..."window.parent.tinyMCE.get('post_content').onLoad.dispatch();" contenteditable="true" />The DM Created world is inherently superior to the cannonical setting because it empowers
Rather it REQUIRES. The DM is deprived of a crutch, one that he typically very much needs. Go to a fan art site and see how much is just trash, junk you would never consider paying money for. Almost all those artists think they are hot stuff despite the clear evidence to the contrary. Same thing applies to our DM. He is routinely turning out stuff that is sharply inferior to the professional work. If he wants the ego satisfaction, that is his business, but you don't want to be stealing the trash when there is serious work around.
the DM to make new stories, as opposed to empowering "whoever reads more cannon fiction". I don't know how many times I've been in/run a campaign based in an official setting only to have a player say "But according to X book, Y and Z have an ABC relationship, so what you're doing makes no sense",
Which is to say that players have an expectation about the game, and a desire that those expectations be followed. To be creating highly different stuff is denying the player what he wants out of the game. This can be the DM's right, but saying that is superior is clearly wrong.
which forces the DM to either capitulate, or depart from cannon (or come up with a plot reason for the event to occur).
which is a lot easier to do than start from nothing. "But Robin Hood steals from the rich and gives to the poor..." "My press agent really deserves a raise..."
it's an absolute necessity for all but a dedicated Gamist campaign; subjecting yourself and your players to the confines of a pre-generated campaign world is only desireable if you are a newer group needing the comfort of defined aspects or need some sort of universal consistency (and financial backing) as with the RPGA.
Which is the normal case, and the desired one. We are overrun by Drizzt clones because they appeal to the players. That they are so noob has no standing. We are here to supply those players with what they want, not with what we think is a neat idea.
The reason I don't work for WotC, despite believing my self-created campaign worlds are superior is because ... the two have nothing to do with each other. Forgotten Realms having decades of fiction by professional writers and descriptive texts (including an amusing Atlas complete with an interview with Eliminster!) has absolutely nothing to do with the fact that I can run a better game by deciding the campaign specifics for myself.
But what proof do we have of that? That you say you are better is nothing. We have hundreds, even thousands, who say they are the very best. We know nearly all of them are wrong, and don't rule out that they all are. By contrast, the professional has the vote of someone who put up solid money on that idea.
People who work for WotC are not automatically more creative than anyone else,
"The battle is not always to the strong, nor the race to the swift, but that's the way to bet." The phrase, "not automatically" should immediately alert us that the speaker is taking the minority position. He will be right in some tiny percentage of the cases, but wrong in the great majority.
And you are jumping to a rather absurd conclusion about monkey's statement that Elf/Eladrin/Drow are all Mimbari. Elf/Eladrin/Drow are all Elves in D&D, they are also all separate races (with sub-races to boot!) so assuming that the different castes remain separate in the exact same way is absurd pessimism.
Monkey made them all parts of the same society, instead of different societies. This sharply limits the number of possible relationships, and not in a way that is good for the game. In general, the picture of what is a drow or elf just has to be thrown out. Indeed, one wonders why the use of "drow" or "elf" even happened.
For my campaign, the loss of distinction between elven cultures worked because my players enjoyed it. Whether it would work for any other group is irrelevant. Again, I never said that my example is the only way it should be. The point of sharing ideas is to provide examples and perhaps even inspiration. If someone likes it, cool. If not, also cool.
Attacking the idea, or the poster, however, is not cool.
Quentin Small WotC Online Community Coordinator All around helpful simian
People who work for WotC are not automatically more creative than anyone else,
"The battle is not always to the strong, nor the race to the swift, but that's the way to bet." The phrase, "not automatically" should immediately alert us that the speaker is taking the minority position. He will be right in some tiny percentage of the cases, but wrong in the great majority.
Attacking how I argue instead of the argument is a sure sign of being unable to do so. That's just smarmy, and outside of my utter boredom at the moment, I wouldn't even dain to reply to such a remark.
I can't very well say that most people who work for WotC are not very creative because I don't know them personally. I do know that RA Salvatore books are better written than what little fiction comes with the published adventures, and that he is not highly regarded amongst fantasy authors both in terms of creativity and writing ability. I do know that rather that create new content, WotC has repeatedly reissued old content. I know that the magazine content is significantly contributed by 3rd party 'freelance' writers, and that I am one of them. Are WotC employees more creative than the average person? Neither of us could say for sure, but I can tell you that they'll be closer to the middle than the top, because those at the top are capable of self-employment, and would prefer to do so rather than deal with the authoritarian guidelines required to work for The Company. Because that's what it really comes down to, regardless of the creativity of any given employee, it takes a back seat to the overall vision of the corporate ladder. It's August, I want to write about modrons- Nope, I have to put out something about Drow, that's not creativity at work.
