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12 months ago ::
Jun 11, 2012 - 1:24AM
#11
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Date Joined:
Apr 22, 2001
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In no particular order.
Linear class restrictions: Im a Paladin, here are the choices only the paladin can take.
Daily Powers: Dumbest design in history, in particular martial powers. Made about as much sense as the Movie Howard the Duck.
Restriction of Skills Based on classes: Any class, can take any skill is a must.
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12 months ago ::
Jun 11, 2012 - 1:31AM
#12
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..."window.parent.tinyMCE.get('post_content').onLoad.dispatch();" contenteditable="true">Daily Powers: Dumbest design in history, in particular martial powers. Made about as much sense as the Movie Howard the Duck.
I agree, we need to completely get rid of vancian casting and sorcerer style casting, or at least throw them in a module and have an alternative...
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12 months ago ::
Jun 11, 2012 - 1:36AM
#13
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Date Joined:
May 17, 2009
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Imbalance in the Core.
Especially if it's combined with varying levels of complexity between classes. It doesn't matter if balance and equal class complexity come later in modules. That won't really help, because of the way most players percieve balance in the game.
Favoritism in the Core.
Not favoring one class over another, but favoring one playstyle or edition over another. If the Core is going to accomodate us all, it has to be as neutral as possible. If I see the Core, and it favors one playstyle or edition over another, dealbreaker(even if it's my preferred playstyle, really. I just had 4 years of people hating on my favorite game because they felt it betrayed them and slept with their wives, I don't care to do it again).
Past these, I don't think I have any hard and fast dealbreakers. Everything I can think of would fall under one of these two.
Seriously, though, you should check out the PbP Haven. You might also like Real Adventures, IF you're cool. | Knights of W.T.F.- Silver Spur Winner | |
4enclave, a place where 4e fans can talk 4e in peace.
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12 months ago ::
Jun 11, 2012 - 1:40AM
#14
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Date Joined:
Apr 22, 2001
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..."window.parent.tinyMCE.get('post_content').onLoad.dispatch();" contenteditable="true">Daily Powers: Dumbest design in history, in particular martial powers. Made about as much sense as the Movie Howard the Duck.
I agree, we need to completely get rid of vancian casting and sorcerer style casting, or at least throw them in a module and have an alternative...
Exactly. I mean its hard to give a realistic basis on how magic "should" work since magic doesn't exist in the real world but to me you have to base it on something so you should base it on something tangiable in the real world. When we consider "fighting with a sword" we imagine a player has energy, endurance, strength, agility all playing a role in his ability to wield a sword well. Magic should function the same but since its magic should have its own "energy source" on which it draws... So Im more into some kind of mana system, or recharging system of spells. I mean mages should be able to cast the spells they know.. like fighters who have a limited amount of energy.. mages should also have a limited amout of magical energy.
A fighter doesn't forget how to cleave someones head off, so why would he only be able to do it once per day? Same goes for a fireball spell, I mean.. if you know how to do it, you should be able to do it. I can understand cleaving someones head off my require considerably more energy, so it should tap the reserves of the character as should casting a powerful spell. But that reserve... should recharge, or have some kind of way it can be recharged. In some ways the concept of Daily Powers was more believable as a magic system, but I still didnt care for it for mages either. When we played 2nd and 3rd edition we always used the alternative magic systems for this reason which made use of mana.
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12 months ago ::
Jun 11, 2012 - 2:32AM
#15
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..."window.parent.tinyMCE.get('post_content').onLoad.dispatch();" contenteditable="true">Daily Powers: Dumbest design in history, in particular martial powers. Made about as much sense as the Movie Howard the Duck.
I agree, we need to completely get rid of vancian casting and sorcerer style casting, or at least throw them in a module and have an alternative...
Exactly. I mean its hard to give a realistic basis on how magic "should" work since magic doesn't exist in the real world but to me you have to base it on something so you should base it on something tangiable in the real world. When we consider "fighting with a sword" we imagine a player has energy, endurance, strength, agility all playing a role in his ability to wield a sword well. Magic should function the same but since its magic should have its own "energy source" on which it draws... So Im more into some kind of mana system, or recharging system of spells. I mean mages should be able to cast the spells they know.. like fighters who have a limited amount of energy.. mages should also have a limited amout of magical energy.
A fighter doesn't forget how to cleave someones head off, so why would he only be able to do it once per day? Same goes for a fireball spell, I mean.. if you know how to do it, you should be able to do it. I can understand cleaving someones head off my require considerably more energy, so it should tap the reserves of the character as should casting a powerful spell. But that reserve... should recharge, or have some kind of way it can be recharged. In some ways the concept of Daily Powers was more believable as a magic system, but I still didnt care for it for mages either. When we played 2nd and 3rd edition we always used the alternative magic systems for this reason which made use of mana.
