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7 months ago ::
Nov 14, 2012 - 11:22PM
#91
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Date Joined:
Jun 27, 2004
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Didn't they hint at the cleric getting ED?
Is it, perhaps, 3/4ths of the ED the other classes get?
If they do, then they're going to need to ditch the quadratic dice growth mechanic. Maybe fighters end up with 20 arbitrary dice, clerics get 15 dice, and wizards get 10.
Hmm.. maybe half that, actually. That should be enough, without being overwhelming.
*BOOM* Illusionist's crossbow Deadly Strike for 10d6.
In this thread, we rebuild the 3e "Base Attack Bonus" for a "bounded accuracy" system. 
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Yes, I am expressing my opinions (even complaints - le gasp!) about the current iteration of the play-test that we actually have in front of us.
No, I'm not going to wait for you to tell me when it's okay to start expressing my concerns (unless you are WotC).
(And no, my comments on this forum are not of the same tone or quality as my actual survey feedback.)
A Psion for Next (Playable Draft)A Barbarian for Next (Brainstorming Still)My 4e Projects
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7 months ago ::
Nov 14, 2012 - 11:29PM
#92
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Date Joined:
Mar 26, 2007
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ED is now coming off as a bit lazy design.
I don't know that I'd characterize it as lazy per se, but it certainly seems to be the easy design, much the same way that 4e's "Everyone uses the same power structure" was an easy way to design for balance, but certainly not the only way.
Yes, that was homogenisation of the classes, which I detest.
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7 months ago ::
Nov 15, 2012 - 5:25AM
#93
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Date Joined:
Jan 29, 2005
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I like the suggestion of having each manuever determine the die size (and/or max die size), and the classes determine the number. On the character sheet, just put the die size in parenthesis after the maneuver. Personally, I'd rather not have to deal with a mixed ED dice progression, such as d6+d4, but since other people like it, I'm not gonna get bent out of shape if it becomes a module.
I also liked the (possibly conflicting to above) idea of having the maneuvers pick the top X dice from the total dice pool.
Magic Dual Color Test
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7 months ago ::
Nov 15, 2012 - 8:45AM
#94
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I still think an expertise pool is the better way to go. Fighters gain 1 expertise point at level 1 and every odd level thereafter. Each maneuver has a cost in expertise points. Deadly strike can might cost X and deal +1[W] damage per point spent on a successful hit, but you must declare deadly strike before you use it. Parry could cost X and reduce damage by 2 per point spent. Whirlwind could cost 3 points and allow you to make a single attack roll which you compare to all adjacent creatures, then do full damage to everyone who was hit.
This method simplifies and streamlines expertise dice significantly while keeping a linear growth.
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7 months ago ::
Nov 15, 2012 - 9:18AM
#95
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Date Joined:
Jan 15, 2009
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I still think an expertise pool is the better way to go. Fighters gain 1 expertise point at level 1 and every odd level thereafter. Each maneuver has a cost in expertise points. Deadly strike can might cost X and deal +1[W] damage per point spent on a successful hit, but you must declare deadly strike before you use it. Parry could cost X and reduce damage by 2 per point spent. Whirlwind could cost 3 points and allow you to make a single attack roll which you compare to all adjacent creatures, then do full damage to everyone who was hit. This method simplifies and streamlines expertise dice significantly while keeping a linear growth.
I like the idea too... making them dice has a certain physical reminder element to it in actual play that is kind of appealing though.
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7 months ago ::
Nov 15, 2012 - 9:26AM
#96
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Date Joined:
Feb 13, 2012
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I still think an expertise pool is the better way to go. Fighters gain 1 expertise point at level 1 and every odd level thereafter. Each maneuver has a cost in expertise points. Deadly strike can might cost X and deal +1[W] damage per point spent on a successful hit, but you must declare deadly strike before you use it. Parry could cost X and reduce damage by 2 per point spent. Whirlwind could cost 3 points and allow you to make a single attack roll which you compare to all adjacent creatures, then do full damage to everyone who was hit. This method simplifies and streamlines expertise dice significantly while keeping a linear growth.
I like the idea too... making them dice has a certain physical reminder element to it in actual play that is kind of appealing though.
I like the physical quality of dice, too. In the old days, "dice" meant six-sided dice. Why not have expertise simply be in "dice." "Dice" would default to six-siders, but some maneuvers could roll different dices. Deadly attack could, as Lawolf suggests, be [W] dice. I think that's a particularly good idea since the damage dice of a weapon seem to get lost in the noise of bonuses in D&D today and ED in D&D Next, but weapon choice is supposed to be important. Particularly, choosing not to use a shield to use a bigger weapon, which is a poor choice if weapon damage is a trivial component of total damage.
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7 months ago ::
Nov 20, 2012 - 1:14PM
#97
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Date Joined:
May 11, 2006
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I, too, like the tangibility of dice. In fact, I see players of XD characters having their little pool of dice, specific to their XD value, in front of them. I know I will.
So... My 10th level fighter (I'm sticking with my house-ruled all d6s system for this) has 5d6. In addition to all the other dice I need to play my character, I've also got five special 6-sided dice in front of me, in a little pile. As I spend them, I set them aside. When my turn ends, I grab them all back up and set them in front of me again. Rinse. Repeat.
That just seems cool to me. YMMV...
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6 months ago ::
Nov 25, 2012 - 6:48PM
#98
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I think the expertise dice should track with spell damage of wizards to some degree. I don't like the current big jump from 2d8 to 3d10 at level 10
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6 months ago ::
Nov 25, 2012 - 7:58PM
#99
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Date Joined:
May 18, 2002
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I think the expertise dice should track with spell damage of wizards to some degree. I don't like the current big jump from 2d8 to 3d10 at level 10
It should be theoretically possible to synch ExD with spell levels.
Weight the spell-levels (slots * spellLevel), and do some basic algebra to deduce the number and size of ExD.
Right now, it looks like they're fudging it around 3E Power Attack values.
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6 months ago ::
Nov 26, 2012 - 12:22PM
#100
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Date Joined:
Sep 24, 2007
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I, too, like the tangibility of dice. In fact, I see players of XD characters having their little pool of dice, specific to their XD value, in front of them. I know I will.
So... My 10th level fighter (I'm sticking with my house-ruled all d6s system for this) has 5d6. In addition to all the other dice I need to play my character, I've also got five special 6-sided dice in front of me, in a little pile. As I spend them, I set them aside. When my turn ends, I grab them all back up and set them in front of me again. Rinse. Repeat.
That just seems cool to me. YMMV...
I agree here. The idea of generic points, with the die size determined by the individual maneuver, seems like the most balanced approach, leading to more possibilities in maneuver desing while keeping them fair, but I just really like the idea of having a little pile of dice in front of me, reminding me they exist, showing how many I have left and how many I've spent, etc.
I also think varying the dice progression by class would be very flavorful and make things feel less generic. More smaller dice results in easier use of maneuvers that don't actually roll the dice, as well as more ability to split dice between smaller actions, but fewer larger dice provides better results with "roll X, keep Y" maneuvers, since the maximum result is higher.
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