Being a professional is in no way relevant to the quality of your work.
(Any situations or opinions expressed herein are not based on actual persons, places, or events)
And you are jumping to a rather absurd conclusion about monkey's statement that Elf/Eladrin/Drow are all Mimbari. Elf/Eladrin/Drow are all Elves in D&D, they are also all separate races (with sub-races to boot!) so assuming that the different castes remain separate in the exact same way is absurd pessimism.
Monkey made them all parts of the same society, instead of different societies. This sharply limits the number of possible relationships, and not in a way that is good for the game. In general, the picture of what is a drow or elf just has to be thrown out. Indeed, one wonders why the use of "drow" or "elf" even happened.
Then you know little of B5. An intergalactic empire (if I may call it that) is going to have far more distinct societies, political intricacies, sects, etc. than could ever develop on a single planet. It's also a return to the more correct way of thinking of having a single race with a variety of characteristics (Tough/Wise elves don't exist, right?)
I don't even feel like responding the rest of it, since I feel Salla is correct.
"Invokers are probably better round after round but Wizard dailies are devastating. Actually, devastating is too light a word. Wizard daily powers are soul crushing, encounter ending, havoc causing pieces of awesome." -AirPower25 Sear the Flesh, Purify the Soul; Harden the Heart, and Improve the Mind; Born of Blood, but Forged by Fire; The MECH warrior reaches perfection.
You do a great job crazy_monkey. You have always been very patient and fair from what I've seen. I'm paid to be creative in real life, but it doesn't translate to D&D as well as I would like most of the time. But, my take is if you're having fun and those around you are having fun, then that's all that matters.
My job with Wizards of the Coast is all about communicating with the community and making sure the creative team gets your feedback.
So, while I consider myself creative (or, at least, I pretend to be creative on a regular basis), I'm not paid to be creative.
If you and your players are enjoying the flavor/fluff, that's the only thing you need, you don't need anybody else to think it's good or to enjoy it.
I am sure alot of people would call BS on my settings and the flavor of my campaing, with time travel, lovecraftian abominations, and feywild that replace your mind with one of animals such as dogs and cows, and curses that force you to talk always in a question otherwise it make your head explode.
As with the elves = B5 Minbari example, I generally mine other sources for ideas and reflavor them a lot or a little depending on what I need them for. I borrow from TV, movies, books, and other games frequently.
Quentin Small WotC Online Community Coordinator All around helpful simian
People who work for WotC are not automatically more creative than anyone else,
"The battle is not always to the strong, nor the race to the swift, but that's the way to bet." The phrase, "not automatically" should immediately alert us that the speaker is taking the minority position. He will be right in some tiny percentage of the cases, but wrong in the great majority.
Attacking how I argue instead of the argument is a sure sign of being unable to do so.
Attacking how one argues is a standard part of any argument. One is supposed to identify fallacies and other defects [and deceptions] in an opposing argument [or in one's own for that matter]. And the presence of the previous sentence, a different argument, makes the use of "instead" distinctly suspect.
I can't very well say that most people who work for WotC are not very creative because I don't know them personally.
And you would likely not know [or know] even if you did know them personally. It is their work we wish to judge, not things like social skills. Joe can be a social dud unable to speak a coherent sentence and still can churn out excellent work. Now we should note here that we are not interested in creativity. [We started the conversation talking about stealing ideas, about the precise opposite of creative.] We want settings that thrill and interest the player, and if those are complete clones with zero originality, that is fine. If it is original and bad, it is simply bad.
Are WotC employees more creative than the average person? Neither of us could say for sure, but I can tell you that they'll be closer to the middle than the top, because those at the top are capable of self-employment,
This depends in part on the definition of "top" and "middle" used. The top, defined as those capable of self-employment, is the 99th percentile, and not all of it. Our middle then extends up to 98th percentile and we are pretty safe in thinking WOTC hires from the 90s, not the 50'. They simply have the choice.
regardless of the creativity of any given employee, it takes a back seat to the overall vision of the corporate ladder. It's August, I want to write about modrons- Nope, I have to put out something about Drow, that's not creativity at work.