Have you checked out my alternative in my signature, I think it meets most of your requirements...
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12 months ago ::
Jun 11, 2012 - 2:38AM
#16
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Date Joined:
May 31, 2012
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I couldn't care less what magic system is implemented, as long as it allows out of encounter magic to be monitored and controlled. (Yes I'm aware encounters take the form of many things, like climbing ladders with missing rungs). Rituals should cover this fairly well, so in that regard, more power to a magic system that appeases everyone!
My deal breakers would be cow-towing to any arguments on the forums and never changing bounded accuracy, 1 - 20. Leave the core exactly as-is, with tons of optional content. (Note, I do not consider the casting system core. Core refers only to the universal mechanics revolving around the d20).
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12 months ago ::
Jun 11, 2012 - 2:46AM
#17
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Date Joined:
Apr 22, 2001
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Well in essence this is what WFRP 3.0 actually does but rather than the abstraction of action points it uses two seperate systems of governance to limit the potential "release" of power. This comes in the form of aquiring Fatigue and Stress (one for the physical and one for the mental).
In essence players can choose to push themselves as hard as they want. They can perform daring feats of strength, agility and endurance, or for mages they can push the mental powers. Doing so too often and too hard will result in players gaining fatigue and/or stress and as such their ability to perform these feets successfully diminishes.
What you want to avoid with any system is requriing the GM to say "You can't attempt that". As a GM you want to always be able "sure you can try that"... but with consequences built in to those actions.
Additionally the WFRP system uses the channeling of magical and divine powers. These two seperate methods require players to "build up power" to cast spells. So for really powerful spells they need more power, for less powerful spells they need less. This in essence gives the Magical and The Divine "casters" an extra resource to manage.
All Actions also have a recharge rate. So for example if you use the dodge card you may need to wait a couple of rounds before you can use it again. This represents readiness to take certain types of actions, however this can all be manipulated through clever use of talents, using certain weapons and taking certain other types of actions. For example their is an action you can take that allows you to reclaim stress and fatigue, recharge cards and such.
The manipulation of these difference resources which all represent characteristics of characters makes character building very meaningful but also dynamic since classes don't restrict your build. You can be a fighter who is a master with the sword, or he could simply be a really great commander on the battlefield, or perhaps he is a knowledgable strategist having very little combat training himself.
Its a great system and I understand what your going for with the action points but really you want the "action points" to be more representative of tangible factors rather than an abstraction. So things like fatigue, stress, mana... these are more tangible things players can control through how they design their characters, sacraficing one thing to get more of the other, but being impossible to be a master of it all. This creates the dynamics of a good role-playing system, rather than the linear "Here is a power you can use it once per day/encounter etc..
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12 months ago ::
Jun 11, 2012 - 3:17AM
#18
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Date Joined:
Apr 28, 2009
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Caster Supremacy
DDN needs to recognize the improvisation is something any chracter can do, and must include in the core that martial characters can roughly match the attack/damage/control(multiple attacks and codified combat maneuvers), durability(read:healing), exploration (climbing/jumping vs the spells Climb/Jump, Pick Locks/Open Doors vs Knock), and interaction (Bluff vs. Charm Person) of spellcasters.
Only Oldschool Races & Classes in the Core
Aside from needing to include Barbarians and Monks, I see no reason to switch to DDN if it doesn't have half of the following as pc races-- Warforged/Golems, Shifters/Weres, Lizardmen, and Minotaurs.
Assumption of Random Character Generation in the Core
Just no. No Rolling for abilities or hit points as the default.
Lack of Scaling
If a couple dozen town guardsmen can defeat a mighty dragon, or a couple dozen orcs defeat a L20 pc made with the core rules... this is not a D&D I am interested in.
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12 months ago ::
Jun 11, 2012 - 3:25AM
#19
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Date Joined:
May 30, 2010
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What got me interested in DnDNext was the promise of a 1-2 hour complete adventure, from charachter creation to end point. If thats not going to be possible, I won't be buying in.
All other "deal breakers" basically revolve around that point.
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12 months ago ::
Jun 11, 2012 - 3:35AM
#20
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Date Joined:
May 30, 2012
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The only deal breaker for me would be the pricing model being off. This means the next edition of dungeons and dragons NEEDS:
- No (hidden) subscription cost.
- Core books available as a set, at reasonable price (like current edition).
Bonusses for me, but not deal breakers:
- New figurines, with basic adventurers pack
- Grids (even though we have our own)
- Printable Character Sheet (available for free)
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