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7 months ago ::
Nov 26, 2012 - 5:07PM
#31
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Date Joined:
Sep 19, 2007
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Board games that are in no way produced by WotC or Hasbro, that is.
Credit where credit is due, Lord of Waterdeep is a fantastic boardgame.
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7 months ago ::
Nov 26, 2012 - 7:38PM
#32
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Date Joined:
Nov 14, 2011
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I think Ravenloft is pretty awesome too 
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7 months ago ::
Nov 27, 2012 - 11:35PM
#33
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Date Joined:
Jan 15, 2009
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Honestly I don't care what happens to the books but... if they mess with my DnD Insider account and replace the Charbuilder and Compendium with DnD Next crap I'm going to be a very sad panda.
Which is why I am happy I kept my off line version and know basic editing to add the things Wizards refused to add. Sure it takes some work but hey it means I will be able to play 4e forever and introduce my own homebrew as well.
Yup this exactly.
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7 months ago ::
Nov 28, 2012 - 2:10PM
#34
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Date Joined:
Apr 15, 2001
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Same thing tahs happened to every other edition. A couple of years after the end 4th ed will be restricted to a handful of holdouts and it will be difficult to find players for it.
Reducing a character to a list of dice rolls and modifiers is not role playing*
*pg 30, AD&D 2nd Ed DMG, 1989.
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7 months ago ::
Nov 28, 2012 - 2:14PM
#35
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Date Joined:
Feb 17, 2010
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I dunno Zardnaar. I get the feeling that if Next ends up getting the product shelved then Pathfinder and 4e are going to be the systems of choice amongst folks who still want to play D&D.
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7 months ago ::
Nov 28, 2012 - 5:53PM
#36
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Date Joined:
Aug 30, 2007
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Actually while I know this was intended to be a joke, perhaps for the first time in RPG history, it's really not. 4E has gotten to the point where a lot of 4E players need and depend on the online tools (esp Char Builder) to actually play the game because the errata is so bloated and scattered, and the various class abilities and powers are scattered over dozens of "core" books and magazines.
So if when Wotc pulls the plug on 4E character support, they really will be (in effect) breaking into a large section of the 4E fanbase and destroying their 4e books.
-Polaris
If a player makes himself reliant on a set of online tools, knowing from the start (at least from the switch to online instead of downloaded tools) that the plug can be pulled at any time, and knowing that there is a perfectly viable alternative (books), then he has no one to blame but himself.
Fortunately, there are plenty of us that still get along just fine with pen and paper.
Owner and Proprietor of the House of Trolls.
God of ownership and possession.
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7 months ago ::
Nov 28, 2012 - 5:54PM
#37
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Date Joined:
Aug 30, 2007
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Same thing tahs happened to every other edition. A couple of years after the end 4th ed will be restricted to a handful of holdouts and it will be difficult to find players for it.
I don't know. It seems that there was a pretty sizable 3e (or Pathfinder, I consider them to be pretty much the same anyway) following while 4e was out.
Owner and Proprietor of the House of Trolls.
God of ownership and possession.
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7 months ago ::
Nov 28, 2012 - 5:57PM
#38
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Date Joined:
Jun 17, 2003
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Actually while I know this was intended to be a joke, perhaps for the first time in RPG history, it's really not. 4E has gotten to the point where a lot of 4E players need and depend on the online tools (esp Char Builder) to actually play the game because the errata is so bloated and scattered, and the various class abilities and powers are scattered over dozens of "core" books and magazines.
So if when Wotc pulls the plug on 4E character support, they really will be (in effect) breaking into a large section of the 4E fanbase and destroying their 4e books.
-Polaris
If a player makes himself reliant on a set of online tools, knowing from the start (at least from the switch to online instead of downloaded tools) that the plug can be pulled at any time, and knowing that there is a perfectly viable alternative (books), then he has no one to blame but himself.
Fortunately, there are plenty of us that still get along just fine with pen and paper.
