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9 months ago ::
Oct 08, 2012 - 5:43AM
#21
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Date Joined:
Jun 22, 2010
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I think it will be easy to maintain the primal link as flavor, but from a mechanical standpoint I would place them under the Cleric core class. Just like you have sorcerer and warlocks as alternate wizards, the druid and the paladin can be placed under the cleric. And where the cleric is the middle of the road divine class with the most options, the druid would tend towards specialized domains and a closer tie to nature and the paladin would be the martial side of the cleric, but still have access to a diety.
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9 months ago ::
Oct 08, 2012 - 6:00AM
#22
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- Forum Guide
- Hero Craftsman Gold Medalist
- Master Dungeon Master
Date Joined:
Jun 23, 2005
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Just to clarify, animists dont “worship” nature spirits. The sentence would be more like, “Druids respect nature spirits”. Its more about good neighborly relations.
Fair enough.
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9 months ago ::
Oct 08, 2012 - 8:48AM
#23
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I want them to have their own spell list with completely different spells. Beyond that don't really care
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9 months ago ::
Oct 08, 2012 - 9:56AM
#24
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Date Joined:
Sep 10, 2005
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I think one of the flaws of 4th was the decision to delineate classes by power source. It didn't leave appropriate design space for classes that straddled the line between two areas. I think part of what makes a paladin so hard to distinguish from a cleric in some peoples mind is that power source mentality.
To me a cleric was a divine agent of a god or pantheon or religion. The paladin was a martial champion (albeit reinforced and empowered by his faith) of cause X (which could be a god or pantheon or religion, but might also be a cause or code).
I think power source thinking tends to force false choices that don't really add a lot of value.
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9 months ago ::
Oct 08, 2012 - 11:31AM
#25
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Date Joined:
May 22, 2003
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You and I think very differently about Druids .
I see the young Druid-to-be as being drawn to Nature and abiding there alone to gain a deeper inight into it (rather than seeking out, say, a mentor or tome). Perhaps they might learn a great deal from discovering their instinctual bond with Nature. OTOH, they are just as likely to learn from an animal, spirit, or fey guide as they are from another Druid. In fact, in my view, one Druid may never meet another, and still be powerful and knowledgeable.
I immediately thought 'witch' when reading this. 
Druids definitely have a system of tutelage in my mind. There is structure, hierarchy, ways and customs to their practice, and the 'wizard of the natural world' thing definitely resonates with me.
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9 months ago ::
Oct 08, 2012 - 12:02PM
#26
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I don't particularly care ... the druid isn't a class I've ever been drawn to. That said, I'd rather they not proliferate the power sources, and making druids divine makes as much sense as anything else.
Hopefully they won't be returning to the 'power yank if you and the DM disagree on your character concept' crap in any case.
Another day, another three or four entries to my Ignore List.
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9 months ago ::
Oct 09, 2012 - 12:52PM
#27
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You and I think very differently about Druids .
I see the young Druid-to-be as being drawn to Nature and abiding there alone to gain a deeper inight into it (rather than seeking out, say, a mentor or tome). Perhaps they might learn a great deal from discovering their instinctual bond with Nature. OTOH, they are just as likely to learn from an animal, spirit, or fey guide as they are from another Druid. In fact, in my view, one Druid may never meet another, and still be powerful and knowledgeable.
Well, I can't comment on how people think druids ought to work in a fantasy universe. That's completely subjective.
However, I can say that the historical Celtic social class known as the Druids were pretty definitely well-organized and underwent long educations learning the oral lore from other Druids. We know frustratingly few details, but that much is clear. From the way the Romans talked about them, they seem to have been kind of like Greek philosophers, Jewish rabbis, or even Buddhist monks of the non-hermetic persuasion, though they stubbornly refused to write things down AARGH.
Anyway, I think the issue, when it comes to talking about "druids" in D&D, is that there is also the widespread character archetype of the shaman - the spirit-talking "primitive" animist guy - and this gets conflated with the druid.
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9 months ago ::
Oct 09, 2012 - 12:55PM
#28
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Date Joined:
Sep 10, 2005
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Power source seemed to have zero mechanical impact in 4e.
If it continues this way, I see no reason why it even needs addressed. Does it really matter if a druid gets it powers from: primal energy, gods of nature, animal spirits, or mother earth herself?
This seems like campaign specific flavor detail that ought to be addressed there.
Power source had mechanical impact in that Barbarians had invocations and Paladins had prayers (both of which would have been spells in earlier editions) as their main attacks. It wasn't just power source, but also marrying it to class mechanics.
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9 months ago ::
Oct 09, 2012 - 12:58PM
#29
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Date Joined:
Sep 10, 2005
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You and I think very differently about Druids .
I see the young Druid-to-be as being drawn to Nature and abiding there alone to gain a deeper inight into it (rather than seeking out, say, a mentor or tome). Perhaps they might learn a great deal from discovering their instinctual bond with Nature. OTOH, they are just as likely to learn from an animal, spirit, or fey guide as they are from another Druid. In fact, in my view, one Druid may never meet another, and still be powerful and knowledgeable.
Well, I can't comment on how people think druids ought to work in a fantasy universe. That's completely subjective.
However, I can say that the historical Celtic social class known as the Druids were pretty definitely well-organized and underwent long educations learning the oral lore from other Druids. We know frustratingly few details, but that much is clear. From the way the Romans talked about them, they seem to have been kind of like Greek philosophers, Jewish rabbis, or even Buddhist monks of the non-hermetic persuasion, though they stubbornly refused to write things down AARGH.
Anyway, I think the issue, when it comes to talking about "druids" in D&D, is that there is also the widespread character archetype of the shaman - the spirit-talking "primitive" animist guy - and this gets conflated with the druid.
That said I could easily see Druids being nature magic analogues to Wizards while Shamans are more along the lines of Sorcerers or even Warlocks.
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9 months ago ::
Oct 09, 2012 - 12:59PM
#30
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That said I could easily see Druids being nature magic analogues to Wizards while Shamans are more along the lines of Sorcerers or even Warlocks.
That's actually a really interesting idea.
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