they should just do their job with the highly sophiticated playtest system they are currently using.
The forums, much like it is for us, is 95% a waste of time. Forums attract the outliers, and the extremes, people just fuming with the need to needlessy vent their self-indulged views. It would be a huge disservice to the customer, to weigh the voice of the forumites in any way higher then what everyone else gets in the playtest survey system.
THat's not to say it's not a great way to attract new ideas, see arguments and how they unfold. it's safe to presume that attitudes in the forum are not remotely similiar to the actual market's attitudes, and vice versa.
So now you are saying everyone that posts on the forums is bad. Yeah, I wouldn't want the developers exposed to constant stereotyping that goes on here.
nope.
I'm not saying the forum doesn't have value. I'm just saying it's value ISN'T that it represents the whole market.
Using the forum to get ideas, great. Using the forumas a litmus for the playtest, terrible.
My mind is a deal-breaker.
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5 months ago ::
Dec 17, 2012 - 12:05PM
#310
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@mikemearls
Add "things may change" to the bottom of every page.
About 1/2 the complaints are of people taking what merl's said, implied, or misunderstood as it is written in stone. Adding that will stop people from saying "WoTC lied" and such.
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my builds
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F-111 Interdictor Long (200+ squares) distance ally teleporter. With some warlord stuff. Broken in a plot way, not a power way.
Thought Switch Higher level build that grants upto 14 attacks on turn 1. If your allies play along, it's broken.
Elven Critters Crit op with crit generation. 5 of these will end anything. Broken.
King Fisher Does an excellent job at keeping an enemy disabled in a few ways. Strong.
Boominator Fun catch-22 booming blade build with either strong or completely broken damage depending on your reading.
Very Distracting Warlock Lot's of dazing and major penalties to hit. Overpowered.
Pocket Protector Pixie Stealth Knight. Maximizing the defender's aura by being in an ally's/enemy's square.
Yakuza NinjIntimiAdin: Perma-stealth Striker that offers a little protection for ally's, and can intimidate bloodied enemies. Very Strong.
Chargeburgler with cheese Ranged attacks at the end of a charge along with perma-stealth. Solid, could be overpowered if tweaked.
Void Defender Defends giving a penalty to hit anyone but him, then removing himself from play. Can get somewhat broken in epic.
Scry and Die Attacking from around corners, while staying hidden. Moderate to broken, depending on the situation.
Skimisher Fly in, attack, and fly away. Also prevents enemies from coming close. Moderate to Broken depending on the enemy, but shouldn't make the game un-fun, as the rest of your team is at risk, and you have enough weaknesses.
Indestructible Simply won't die, even if you sleep though combat.
Sir Robin (Bravely Charge Away) He automatically slows and pushes an enemy (5 squares), while charging away. Hard to rate it's power level, since it's terrain dependent.
Death's Gatekeeper A fun twist on a healic, making your party "unkillable". Overpowered to Broken, but shouldn't actually make the game un-fun, just TPK proof.
Death's Gatekeeper mk2, (Stealth Edition) Make your party "unkillable", and you hidden, while doing solid damage. Stronger then the above, but also easier for a DM to shut down. Broken, until your DM get's enough of it.
Domination and Death Dominate everything then kill them quickly. Only works @ 30, but is broken multiple ways.
Battlemind Mc Prone-Daze Protecting your allies by keeping enemies away. Quite powerful.
The Retaliator Getting hit deals more damage to the enemy then you receive yourself, and you can take plenty of hits. Heavy item dependency, Broken.
Dead Kobold Transit Teleports 98 squares a turn, and can bring someone along for the ride. Not fully built, so i can't judge the power
Psilent Guardian Protect your allies, while being invisible. Overpowered, possibly broken
Unnamed Avenger|Runepriest/Hammer of Vengance Do lot's of damage while boosting your teams. Strong to slightly overpowered.
Charedent BarrageA charging ardent. Fine in a normal team, overpowered if there are 2 together, and easily broken in teams of 5.
Super Knight A tough, sticky, high damage knight. Strong.
Super Duper Knight Basically the same as super knight, only far more broken.
Mora, the unkillable avenger Solid damage, while being neigh indestuctable. Overpowered, but not broken.
Swordburst Maximus At-Will Close Burst 3 that slide and prones. Protects allies with off actions. Strong, possibly over powered with the right party.
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