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10 months ago ::
Aug 30, 2012 - 5:58AM
#1
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Last night at Encounters at my shop we fought an Ochre Jelly. The Ochre jelly split in two.
One of the characters played a card afterwards on his turn that said "all bloodied creatures gain 5 temp HP's"
The DM tried to give the HP's to the Ochre Jelly reasoning that it was still the original Ochre jelly and still officially "bloodied"
The players argued this point and the DM said fine we will treat them as two, brand new seperate creatures.
Now the fun part, before the Ochre Jelly split one of the party memebers was playing an Avenger (yes I know not an Essentials char yada yada) and he had used his oath of Enmity power on the Ochre Jelly.
After the Ochre Jellies had perished (the split ones) he tried using his oath of Enmity again and the DM said NO ruling that since the Ochre Jelly had split into two seperate Ochre Jellies the ORIGINAL Ochre Jelly had never reached 0 HP's therefore not triggering Oath of Enmity being available again.
My thoughts are as follows:
1) It says the Ochre Jelly splits into two creatures, all effects fall off, and it's remaining hit points are split between the 2 - basically saying that it's still the ORIGINAL Ochre Jelly. Technically it is no longer bloodied as it's remaining HP's are divided between them. No HP's for the Ochre Jelly.
2) By this logic the Ochre Jelly is still the Ochre Jelly albeit in two parts. When both die, it is reduced to 0 HP's thus triggering the Oath of Enmity.
The DM's logic was it was either the Jelly gain the Temp Hp's and Oath Triggers, or the Jelly doesn't gain the HP's and the oath does not trigger.
I believe both these options are incorrect.
Thoughts?
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10 months ago ::
Aug 30, 2012 - 6:38AM
#2
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Date Joined:
Jun 23, 2003
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Due to the use of "one" instead of "ones" in the effect line describing the split, "Effects on the original ochre jelly do not apply to the second one," one of the splits clearly remains the original.
The original has at most 1/4 of its unsplit starting hp, making it bloodied before and after the split. It also still has all effects on it, specifically here the OoE.
The second is a new creature with at most 1/4 of the unsplit starting hp, making it unbloodied. It has no conditions of the pre-split creature affecting it.
The sparse wording of the split effect definitely leaves a little room for interpretation =)
INSIDE SCOOP GAMERS: In the new version of D&D, it will no longer be "Edition Wars." It will be "Edition Lair Assault." - dungeonbastard
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10 months ago ::
Aug 30, 2012 - 7:57AM
#3
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Cool, makes sense. thanks.
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10 months ago ::
Aug 30, 2012 - 8:33AM
#4
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Date Joined:
Jun 23, 2003
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glad to add my 2 cents anyway. easily more than a couple ways for that to get resolved to both player and DM satisfaction.
say, are you the Serenity Games from right around the corner in St. Pete, or is the name just a coincidence?
INSIDE SCOOP GAMERS: In the new version of D&D, it will no longer be "Edition Wars." It will be "Edition Lair Assault." - dungeonbastard
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10 months ago ::
Aug 30, 2012 - 9:25AM
#5
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Date Joined:
Aug 10, 2010
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We are indeed THAT Serenity Games! Small world :D
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10 months ago ::
Aug 30, 2012 - 9:41AM
#6
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The second is a new creature with at most 1/4 of the unsplit starting hp, making it unbloodied.
It's a new creature, but it is still an ochre jelly, meaning it has the same bloodied value (and maximum hps in case that becomes relevant - e.g. if it gets healed) as a 'fresh' ochre jelly. So it's definitely bloodied because its current hps are below its bloodied value. The "effects on the original ochre jelly do not apply to the second one" clause won't get rid of the bloodied condition either, because it's a condition, not an effect (effects can include conditions, but they are not interchangeable terms).
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10 months ago ::
Aug 30, 2012 - 9:48AM
#7
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Date Joined:
Aug 10, 2010
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Right, I was never contesting the 2nd Ochre Jelly losing blooding as a condition, as you said, it states effects.
I was questioning whether or not the Jelly (jellies) was the original Jelly, and I got my answer. However, I see your point about the 2nd one being bloodied as well.
Thanks for input guys.
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9 months ago ::
Aug 30, 2012 - 12:20PM
#8
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Date Joined:
Jun 23, 2003
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nice store you guys have there. too far for me to visit regularly, but I like the vibe when I do
I like Duskweaver's answer better, it really is a 2nd ochre jelly with missing hp and not a "brand new creature with identical stats as an ochre jelly except max hp which is 1/4."
INSIDE SCOOP GAMERS: In the new version of D&D, it will no longer be "Edition Wars." It will be "Edition Lair Assault." - dungeonbastard
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9 months ago ::
Aug 30, 2012 - 12:39PM
#9
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Add a leader who can heal for some real fun.
Ochre jelly splits.
Heal the "new" one above bloodied.
The new Orchre jelly can split.
Granted, it needs to be a potent healing (at-will surge+ a bit, or just a high level one), but you can net infinite jellies.
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Pocket Protector Pixie Stealth Knight. Maximizing the defender's aura by being in an ally's/enemy's square.
Yakuza NinjIntimiAdin: Perma-stealth Striker that offers a little protection for ally's, and can intimidate bloodied enemies. Very Strong.
Chargeburgler with cheese Ranged attacks at the end of a charge along with perma-stealth. Solid, could be overpowered if tweaked.
Void Defender Defends giving a penalty to hit anyone but him, then removing himself from play. Can get somewhat broken in epic.
Scry and Die Attacking from around corners, while staying hidden. Moderate to broken, depending on the situation.
Skimisher Fly in, attack, and fly away. Also prevents enemies from coming close. Moderate to Broken depending on the enemy, but shouldn't make the game un-fun, as the rest of your team is at risk, and you have enough weaknesses.
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Sir Robin (Bravely Charge Away) He automatically slows and pushes an enemy (5 squares), while charging away. Hard to rate it's power level, since it's terrain dependent.
Death's Gatekeeper A fun twist on a healic, making your party "unkillable". Overpowered to Broken, but shouldn't actually make the game un-fun, just TPK proof.
Death's Gatekeeper mk2, (Stealth Edition) Make your party "unkillable", and you hidden, while doing solid damage. Stronger then the above, but also easier for a DM to shut down. Broken, until your DM get's enough of it.
Domination and Death Dominate everything then kill them quickly. Only works @ 30, but is broken multiple ways.
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9 months ago ::
Aug 30, 2012 - 1:59PM
#10
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Date Joined:
May 28, 2009
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Add a leader who can heal for some real fun.
Ochre jelly splits.
Heal the "new" one above bloodied.
The new Orchre jelly can split.
Granted, it needs to be a potent healing (at-will surge+ a bit, or just a high level one), but you can net infinite jellies.
Un|Fortunately (depending on point of view), Ochre Jelly can only split "when first bloodied".
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