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10 months ago ::
Aug 25, 2012 - 4:07AM
#11
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Date Joined:
Jun 22, 2012
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Also remember, the sorcerer casts spontaneously (advantage on wizard) as well as being able to pace themselves more than the wizard (spending all WP on low level spells) or at the other end of the scale, going further nova than a wizard (spending all WP on high level spells)
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10 months ago ::
Aug 25, 2012 - 10:41AM
#12
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Date Joined:
Aug 22, 2007
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Even without the ability bonuses, that player rolled really well. That highlights my problem with rolling ability scores. I think the real issue is the high rolls, because that is an abnormally high randomly rolled scores. Those high rolled ability scores would make any pc superheroic
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10 months ago ::
Aug 25, 2012 - 3:05PM
#13
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Date Joined:
Apr 11, 2007
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In spite of the risks of superheroic rolls, I prefer die rolling to what I feel are the restrictions of point-buy or standard arrays. (That and my group like the randomness of not knowing what they'll get.) One thing this PC has made me appraciate (but not to the extent to say I "like" it) is the Advantage/Disadvantage mechanic. In spite of his awesome rolls, he had disadvantage in a situation not long ago (break time during the game right now) and managed to snatch defeat from the jaws of what would have been a guaranteed victory.
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10 months ago ::
Aug 25, 2012 - 5:51PM
#14
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If they could make missle/melee attacks as well as a fighter AND cast spells as well as a wizard they would be overpowered. As it is it's called "versatility".
Only if they could do it in the same round. Otherwise they would be equal to a fighter (without the CS dice) and equal to a Wizard (without the variety in spells)...
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10 months ago ::
Aug 26, 2012 - 4:57AM
#15
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Date Joined:
Apr 19, 2009
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Aye, to be honest this reminds me much of a spellblade from 3.5. Only had enough magic to be good at singlar targetting and good enough a fighter to be duriable. Though you required at least 4 good stats to pull it off correctly.
Which is a interesting point, to my knowledge the Sorc doesn't learn any area of effects nor the more flexible abilities that the wizard has, nor the capability to learn beyond levelling up.
However, I believe once you get to later levels, the sorc at least becomes considerably more duriable with the ability to resist damage 10 when needed. It strikes me more as a Clericy character, not that great at fighting compared to the Fighter, but can tank and do something else.
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10 months ago ::
Aug 27, 2012 - 8:41AM
#16
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Date Joined:
May 24, 2012
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I feel like you can customize enough with race background and specialty that two sorcerer's can feel totally different and that goes with all classes which is something that I find very exciting
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10 months ago ::
Aug 28, 2012 - 3:40PM
#17
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Date Joined:
Jul 31, 2007
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If they could make missle/melee attacks as well as a fighter AND cast spells as well as a wizard they would be overpowered. As it is it's called "versatility".
I agree, and as I stated in another thread, I ran my game with 7 players, 2 were the new sorc, 1 was the warlock. The warlock's raw damage is great, but only barely outclasses the melee dps builds for very short bursts (1 time per will they want to spend.)
The fighters Combat Superiority made them PERFECT for any fighting role, and made them vastly outshine the sorc in melee, but the sorc was a decent middle ground balanced character.
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10 months ago ::
Aug 28, 2012 - 4:27PM
#18
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Date Joined:
May 25, 2012
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I'm really not goetting the opinions of people who say that the sorceror is underpowered.
The ability to cast while wearing armour is incredibly powerful when combined with the larger hit dice making the caster a much harder target, in addition while he does have fewer spells to sling around he is rewarded for doing so. Burning willpower giving him more damage as well as later on giving him damage resistance too.
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9 months ago ::
Aug 29, 2012 - 7:22AM
#19
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I'm really not goetting the opinions of people who say that the sorceror is underpowered.
The ability to cast while wearing armour is incredibly powerful when combined with the larger hit dice making the caster a much harder target, in addition while he does have fewer spells to sling around he is rewarded for doing so. Burning willpower giving him more damage as well as later on giving him damage resistance too.
The save DCs are lower and their spell list is very limited. I've run the numbers and they deal less damage than a Fighter or a Wizard in any given round and generally their spells and features are geared toward dealing damage. The cause fear spell being spammed isn't really comparable because the Wizard can do it at least once per encounter and have more targets affected by it because of their higher DC. To be effective in combat the Sorcerer must split their primary stat between Charisma and Strength which means they are either mediocre at both or slightly less effective at one or the other than the Fighter and Wizard.
If you want a weak armored caster then the Sorcerer is fine for that, but they are trading survivability for effectiveness...
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9 months ago ::
Aug 29, 2012 - 12:15PM
#20
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Date Joined:
May 24, 2012
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To begin with, I'll say that I think the Sorceror and Warlock are unnecessary. They're just different flavors of Wizard and should be done as builds or sub-classes, not independent classes.
I know this hasn't been discussed much in this thread, but since you brought it up, I want to voice passionate disagreement.
The guiding principle behind class design for D&D Next is "find a fantasy archetype, then create a character class based on its universal trademarks and inspired by its iconic members." Wizards and Sorcerers are inspired by radically different archetypes. The Wizard is the learned sage, the absent-minded old scholar, the loremaster, and the mighty master of arcane subtleties: the Gandalf, the Elmister, and the Merlin. Sorcerers do not find magic, they are found by magic. Theirs is untamed, undisciplined, raw power. They didn't ask for this power, and in fact, if they had any hopes of leading a normal life, it was taken away by this strange, burning magic. I'd say most RPG mage characters, from Final Fantasy to Dragon Age, are something more like this.
Sure, they both take actions to cast spells, and some of their spells probably overlap, but that's pretty much where the similarities end. Just like the Rogue and Fighter, who both generally like to apply the pointy end of sharp metal objects to their enemies but apply radically different martial and non-martial skillsets to the art of survival.
And that's where the balance between the Sorcerer and Wizard needs to start, too. I like what they've done: the Sorcerer's spells are unsubtle. They release waves of fire and arcing electricity. The Wizard, with all his years, is who you want to ask if you want something more intricate done, like a room full of guards put to sleep, a weapon enchanted, or a rope manipulated. The Sorcerer, I get the feeling, is going to end up being the more powerful combatant, one way or another, like the Fighter. But the Wizard will be the spellcaster you don't leave home without, much like the Rogue.
All that said, the Wizard feels a little constrained relative to the Sorcerer. Pretty much the exact same spells per day (compare the willpower chart to the spells per day chart!), but if he's to invest in utility spells, then few of them will be dedicated to combat. Contrast to the Sorcerer, who will be armed to the teeth with combat spells, and in addition has his Sorcerous Origin to lean on when the going gets tough! More flexible spellcasting or simply more spells per day on the Wizard would go some way toward freeing the class up.
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