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8 months ago ::
Oct 10, 2012 - 9:30AM
#11
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Date Joined:
Feb 10, 2007
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I'm a random loot type of guy.
I don't much care what the characters in the adventure I'm writing are as long as they are of the appropriate level range. Most of the time I give the players the choice of which character they play when we start. I usually set up my games so that after a while all of the players have characters of different levels and classes they can use. sometimes they, as a group, will form an adventuring company and use those characters when ever I have conttent for them to play, other times some one will have a lower level character they really want to play and will use that PC rather than one more on par with the group's level.
This usually means that when I write the adventure or modify one I bought I don't know who will be playing what. I just design at a certain level and roll up treasures.
The point is I never put specific items in a dungeon for specific characters. Too bad WotC D&D fouled this up by requiring items as prt of the math. I'm glad that one of the things I really hate about 3e and pathfinder is being dispensed with in Next.
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8 months ago ::
Oct 10, 2012 - 10:35AM
#12
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Date Joined:
Aug 31, 2007
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I think you took a wrong turn, thats not even close to the point I was making. As much as I roll for magic items, I often fudge results on everything, I dont let players miss out too much, likewise I dont let one player be showered in riches constantly. I know a powerful magical item can shift the course of a campaign... but its a powerful magic item surely thats what its meant to do. I just think DMs should know this before they give them out and plan accorgingly.
You are right, that is really an entirely different issue then what I thought you where talking about.
There are really two issues here that the rules need to cover, but if they do there is nothing wrong with having powerful magic items. First, the powerful items need to be clearly marked. Right now the rules try to pack item rarity and power level into one code and this confuses the issue, they need to be seperated. Second, the rules need to have some advice for DMs on how powerful items will chance the balance. This is particularly true of items like Gloves of Ogre Strength, which an inexperienced DM can easily drop into a campaign as a small boost for the Fighter only to see them become an huge boost for the cleric or rogue.
As a side note, the game needs a better and more comprehensive set of minor items. The test rules are way overloaded with items for high level characters and rather short of items suitable for 1-5th level characters. This is probably just a side effect of the rules sample being mostly conversions of classic items, so I expect it will go away, but it needs to be addressed at some point.
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8 months ago ::
Oct 10, 2012 - 10:40AM
#13
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Date Joined:
Apr 23, 2009
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My gut reaction is I really like the magic items. WOTC though does seem to choose one extreme and then allow themselves to get beaten back by the other side. So I am fearful that what they've advertised this first roudn won't make it into the game.
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8 months ago ::
Oct 10, 2012 - 10:44AM
#14
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Date Joined:
May 24, 2012
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My gut reaction is I really like the magic items. WOTC though does seem to choose one extreme and then allow themselves to get beaten back by the other side. So I am fearful that what they've advertised this first roudn won't make it into the game.
That is my fear as well. I think they have done some fantastic work here with magic items, and I'd hate to see them back down from putting them into the final game. They have some work to do in order to get the values, rarity, random tables, etc. into a more accurate and reasonable form, but the items themselves are great.
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8 months ago ::
Oct 10, 2012 - 10:53AM
#15
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Date Joined:
Mar 22, 2008
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You examples show how it is important for a DM to know how a magic item will affect their campaign. I think this is where some people have issues.
Absolutely true, which is why it's important that the DMG include guidance to explain how a magic item will affect their campaign.
It's their fault if they don't read it, but it's our fault if we don't write it.
Technically, it's WoTC's fault if they don't write it. I take no blame for their decisions 
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8 months ago ::
Oct 10, 2012 - 10:54AM
#16
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Date Joined:
Jun 17, 2010
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"we" used rather generally.
D&D Next = D&D: Quantum Edition
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8 months ago ::
Oct 10, 2012 - 10:58AM
#17
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Date Joined:
Mar 22, 2008
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"we" used rather generally.
I got it. My post was humor. Ar! Ar! Ar! (Mork laugh)
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8 months ago ::
Oct 10, 2012 - 11:27AM
#18
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Date Joined:
Aug 22, 2007
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I am okay will rolling.
The more important this are:
Characters have enough class features what a single item doesn't replace them.
The DM understands the implications of placing a very rare and powerful item.
The designers do the rarities right
Orzel, Halfelven son of Zel, Mystic Ranger, Bane to Dragons, Death to Undeath, Killer of Abyssals, King of the Wilds.
Constitution Based Class for Next!
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8 months ago ::
Oct 10, 2012 - 4:20PM
#19
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Date Joined:
Apr 16, 2009
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I could go with random rolling of magic items... if it's structured to the party.
At some point, through some process, you should be randomly choosing between magic items that are suitable for some specific member of the party. And, whether by random rolling or by some other form of machination, *which* member should be more or less evenly spread.
If you're rolling up a magic item for the dedicated archer, and you get a greatsword... nope, try again. In fact, if you CAN get a greatsword in that context, maybe you need to restructure the tables.
If you ever come up with a magic item that no member of the party would plausibly use... that isn't a magic item, that's a disguised bag of gold coins.
"The world does not work the way you have been taught it does. We are not real as such; we exist within The Story. Unfortunately for you, you have inherited a condition from your mother known as Primary Protagonist Syndrome, which means The Story is interested in you. It will find you, and if you are not ready for the narrative strands it will throw at you..." - from Footloose
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8 months ago ::
Oct 10, 2012 - 6:46PM
#20
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Date Joined:
Jul 19, 2012
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I am okay will rolling. The more important this are: Characters have enough class features what a single item doesn't replace them.
I think the critical thing is to get the game's magic item system right so that no matter what or how many magic items a PC has, it doesn't break the system and doesn't eclipse a PC's class features.
The DM understands the implications of placing a very rare and powerful item. The designers do the rarities right
I think DM understanding is the key but the magic items as they stand won't interact well with the current system and there are a few too many 'rare and powerful' game breakers. At the moment, I think the system is a bit too fragile to cope with a very rare and powerful magic item because it is a game-breaker. Unfortunately, the knee jerk reaction is to limit their usage rather than find a workable solution and change the nature of magic items so that they don't break your system but still leave them with a whole heap of flavor that enhances the game.
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