I think that's a little disengenous for a couple of reasons.
1. Until this last year there was no reason to think that 4E was going to last any less time than any other edition (i.e 8 years or so). That was Wotc's own projection btw and not mine.
2. There are over 100 pages of errata in 4E many of which almost completely rewrite entire sections of 'core' books, and because 'everything is core' critical information is scattered over many books (somtimes as many as a dozen or more).
It's this last explosion of information that very often makes it nearly impossible to make a character without some sort of computer support, and the only current support is on line. Likewise the huge amounts of errata make it difficult to trust any rules sort other than the most current compilation......which is entirely online.
-Polaris
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7 months ago ::
Nov 28, 2012 - 6:33PM
#39
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Date Joined:
Aug 30, 2007
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I think that's a little disengenous for a couple of reasons.
1. Until this last year there was no reason to think that 4E was going to last any less time than any other edition (i.e 8 years or so). That was Wotc's own projection btw and not mine.
2. There are over 100 pages of errata in 4E many of which almost completely rewrite entire sections of 'core' books, and because 'everything is core' critical information is scattered over many books (somtimes as many as a dozen or more).
It's this last explosion of information that very often makes it nearly impossible to make a character without some sort of computer support, and the only current support is on line. Likewise the huge amounts of errata make it difficult to trust any rules sort other than the most current compilation......which is entirely online.
-Polaris
Nonetheless, it was known that 4e would end at some point. There was no way of knowing when it would come, but even if it was after 20 years, there's no way to be certain that you would like what replaced it.
Errata can be printed. It's organized by book so despite it covering many supplements, it's not hard to locate the pertinent material. I prefer to print it and keep it with the book. You could also have it in pdf form so that you can search it. As for large portions of the books being rewritten, often it is a minor change but if they change one word, they reprint the entire stat block.
Anyway, the point remains that there is a viable alternative. WotC can turn off DDI but they can't turn off the game. So whether or not you continue to play will be entirely up to you. If you choose not to, there's nothing wrong with that, just don't blame WotC for it.
Owner and Proprietor of the House of Trolls.
God of ownership and possession.
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7 months ago ::
Nov 28, 2012 - 6:55PM
#40
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Date Joined:
Jun 17, 2003
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I think that's a little disengenous for a couple of reasons.
1. Until this last year there was no reason to think that 4E was going to last any less time than any other edition (i.e 8 years or so). That was Wotc's own projection btw and not mine.
2. There are over 100 pages of errata in 4E many of which almost completely rewrite entire sections of 'core' books, and because 'everything is core' critical information is scattered over many books (somtimes as many as a dozen or more).
It's this last explosion of information that very often makes it nearly impossible to make a character without some sort of computer support, and the only current support is on line. Likewise the huge amounts of errata make it difficult to trust any rules sort other than the most current compilation......which is entirely online.
-Polaris
Nonetheless, it was known that 4e would end at some point. There was no way of knowing when it would come, but even if it was after 20 years, there's no way to be certain that you would like what replaced it.
Errata can be printed. It's organized by book so despite it covering many supplements, it's not hard to locate the pertinent material. I prefer to print it and keep it with the book. You could also have it in pdf form so that you can search it. As for large portions of the books being rewritten, often it is a minor change but if they change one word, they reprint the entire stat block.
Anyway, the point remains that there is a viable alternative. WotC can turn off DDI but they can't turn off the game. So whether or not you continue to play will be entirely up to you. If you choose not to, there's nothing wrong with that, just don't blame WotC for it.
I disagree. Wotc made it deliberately difficult to nearly impossible to play 4E without using online support, more so than any other edition of DnD in history. Moreover, they made the on-line support an integral part of the game from almost the beginning, and made it basically impossible to keep up with the latest errata and changes without using online support. Certainly they made it so that going completely online was so inconvenient that many have found it basically impossible.
I do blame Wotc for this especially when they look to pull the online rug out from under their own customers to force an edition change with forced obsolescence.
-Polaris
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