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7 months ago ::
Nov 25, 2012 - 1:49AM
#61
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Date Joined:
Sep 17, 2007
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Armisael, *sigh* I just don't think you're ever going to get it. When someone comes here asking about optimizing their character for a party that already includes someone sliding them every round, someone pulling enemies into a clump every round, a warlord with combat leader, a warlord with battlefront shift, a defender with attack negating interrupts, a crit optimized striker that also has 4+ attacks per round and deals radiant damage, a morninglord, and a controller that has effective at-will burst dominate ... I seriously hope you'll instruct them on how to build a striker that can do 9 attacks in round 1, and then 7 per round after that. Until then, your LSM is just annoying.
Says the guy who sits in his ivory tower and hoards knowledge like some sort of ridiculous dragon instead of trying to educate people on it. Get off your high horse, get on my level, and start making compelling arguments instead of snarking and maybe I'll pay more attention to you.
PS: Please outline all those artificer and wizard combos and finds you came up with before you raise your voice. You don't get to call LSM on someone with many, many more contributions to CharOp's knowledge database than you do.
Mountain Cleave Rule: You can have any sort of fun, including broken, silly fun, so long as I get to have that fun too (e. g., if you can warp reality with your spells, I can cleave mountains with my blade).
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7 months ago ::
Nov 25, 2012 - 7:01AM
#62
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Date Joined:
Apr 25, 2002
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It is when you should be having a free action on-crit MBA as a part of your routine. If you are an optimal striker that bonus is redundant. Taking a move action is better, but only goes so far. Even the most focused Ranger in the world is only gonna have three minor action attacks, so once you get a Ring of Free Time the usefulness goes up in smoke. (This is admittedly late in the game, but you get what my point is here.)
I'm really not clear on how you're expecting most strikers, particularly a group with a Monk/Assassin or Necromantic Wizard to have a free action on-crit MBA other than Barbarians.
Bravura Warlords are fine for the real world, simply because they will enable the party to make an additional nova or impose additional control or positioning.
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7 months ago ::
Nov 25, 2012 - 11:23AM
#63
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Date Joined:
Jun 19, 2004
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It is when you should be having a free action on-crit MBA as a part of your routine. If you are an optimal striker that bonus is redundant. Taking a move action is better, but only goes so far. Even the most focused Ranger in the world is only gonna have three minor action attacks, so once you get a Ring of Free Time the usefulness goes up in smoke. (This is admittedly late in the game, but you get what my point is here.)
I'm really not clear on how you're expecting most strikers, particularly a group with a Monk/Assassin or Necromantic Wizard to have a free action on-crit MBA other than Barbarians.
Bravura Warlords are fine for the real world, simply because they will enable the party to make an additional nova or impose additional control or positioning.
Its ok MWAO, just like Arm said. I was foolish to not think that every character had a way to get an auto-crit from level 1-30 and an on-crit free action BA to use for every one of those on-demand attacks. I have seen the error of my ways.
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7 months ago ::
Nov 25, 2012 - 11:48AM
#64
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Date Joined:
Feb 26, 2011
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Matyr, clearly your problem is a lack of Thicket of Blades
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7 months ago ::
Nov 25, 2012 - 12:13PM
#65
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Date Joined:
Sep 17, 2007
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It is when you should be having a free action on-crit MBA as a part of your routine. If you are an optimal striker that bonus is redundant. Taking a move action is better, but only goes so far. Even the most focused Ranger in the world is only gonna have three minor action attacks, so once you get a Ring of Free Time the usefulness goes up in smoke. (This is admittedly late in the game, but you get what my point is here.)
I'm really not clear on how you're expecting most strikers, particularly a group with a Monk/Assassin or Necromantic Wizard to have a free action on-crit MBA other than Barbarians.
Bravura Warlords are fine for the real world, simply because they will enable the party to make an additional nova or impose additional control or positioning.
Why isn't a Monk toting Internalize the Basic Kata so he can be enabled, and Two Weapon Opening so he gets more attacks on crits? It's not like he has all those awesome monk feats to take to ratchet his damage up to the stratosphere. The Assassin is more feat-starved, admittedly, but the Executioner still wants TWO, while the Ossassin has a serious incentive to stick with a one-handed weapon just for that extra attack.
