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8 months ago ::
Oct 09, 2012 - 11:22AM
#131
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- Forum Guide
- Hero Craftsman Gold Medalist
- Master Dungeon Master
Date Joined:
Jun 23, 2005
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That would just be eliminating families and making all these benefits a combat superiority option. But the whole point is to differentiate weapons, so the complaint of "I don't like maces being different than hammers" is sort of just saying "I don't want weapons to be differentiated."
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8 months ago ::
Oct 09, 2012 - 11:32AM
#132
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- Forum Guide
- Hero Craftsman Gold Medalist
- Master Dungeon Master
Date Joined:
Jun 23, 2005
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Idea for staves:
Staff: Weapons in this family are "doubling". On a hit, roll damage twice, as if you successfully attacked twice in one round. If the attack roll was a critical hit, only the first instance of damage is treated as a critical hit.
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8 months ago ::
Oct 09, 2012 - 12:10PM
#133
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Date Joined:
Jun 21, 2012
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well the differentiation would still be there, but it wouldn't be as specific. Really, the one that seems to make the least sense to people's brains is the hammer/mace thing. It doesn't especially bother me but when we get new comments about the system, that's one of the first things people say. So aside from the families both being blunt weapons, I'm kinda interested in hearing what it is about them being different categories that stands out.
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8 months ago ::
Oct 09, 2012 - 12:12PM
#134
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Date Joined:
Jun 21, 2012
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Idea for staves:
Staff: Weapons in this family are "doubling". On a hit, roll damage twice, as if you successfully attacked twice in one round. If the attack roll was a critical hit, only the first instance of damage is treated as a critical hit.
I can dig it. The staff family would be another one that really wouldn't include anything shorter than (really) long. (or longer than really short). A baton is more of a mace or club, right?
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8 months ago ::
Oct 09, 2012 - 1:41PM
#135
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Date Joined:
Jan 29, 2005
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A jo stick would be a one-handed staff. Similarly, the Dark Sun weapon "singing stick" could be a one-handed staff.
@wrecan: wouldn't the giving up advantage requirement mess with Sneak Attack? Is it intended to be incompatible, or should a rogue be able to get the familial benefits along with Sneak Attack?
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8 months ago ::
Oct 09, 2012 - 1:54PM
#136
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Date Joined:
Jun 21, 2012
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A jo stick would be a one-handed staff. Similarly, the Dark Sun weapon "singing stick" could be a one-handed staff.
@wrecan: wouldn't the giving up advantage requirement mess with Sneak Attack? Is it intended to be incompatible, or should a rogue be able to get the familial benefits along with Sneak Attack?
I've trained with a jo, and you can't wield it one handed. It doesn't require more than one hand to support it but without the other hand to control your strike you can't really get any power or do anything interesting with it.
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8 months ago ::
Oct 09, 2012 - 2:11PM
#137
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Date Joined:
Jul 19, 2012
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Except twirl it. Twirling can be interesting. I would have to say that only 2h staves would benefit from doubling.
On a related note, if you wanted to reintroduce those stupid double weapons from 3e then they could end up as reflavored staves with a different damage type. However, would a reflavored double sword (for instance) be both a staff and a blade? If this is the case, then I guess it does raise the subject of weapons having multiple family advantages and if they do, what does that mean for the use of exotic weapons? Or do we draw a line in the sand and say "A weapon can only belong to one family, choose wisely"?
@Mithrus: It really depends largely on whether the 'advantage sacrifice' is actually giving up advantage or giving up the benefit from having advantage. I guess that should be clarified because you raise a very good point.
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8 months ago ::
Oct 09, 2012 - 2:18PM
#138
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Date Joined:
Jul 19, 2012
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I would have to say that only 2h staves would benefit from doubling.
Actually, I think all staves are 2 handed. Otherwise they are classified as sticks (as used in stick fighting and gatka or whatever) which would probably be classfied as close or short maces.
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8 months ago ::
Oct 09, 2012 - 2:46PM
#139
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Date Joined:
Jan 29, 2005
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A jo stick would be a one-handed staff. Similarly, the Dark Sun weapon "singing stick" could be a one-handed staff.
@wrecan: wouldn't the giving up advantage requirement mess with Sneak Attack? Is it intended to be incompatible, or should a rogue be able to get the familial benefits along with Sneak Attack?
I've trained with a jo, and you can't wield it one handed. It doesn't require more than one hand to support it but without the other hand to control your strike you can't really get any power or do anything interesting with it.
Isn't the bo staff the longer version? IIRC, the jo stick was considerably shorter (like 2' instead of 5-6'). Then there is the tetsubo(sp), which IIRC was similar but had metal studs.
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8 months ago ::
Oct 09, 2012 - 4:34PM
#140
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Date Joined:
Jun 21, 2012
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Isn't the bo staff the longer version? IIRC, the jo stick was considerably shorter (like 2' instead of 5-6'). Then there is the tetsubo(sp), which IIRC was similar but had metal studs.
The jo staff is just over four feet in length. Ish. Basically, if you hold it vertically with one end resting on the floor, it's generally around the height of a bar. Wikipedia's got a decent article about it, actually. It's definitely a hand-and-a-half (long) weapon.
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