Which is why I said crativity is not a major value here. You may want to write about modrons while the company wants you to write about drow. Now which do you think the player wants to read about? And we are trying to please the player, not the writer. You do not want to creat a really original setting and have the players never come back. Much better some dull clone with zero originality and great player acceptance.
Being a professional is in no way relevant to the quality of your work.
Rather obvious nonsense. There will be the exceptions to the rule of course, but routinely our professional has been rated superior by large numbers of people with serious interest in getting the answer right. That a coin flip would have worked as well just won't pass muster.
And you are jumping to a rather absurd conclusion about monkey's statement that Elf/Eladrin/Drow are all Mimbari. Elf/Eladrin/Drow are all Elves in D&D, they are also all separate races (with sub-races to boot!) so assuming that the different castes remain separate in the exact same way is absurd pessimism.
Monkey made them all parts of the same society, instead of different societies. This sharply limits the number of possible relationships, and not in a way that is good for the game. In general, the picture of what is a drow or elf just has to be thrown out. Indeed, one wonders why the use of "drow" or "elf" even happened.
And I have no interest in learning either. It is SF, not fantasy, and while the two are not completely different, they are different, and transfering from one to another has flaws.
An intergalactic empire (if I may call it that) is going to have far more distinct societies, political intricacies, sects, etc. than could ever develop on a single planet.
Which is saying it is inferior for fantasy. [More precisely, it really doesn't make a difference. A planet is way larger than the needed size. The party will be unlikely to experience a hundred cultures and the planet will have thousands. Having millions is a waste. [Actually it is possible for our intergalactic empire to suffer from a shortage of cultures. We have objections to the "McDonald culture" as it is and it is quite possible to think of an intergalactic empire that had less cultural diversity than any of the planets would have had before the steam engine.]
It's also a return to the more correct way of thinking of having a single race with a variety of characteristics (Tough/Wise elves don't exist, right?)
That is the more incorrect way of thinking. Making all races so similar is unreal and boring for the player. [From the reality view, highly similar races can't share the same environment. One or the other vanishes. From the game view, the player does not have a dwarf or elf unless he can tell the difference between them
Wow, I guess it is possible to have a flame war about anything.
D&D is a form of recreation, a hobby. There's no wrong way to do it. I make up my own campaign world, and have for pretty close to 40 years now. People have fun playing in it. That works for me. Is it some sort of wonderful work of art, hell no. It is just a fun pastime and for whatever reason it makes me happy to play that way. My friend runs his campaign using Greyhawk, and my other friend uses Ptolus, and etc. Sometimes we all make up our own stuff, and sometimes we use some WotC or old TSR or Paizo or whatever stuff. Who cares as long as you're having fun?
PERSONALLY I like the drow as 'dark elves', but in my campaign they've been basically forgotten. They're an ancient legend, stories told around camp fires in the dark of night about ancient heroes and villains dead so long even their tombs are lost. A PC drow would be quite shocking, but most people probably wouldn't even know what she was. OTOH certain Eldar lore masters would be quite disturbed by such an appearance...
In most of my games, a drow would mainly be judged on their personal behavior - a drow walking around openly, being well-behaved and clearly demonstrating tendencies to be a hero or at least a well-meaning individual will generally be tolerated if not necessarily accepted. Certainly a drow clearly displaying some mark of service to a Good or Unaligned deity (a paladin, invoker or cleric, probably not so much an avenger) would be more often the subject of confused stares and shaking heads rather than thrown fruit, insults or knives. On the other hand, a drow going out of their way to disguise themselves or behaving in a suspicious manner will definitely be met with suspicion and predjudice. A drow character taking visible pride in their outsider status/bad reputation (a blackguard, for example), throwing it back in the faces of those he meets, or using that status to intimidate people (and otherwise publicly behaving badly) will probably be seen as being at fault for any scuffles or disputes they may be involved in (or had no involvement in but just happened to be near), may well be pointedly asked to leave town or might not get more than a token investigation into any minor "accidents" that may befall them.
Of course, there have been one or two times over the years when the campaign backstory has dictated that relations between drow and the local surface races were actually peaceful if not perfectly cordial. There have also been times when the default fluff of the drow didn't fit the circumstances of the world I was attempting to portray so I completely rewrote it much like Monkey did.
