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1 year ago ::
Jun 13, 2012 - 8:24AM
#1
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2 per day is not enough. I liked 2 per encounter of 4th edition.
Also less than a hit die worth of heals feels weak, but nice to let cleric attack & heal on one action.
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1 year ago ::
Jun 13, 2012 - 8:35AM
#2
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I disagree.
If he had more healing, he would be requried. As is, no one really get's much healing, so everone is equal.
guides
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my builds
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F-111 Interdictor Long (200+ squares) distance ally teleporter. With some warlord stuff. Broken in a plot way, not a power way.
Thought Switch Higher level build that grants upto 14 attacks on turn 1. If your allies play along, it's broken.
Elven Critters Crit op with crit generation. 5 of these will end anything. Broken.
King Fisher Does an excellent job at keeping an enemy disabled in a few ways. Strong.
Boominator Fun catch-22 booming blade build with either strong or completely broken damage depending on your reading.
Very Distracting Warlock Lot's of dazing and major penalties to hit. Overpowered.
Pocket Protector Pixie Stealth Knight. Maximizing the defender's aura by being in an ally's/enemy's square.
Yakuza NinjIntimiAdin: Perma-stealth Striker that offers a little protection for ally's, and can intimidate bloodied enemies. Very Strong.
Chargeburgler with cheese Ranged attacks at the end of a charge along with perma-stealth. Solid, could be overpowered if tweaked.
Void Defender Defends giving a penalty to hit anyone but him, then removing himself from play. Can get somewhat broken in epic.
Scry and Die Attacking from around corners, while staying hidden. Moderate to broken, depending on the situation.
Skimisher Fly in, attack, and fly away. Also prevents enemies from coming close. Moderate to Broken depending on the enemy, but shouldn't make the game un-fun, as the rest of your team is at risk, and you have enough weaknesses.
Indestructible Simply won't die, even if you sleep though combat.
Sir Robin (Bravely Charge Away) He automatically slows and pushes an enemy (5 squares), while charging away. Hard to rate it's power level, since it's terrain dependent.
Death's Gatekeeper A fun twist on a healic, making your party "unkillable". Overpowered to Broken, but shouldn't actually make the game un-fun, just TPK proof.
Death's Gatekeeper mk2, (Stealth Edition) Make your party "unkillable", and you hidden, while doing solid damage. Stronger then the above, but also easier for a DM to shut down. Broken, until your DM get's enough of it.
Domination and Death Dominate everything then kill them quickly. Only works @ 30, but is broken multiple ways.
Battlemind Mc Prone-Daze Protecting your allies by keeping enemies away. Quite powerful.
The Retaliator Getting hit deals more damage to the enemy then you receive yourself, and you can take plenty of hits. Heavy item dependency, Broken.
Dead Kobold Transit Teleports 98 squares a turn, and can bring someone along for the ride. Not fully built, so i can't judge the power
Psilent Guardian Protect your allies, while being invisible. Overpowered, possibly broken
Unnamed Avenger|Runepriest/Hammer of Vengance Do lot's of damage while boosting your teams. Strong to slightly overpowered.
Charedent BarrageA charging ardent. Fine in a normal team, overpowered if there are 2 together, and easily broken in teams of 5.
Super Knight A tough, sticky, high damage knight. Strong.
Super Duper Knight Basically the same as super knight, only far more broken.
Mora, the unkillable avenger Solid damage, while being neigh indestuctable. Overpowered, but not broken.
Swordburst Maximus At-Will Close Burst 3 that slide and prones. Protects allies with off actions. Strong, possibly over powered with the right party.
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1 year ago ::
Jun 13, 2012 - 8:37AM
#3
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Date Joined:
Mar 20, 2001
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Considering our cleric used all his spell slots on CLW I think he's pretty much going to be looked at as required. He also hated that fact he couldn't do anything else but save the wizards life most of the time.
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1 year ago ::
Jun 13, 2012 - 8:43AM
#4
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My group has not had any problems with the amount of healing. I think the discrepancy may come down to how you view encounters hit points and healing. The two clerics in my group (I've been playing the M-Cleric) have only used heals spells in combat when someone has less than 1 hits worth of hit points. Also neither of us have been saving spell slots for heals. We cast the spells we'd like to cast, and if there is a heal left when someone goes low, then great, otherwise, oh well. Consequently we've been relying much more on the healing kits.
At 1st level we were able to do 3 encounters/day at that pace, and at 2nd about 4 encounters per day. We generally stopped when everyone was out of hit dice, and walking around with near half hit points. I know for the M-cleric, I've only used a healing spell about once a day at 1st and 2nd. I think about the same for the P-Cleric as he has played more as a radiant artillery piece than a healic.
I'm curious what your encounter load was, and how your cleric spell usage was in your group.
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1 year ago ::
Jun 13, 2012 - 8:57AM
#5
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Date Joined:
Mar 20, 2001
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We did five encounters without a long rest in first playtest (we basically cleared out the kobold warren), haven't had the second yet, at that point everyone had used all their spells and most had used their hit dice. Admittedly two kobolds criticalled the wizard with spears in the first round of combat, and his luck didn't improve much. The Cleric many stuck to hit at will powers, so those heals were there when needed.
3/encounters a day sounds a lot like a 15 minute work day, which is not the sort of D&D I want to got back to.
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1 year ago ::
Jun 13, 2012 - 9:01AM
#6
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Date Joined:
Mar 29, 2005
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It wouldn't bother me at all if hit points became a per-encounter resource, automatically refilling after a short rest. That would all but eliminate the short workday.