Mountain Cleave Rule: You can have any sort of fun, including broken, silly fun, so long as I get to have that fun too (e. g., if you can warp reality with your spells, I can cleave mountains with my blade).
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7 months ago ::
Nov 25, 2012 - 12:22PM
#66
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- Senior Volunteer Community Lead
Date Joined:
Aug 19, 2007
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The Monk|Executioner definitely doesn't need internalize the basic kata, but he still is probably too feat starved to put two feats into Twin Weapon Opening at 11th just so 5% of the time (if that) he can crit and spawn a melee basic with his off-hand dagger.
Keith Richmond
Living Forgotten Realms Epic Writing Director
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7 months ago ::
Nov 25, 2012 - 1:44PM
#67
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Runepriest are ok, just not great. They have a few amazing and unique powers and feats, just not enough to fill the class. (And their bonus damage really needs to scale.)
Hybrid runepriest do much better, since you can grab the great runepriest options (scroll of protection, word of diminishment, bonus damage/thp, healing assault, astral wind), and fill in the gaps from another class. They really don't loose much either.
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F-111 Interdictor Long (200+ squares) distance ally teleporter. With some warlord stuff. Broken in a plot way, not a power way.
Thought Switch Higher level build that grants upto 14 attacks on turn 1. If your allies play along, it's broken.
Elven Critters Crit op with crit generation. 5 of these will end anything. Broken.
King Fisher Does an excellent job at keeping an enemy disabled in a few ways. Strong.
Boominator Fun catch-22 booming blade build with either strong or completely broken damage depending on your reading.
Very Distracting Warlock Lot's of dazing and major penalties to hit. Overpowered.
Pocket Protector Pixie Stealth Knight. Maximizing the defender's aura by being in an ally's/enemy's square.
Yakuza NinjIntimiAdin: Perma-stealth Striker that offers a little protection for ally's, and can intimidate bloodied enemies. Very Strong.
Chargeburgler with cheese Ranged attacks at the end of a charge along with perma-stealth. Solid, could be overpowered if tweaked.
Void Defender Defends giving a penalty to hit anyone but him, then removing himself from play. Can get somewhat broken in epic.
Scry and Die Attacking from around corners, while staying hidden. Moderate to broken, depending on the situation.
Skimisher Fly in, attack, and fly away. Also prevents enemies from coming close. Moderate to Broken depending on the enemy, but shouldn't make the game un-fun, as the rest of your team is at risk, and you have enough weaknesses.
Indestructible Simply won't die, even if you sleep though combat.
Sir Robin (Bravely Charge Away) He automatically slows and pushes an enemy (5 squares), while charging away. Hard to rate it's power level, since it's terrain dependent.
Death's Gatekeeper A fun twist on a healic, making your party "unkillable". Overpowered to Broken, but shouldn't actually make the game un-fun, just TPK proof.
Death's Gatekeeper mk2, (Stealth Edition) Make your party "unkillable", and you hidden, while doing solid damage. Stronger then the above, but also easier for a DM to shut down. Broken, until your DM get's enough of it.
Domination and Death Dominate everything then kill them quickly. Only works @ 30, but is broken multiple ways.
Battlemind Mc Prone-Daze Protecting your allies by keeping enemies away. Quite powerful.
The Retaliator Getting hit deals more damage to the enemy then you receive yourself, and you can take plenty of hits. Heavy item dependency, Broken.
Dead Kobold Transit Teleports 98 squares a turn, and can bring someone along for the ride. Not fully built, so i can't judge the power
Psilent Guardian Protect your allies, while being invisible. Overpowered, possibly broken
Unnamed Avenger|Runepriest/Hammer of Vengance Do lot's of damage while boosting your teams. Strong to slightly overpowered.
Charedent BarrageA charging ardent. Fine in a normal team, overpowered if there are 2 together, and easily broken in teams of 5.
Super Knight A tough, sticky, high damage knight. Strong.
Super Duper Knight Basically the same as super knight, only far more broken.
Mora, the unkillable avenger Solid damage, while being neigh indestuctable. Overpowered, but not broken.
Swordburst Maximus At-Will Close Burst 3 that slide and prones. Protects allies with off actions. Strong, possibly over powered with the right party.
