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Switch to Forum Live View Deal breakers. What would cause you not to buy D&D:Next when it comes out?
12 months ago  ::  Jun 10, 2012 - 11:42PM #1
lokiare
Date Joined: Nov 3, 2008
Posts: 14,703
List your deal breakers here. So we can give the developers a good idea of what we don't want to see in 5E.

My personal deal breaker is vancian magic as the baseline 'core' of how casters work. If they put it in as an optional module, I'm completely fine with it, but as 'core' its a deal breaker to me.
Look here to Check out my adventures and ideas. I've started a blog, about video games, table top role playing games, programming, and many other things its called Kel and Lok Games. I'm looking for players for a 4E fantasy grounds game.Swallowed Lich's Implement, help please.
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12 months ago  ::  Jun 11, 2012 - 12:07AM #2
EnglishLanguage
Date Joined: May 19, 2011
Posts: 4,967
basic attack only fighters

no attempt to balance things
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12 months ago  ::  Jun 11, 2012 - 12:23AM #3
OrwellianHaggis
Date Joined: Dec 20, 2011
Posts: 392
Classes that are locked into their own specific archetypes and stereotypes.

I will point out here however that threads like this are a bit misleading, this is a list of what we as individuals dont want... not what the community wants to avoid. Thats why specific threads about certain points of the game where people can discuss them make more sense to help out the devs. Why not think about going around the specific threads and taking the general consensus of the arguments that arise and placing it in a thread like this.

We need to start thinking about catering for everyone not just ourselves. 
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12 months ago  ::  Jun 11, 2012 - 12:31AM #4
maplealmond
Date Joined: Nov 3, 2007
Posts: 302
For my group as a whole, this is hard to quanitfy, but a lack of crazy interesting things.  In my 4e game we were running with dopplegangers (er, changelings) and warforged and orcs from day one.  If my players can't do that, no one is going to want to switch.  What can I say?  My group is easily bored.

For me personally?  A pitiful digital launch support.  Basically, if this launch goes like 3e and 4e, I'll be waiting a long time before switching over to 5e.
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12 months ago  ::  Jun 11, 2012 - 12:36AM #5
Tevish_Szat
  • Unconventional Mafia Pro
  • Dark Lord
Date Joined: Jun 25, 2001
Posts: 9,267
Default/Hard to Excise Grid Requirement.  Let me make one thing clear: I like using the battle grid.  Sometimes.  But I also like the ability to play a pick-up game with character sheets, a dice bag, and some sort of box lid to roll on, and have had some pretty amazing sessions that only worked because I was able to run TotM combats.
Threat: Negligable.  Devs seem focused on supporting TotM

Default/Hard to Excise Encounter Paragdim.  I like the freedom to be fluid with encounters, something that I didn't feel 4e did a good job of delivering.  The push to distinct, bite-sized encounters with the ability to rest between each one a standard expectation put a crimp in the style of active dungeons.
Threat: Low.  "Short Rests" are in but right now only for HD-based healing.  Devs seem to be focusing on adventure-as-unit

"Dude, Where's my GDSM and Amulet of Reflection?" ~or~ Magic Items as part of Character Build.  The game should be playable without magic items.  Characters should not plan ahead for *specific* magic items even in campaigns where magic loot of some description can be safely anticipated.  If Magic Items are part of Character Build and I somehow run the system anyway, I will have Santa Claus show up to deliver the Player Progression Loot like a scene out of Narnia (but played for spiteful humor)
Threat: Low.  There's been a lot of talk about flat math and magic items being magical, not math fixes.  However, I think that's kind of been a "love it or hate it" proposition, with some demanding exactly what I don't want to see.  Time will tell if the devs change their tune.