Ever feel like people on these forums can't possibly understand how wrong they are? Feeling trolled? Don't get mad. Report Post.
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1 year ago ::
Jun 13, 2012 - 9:07AM
#7
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Considering our cleric used all his spell slots on CLW I think he's pretty much going to be looked at as required. He also hated that fact he couldn't do anything else but save the wizards life most of the time.
Most of the time, your better off using spiritual hammer and prevent the damage in the first place. Especially against kobolds.
If any healing is going to be boosted, make it either the hit dice or max HP (starting the day with 10 extra HP is very similar to healing 10 extra HP). Something every charcter gets.
guides
Show
my builds
Show
F-111 Interdictor Long (200+ squares) distance ally teleporter. With some warlord stuff. Broken in a plot way, not a power way.
Thought Switch Higher level build that grants upto 14 attacks on turn 1. If your allies play along, it's broken.
Elven Critters Crit op with crit generation. 5 of these will end anything. Broken.
King Fisher Does an excellent job at keeping an enemy disabled in a few ways. Strong.
Boominator Fun catch-22 booming blade build with either strong or completely broken damage depending on your reading.
Very Distracting Warlock Lot's of dazing and major penalties to hit. Overpowered.
Pocket Protector Pixie Stealth Knight. Maximizing the defender's aura by being in an ally's/enemy's square.
Yakuza NinjIntimiAdin: Perma-stealth Striker that offers a little protection for ally's, and can intimidate bloodied enemies. Very Strong.
Chargeburgler with cheese Ranged attacks at the end of a charge along with perma-stealth. Solid, could be overpowered if tweaked.
Void Defender Defends giving a penalty to hit anyone but him, then removing himself from play. Can get somewhat broken in epic.
Scry and Die Attacking from around corners, while staying hidden. Moderate to broken, depending on the situation.
Skimisher Fly in, attack, and fly away. Also prevents enemies from coming close. Moderate to Broken depending on the enemy, but shouldn't make the game un-fun, as the rest of your team is at risk, and you have enough weaknesses.
Indestructible Simply won't die, even if you sleep though combat.
Sir Robin (Bravely Charge Away) He automatically slows and pushes an enemy (5 squares), while charging away. Hard to rate it's power level, since it's terrain dependent.
Death's Gatekeeper A fun twist on a healic, making your party "unkillable". Overpowered to Broken, but shouldn't actually make the game un-fun, just TPK proof.
Death's Gatekeeper mk2, (Stealth Edition) Make your party "unkillable", and you hidden, while doing solid damage. Stronger then the above, but also easier for a DM to shut down. Broken, until your DM get's enough of it.
Domination and Death Dominate everything then kill them quickly. Only works @ 30, but is broken multiple ways.
Battlemind Mc Prone-Daze Protecting your allies by keeping enemies away. Quite powerful.
The Retaliator Getting hit deals more damage to the enemy then you receive yourself, and you can take plenty of hits. Heavy item dependency, Broken.
Dead Kobold Transit Teleports 98 squares a turn, and can bring someone along for the ride. Not fully built, so i can't judge the power
Psilent Guardian Protect your allies, while being invisible. Overpowered, possibly broken
Unnamed Avenger|Runepriest/Hammer of Vengance Do lot's of damage while boosting your teams. Strong to slightly overpowered.
Charedent BarrageA charging ardent. Fine in a normal team, overpowered if there are 2 together, and easily broken in teams of 5.
Super Knight A tough, sticky, high damage knight. Strong.
Super Duper Knight Basically the same as super knight, only far more broken.
Mora, the unkillable avenger Solid damage, while being neigh indestuctable. Overpowered, but not broken.
Swordburst Maximus At-Will Close Burst 3 that slide and prones. Protects allies with off actions. Strong, possibly over powered with the right party.
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1 year ago ::
Jun 13, 2012 - 9:50AM
#8
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If any healing is going to be boosted, make it either the hit dice or max HP (starting the day with 10 extra HP is very similar to healing 10 extra HP). Something every charcter gets.
I really agree. I they started with 3 Hit Dice and then incremented by 1, it would dramatically increase the daily longevity of a group. I'd really like to see that
But I'd definitly rather see the longevity of the party extended by improving non-divine recovery, as opposed to improving healing options. That just leans into forcing clerics to heal more and do whatever else less.
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1 year ago ::
Jun 13, 2012 - 9:54AM
#9
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We did five encounters without a long rest in first playtest (we basically cleared out the kobold warren), haven't had the second yet, at that point everyone had used all their spells and most had used their hit dice. Admittedly two kobolds criticalled the wizard with spears in the first round of combat, and his luck didn't improve much. The Cleric many stuck to hit at will powers, so those heals were there when needed.
3/encounters a day sounds a lot like a 15 minute work day, which is not the sort of D&D I want to got back to.
We're trying 3rd level next week, and we expect to have a lot more longevity just because all of the healing (except mine) will be maximized; but yeah, 1st level was tough. We actually did orcs, ogres and oozes for 1st level. We might've had better luck with kobolds.
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1 year ago ::
Jun 13, 2012 - 4:56PM
#10
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Date Joined:
Mar 28, 2004
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3/encounters a day sounds a lot like a 15 minute work day, which is not the sort of D&D I want to got back to.
3 encounters a day seems fine to me. Seriously, how many encounters do you think makes sense? Should an adventuring party be expected to dispatch enemies 100 to 1 in a given day? They are not superheroes. Especially when you are talking about low-level characters. I personally like the limited resources. It makes players consider their actions more carefully.
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