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7 months ago ::
Nov 25, 2012 - 1:45PM
#68
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Date Joined:
Sep 17, 2007
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The Monk|Executioner definitely doesn't need internalize the basic kata, but he still is probably too feat starved to put two feats into Twin Weapon Opening at 11th just so 5% of the time (if that) he can crit and spawn a melee basic with his off-hand dagger.
I was thinking of a Monk OR Executioner (both straight-classed), not a hybrid. Sorry I didn't clarify. Also, it really isn't 5% of the time at Epic...or paragon really if you're willing to invest in the right weapon choice or PP, but I don't see why you'd do that.
But really, make a wishlist of feats up to 20 and ask yourself what you're gonna take with that Monk|Exe. Let's run through it for a bit, shall we?
Level 1: Expertise.
Level 2: Weapon Proficiency.
Level 4: Some sort of Damage Focus (Retrain to elemental focus at 11).
Level 6: Rogue or Fighter MC (probably Rogue).
Level 8: Surprising Charge.
Level 10: Novice Power (Low Slash).
Level 11: Some big feat or another (Lasting Frost, for instance?).
Level 12: Improved Defenses.
Level 14: Superior Will (if you have the room for it, might as well have OK defenses).
Level 16: ????
Level 18: ????
Level 20: ????
It's not like you have so many slots taken you cannot use a pair on securing yourself an extra attack on a crit. Particularly once you have expanded crit range, it's a bargain and likely worth more than a Focus feat, doubly so because you want to crit anyways to regain encounter powers in epic via Epic Resurgence.
Mountain Cleave Rule: You can have any sort of fun, including broken, silly fun, so long as I get to have that fun too (e. g., if you can warp reality with your spells, I can cleave mountains with my blade).
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7 months ago ::
Nov 25, 2012 - 2:19PM
#69
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- Senior Volunteer Community Lead
Date Joined:
Aug 19, 2007
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At epic he can get a 10% chance to crit, maybe. Satisfying stat prereqs can be onerous, and often only apply to melee attacks, so if he's using the monk half of the hybrid he'll be making some attacks that aren't melee, are implement, don't even necessarily use his "main weapon" (if he uses a ki focus), etc. If he isn't, he really should just be a straight executioner. And most people rate Superior Will higher than that in my experience, and if he is using the monk side (with the executioner assisting granted attacks or when he has to charge) he might want any number of feats, such as starblade flurry. I'll admit, it's hard to predict what a non-op build will look like in terms of feats spent. It's not like we made room for Linguist in there either 
Keith Richmond
Living Forgotten Realms Epic Writing Director
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7 months ago ::
Nov 25, 2012 - 2:36PM
#70
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Date Joined:
Apr 25, 2002
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It is when you should be having a free action on-crit MBA as a part of your routine. If you are an optimal striker that bonus is redundant. Taking a move action is better, but only goes so far. Even the most focused Ranger in the world is only gonna have three minor action attacks, so once you get a Ring of Free Time the usefulness goes up in smoke. (This is admittedly late in the game, but you get what my point is here.)
I'm really not clear on how you're expecting most strikers, particularly a group with a Monk/Assassin or Necromantic Wizard to have a free action on-crit MBA other than Barbarians.
Bravura Warlords are fine for the real world, simply because they will enable the party to make an additional nova or impose additional control or positioning.
Why isn't a Monk toting Internalize the Basic Kata so he can be enabled, and Two Weapon Opening so he gets more attacks on crits? It's not like he has all those awesome monk feats to take to ratchet his damage up to the stratosphere. The Assassin is more feat-starved, admittedly, but the Executioner still wants TWO, while the Ossassin has a serious incentive to stick with a one-handed weapon just for that extra attack.
Two Weapon Opening is one of those feats that I think tends to be wildly overrated unless you're really crit optimized - which is not generally the real world for the most part. If you do 40 hp of damage on an MBA and you have a 10% chance of a crit per attack, that's 2 feats for an average of 4 damage per swing.
Which isn't bad, but isn't especially awesome either.
And Monks, as primarily implement-users have a lot of incentive to not actually get all the way up to 40 hp of damage on a swing or to put their expertise feat on having a good MBA via their unarmed option.
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