Critical Mass of Stuff That Makes My Brain Hurt.  Proning oozes.  Bleeding Skeletons.  Burning Fire Elementals to death.  The sort of things that shouldn't even work with magic involved (I'm not going to dip so much as a toe into the martial versus magic logic argument here).  A little of this isn't a dealbreaker; It's practically inevitable as the rules make a lot of round holes and specific situations throw out a lot of square pegs.  A lot of it is.
Threat: Moderate.  Current design talks the talk ("For conditions, we want to think first about what's going on in-universe") but doesn't quite Walk the Walk (Ray of Frost versus Flyers, for instance).

Everybody Resource Manages the Same.  A more accurate way of stating the complaint that "All classes are the same" under early-4th ADEU.  Different classes, or at least different castes of classes (Power Sources, if you will) should have different mechanical skeletons on which they're built.  Especially with Themes and Backgrounds providing a lot of your surface differences, the classes need to be unique to their cores.
Threat: Moderate.  Right now we have Vancian (Wizard), Weirdo psudeo-Vancian (Divine), and ??? (Martial), but I'm prety sure there's a ton of support to sliding towards ADEU, and I'd really like to see Arcane and Divine drift farther apart...
"Enjoy your screams, Sarpadia - they will soon be muffled beneath snow and ice."
THE COALITION WAR GAME
-Phyrexian Praetor
Round 1: (4-1-2, 1 kill)
Round 2: (16-8-2, 4 kills)
Round 3: (18-9-2, 1 kill)
Round 4: (22-10-0, 2 kills)
Round 5: (56-16-3, 9 kills)
Round 6: (8-7-1) [current round]

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12 months ago  ::  Jun 11, 2012 - 12:37AM #6
Qmark
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Date Joined: May 18, 2002
Posts: 16,528
Mandatory DDI.
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12 months ago  ::  Jun 11, 2012 - 12:45AM #7
lokiare
Date Joined: Nov 3, 2008
Posts: 14,703

Jun 11, 2012 -- 12:23AM, OrwellianHaggis wrote:

Classes that are locked into their own specific archetypes and stereotypes.

I will point out here however that threads like this are a bit misleading, this is a list of what we as individuals dont want... not what the community wants to avoid. Thats why specific threads about certain points of the game where people can discuss them make more sense to help out the devs. Why not think about going around the specific threads and taking the general consensus of the arguments that arise and placing it in a thread like this.

We need to start thinking about catering for everyone not just ourselves. 




I wouldn't say misleading. I would say confrontational. This isn't a thread for solutions. It is a thread for people to state their problems, so the developers can take a look and get an idea of the sticking points of each edition and what they will need to modularize to get everyone to play...

Look here to Check out my adventures and ideas. I've started a blog, about video games, table top role playing games, programming, and many other things its called Kel and Lok Games. I'm looking for players for a 4E fantasy grounds game.Swallowed Lich's Implement, help please.
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12 months ago  ::  Jun 11, 2012 - 12:46AM #8
lokiare
Date Joined: Nov 3, 2008
Posts: 14,703

Jun 11, 2012 -- 12:37AM, Qmark wrote:

Mandatory DDI.




I'd like to add Mandatory well programmed cross platform DDI (including smart phones and tablets)...

Look here to Check out my adventures and ideas. I've started a blog, about video games, table top role playing games, programming, and many other things its called Kel and Lok Games. I'm looking for players for a 4E fantasy grounds game.Swallowed Lich's Implement, help please.
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12 months ago  ::  Jun 11, 2012 - 1:00AM #9
Dwarfslayer
Date Joined: Oct 25, 2010
Posts: 2,074
Tedious NPC creation method

Mandatory battlemap

Poor balance between classes
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12 months ago  ::  Jun 11, 2012 - 1:22AM #10
Saelorn
Date Joined: May 27, 2012
Posts: 2,956
Mind-control fighters, who can somehow non-magically compel an enemy to attack the guy wearing plate armor instead of the sorceress with no armor to speak of.  I know, it seems minor, but it exemplifies the sort of thing that just hurts my brain more than I can tolerate.

Of things that put me on the fence, where I might be a core book and then stop, mandatory magical items are pretty high up there.  Any class that relies on a single stat to determine their awesomeness is a huge red flag.

 
The metagame is not the game.
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