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11 months ago ::
Aug 18, 2012 - 3:31AM
#1
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Date Joined:
Sep 21, 2007
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New characters, carried on with the Caves Of Chaos.
The latest rules on characters were as follows:-
Fighter Archer-
Seemed to be well balanced, interesting skills, abilities, feats etc. Combat Superiority was good, Expertise dice seemed a good compromise to make the fighter interesting.
Elf Wizard-
Seemed pretty much the same as the first playtest. Worked well overall but did blow all her spells in a single combat with the Gnoll leader and the gnolls family.
Attacks Of Opportunity-
Were a problem as it put things back to characters losing all their actions in a round to try to escape then being caught up and attacked anyway. The attack of opportunity with advantage totally stopped any thoughts of just breaking away from opponents as the risk was very, very high.
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11 months ago ::
Aug 18, 2012 - 6:51AM
#2
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Am I mis-reading the AoO rules? In previous versions, it stopped your spell caster from using spells but now, being next to an enemy just triggers an attack if you move away, triggers disadvantage if you use a ranged attack or force you to include that enemy in your spell if you decide to cast. Running up to the wizard now only guarantees you'll get that wizards wrath.
The new AoO rules mean a DM can protect his big bad. It is in keeping with the genre that you can't just ignore the minions to gank the BBEG and the new rules help enforce the genre.
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11 months ago ::
Aug 18, 2012 - 7:38AM
#3
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Date Joined:
Aug 10, 2009
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New characters, carried on with the Caves Of Chaos.
Somewhat OT, but where did you get a playtest copy of Caves of Chaos? I can't find it anywhere.
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11 months ago ::
Aug 18, 2012 - 9:38AM
#4
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Date Joined:
Jul 15, 2008
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Attacks Of Opportunity-Were a problem as it put things back to characters losing all their actions in a round to try to escape then being caught up and attacked anyway. The attack of opportunity with advantage totally stopped any thoughts of just breaking away from opponents as the risk was very, very high.
I am not sure if you are playing this right.
1st) Disengage works well. You get 10' from disengage plus you can still move as per normal for your turn. Thus, a Wizard that wants to get away can sacrifice his attack (yes, a bummer) that round, but still probably gets to move 40' away from trouble, hopefully putting him or her out of reach.
The Archer has it even better. Not only can he move 40' or so, he can get off a snap shot to do some damage.
2nd) If you have someone with Guardian, they can negate Advantage if the person trying to get away while still taking an action is within 5' of them. (Granted, they can only do this once.)
3rd) Finally, remember that monsters also fall under the One Reaction rule. If a creature charged and then took a swipe at the retreating Archer (who got defended by the Guardian for no advantage), he can't react to the Wizard and Rogue trying to get away thereafter.
It's possible people got chewed up based on how they played it, but keep in mind that there are some options for eliminating or softening the effects of being subjected to Opportunity Attacks.
[Edit:] PS - The Caves of Chaos came in the first playtest packet.
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11 months ago ::
Aug 18, 2012 - 2:03PM
#5
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Date Joined:
Aug 22, 2007
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1st) Disengage works well. You get 10' from disengage plus you can still move as per normal for your turn. Thus, a Wizard that wants to get away can sacrifice his attack (yes, a bummer) that round, but still probably gets to move 40' away from trouble, hopefully putting him or her out of reach.
..,
In previous editions you gave up an action to move without provoking an AO. I can remember when retreat from combat was a guarantee AO, before I even heard of the term attack of opportunity. Now, with disengage, you us your action to get a 10' head start before you start to run away. Your enemy has to be really fast to close the distance and get an attack in the following round. It both allows for a cautious combatant an opportunity to get away to fight another day and punish reckless for turning their backs to run from the enemy.
I was not a big fan of the return of AO. But after some further examination, there are a lot of little loop holes built into the system for the skilled and cautious combatant in the new AO, Allowing for more freedom of movement than in recent past editions.
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11 months ago ::
Aug 19, 2012 - 2:09AM
#6
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Date Joined:
May 24, 2012
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I think the new OA with Disengage option will work pretty well... a PC is wounded & needs to fall back for a potion or a healing spell; can do so without being ganked in the process. Intelligent monsters will benefit from this as well.
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11 months ago ::
Aug 19, 2012 - 4:22AM
#7
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Date Joined:
Nov 22, 2007
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Also the shocking grasp spell is great as an alternative to withdrawal. No reaction means no AoO
Brave Knights of W.T.F. Gryphon Helm Winner.
Edition wars kill players, this will kill Dungeons and Dragons.
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11 months ago ::
Aug 19, 2012 - 11:52AM
#8
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Date Joined:
Sep 21, 2007
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Somewhat OT, but where did you get a playtest copy of Caves of Chaos? I can't find it anywhere.
I did in fact re-worked the adventure with the new creatures, little time consuming but ok.
I did run the AoO correct but with the advantage on the AoO it made it more severe than the 3rd Ed model. So your right, you can get away with the system as it stands but if there comes a charge attack then your back to not doing anything in the round except moving then recieving an attack for your trouble.
It got that static feel to combat that was pretty inherant in recent editions.
But we'll see.
However I do like the look of what I've seen overall and if I really don't like it if they include it in the final I'll just houserule it the way I feel is right. Not something that'd prevent me buying the Next edition which because I like what I've seen so far enough that I'd buy it.
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11 months ago ::
Aug 19, 2012 - 2:18PM
#9
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Date Joined:
Aug 22, 2007
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I did run the AoO correct but with the advantage on the AoO it made it more severe than the 3rd Ed model. So your right, you can get away with the system as it stands but if there comes a charge attack then your back to not doing anything in the round except moving then recieving an attack for your trouble.
It got that static feel to combat that was pretty inherant in recent editions.
..,
I've been enjoying the movement in combat without AoO. But when that rule came out over a decade ago, I enjoyed the new tactics. I guess at this point I am now on the fence with AO. I don't like granting advantage to AoO. I do like the new rules to get arround AoO. get rid of the advantage and a may be sold. Maybe.
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11 months ago ::
Aug 20, 2012 - 11:30AM
#10
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Date Joined:
Sep 21, 2007
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Thing is I do like the idea of AoO being a fighter capability so maybe the AoO for most characters is without the advantage but for the fighter it does have advantage. That's probably how I'll apply in the final release if they go with this approach.
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