QSLA actually makes the ability a free action so each round I could technically blast and attack with a sword if I chose to. Sweet that could really deal some serious damage. Especially if I am using retributive invisibility which means i stay invisible when I attack.
QSLA actually makes the ability a free action so each round I could technically blast and attack with a sword if I chose to. Sweet that could really deal some serious damage. Especially if I am using retributive invisibility which means i stay invisible when I attack.
No, Quicken is a swift action. It was just printed before the swift action was invented. Every "quicken" style effect was tweaked over time to use the swift action instead.
Similarly, your blast is your real damage dealer - most of the damage from your rogue side will not come from your sword or your Strength, but rather from your Sneak Attack, and your blast gets that too. Thus, you can threaten with your sword and still fire off a blast as a swift and then a second as a standard (unless Quicken SLA prevents that, I forget if it has that wording or not). The last build you posted (Rogue 3 Warlock 7 Arcane Trickster 6) has Sneak Attack 7d6 and Eldritch Blast 6d6; unless you go with TWF (which is not going to end well for you, since you have no bonus feats and a horrific attack bonus), you will not be able to outdo the damage from two blasts - particularly because you'll be attacking their FULL AC with any sword and their TOUCH AC with the blast.
I'm going to wager a guess that you've mostly played at the low levels before, and at those levels you've not played a spellcaster before. Am I right?
These are NOT all my creations! The lead authors are identified as follows: [TS] Tempest Stormwind, [AR] Andarious Rosethorn, [RT] Radical Taoist, [SN] Sionnis, [DH] DisposableHero_, [SH] Seishi.
[TS] The Pinball Brothers: Large And In Charge (Melee, Lockdown, Charge, Juggling) [TS] Ashardalon Reborn: I Will Swallow Your Soul (Melee, Fear, Negative Levels, AoE, Theme) [AR] "A"-Game Paladin: Play That Funky Music, Knight Boy! (Team Support, Melee, Theme, Single-Class) [RT] Uncanny Trapsmith: Get in, make it look like an accident, get out. (Skillmonkey, Stealth/Scout/Infiltration, Unorthodox Methods, Theme) [AR] Wizsassin: *Everything* is permitted. (Spellcaster, Support, Sneak Attack, Utility) [TS] Phantom Rush: General Gish Gouda. (Gish, Theme, Setting-Specific(Eberron), Early-Entry PrC) [TS] Storm Knight: Another kind of gish. (Melee/"Gish", Theme, Setting-Specific(Eberron), Unorthodox Methods) [TS] Inevitable Nightmare: The weapon you only have to fire once. (Melee, "Unorthodox" Methods (no charging), Reliability) [AR] Captain Constitution: The number one threat to America. (Melee, TOUGHTOUGHTOUGH, Defense, Theme) [AR] Nuker: I casts the spells that makes the peoples fall down! (Spellcaster, damage, blasting, damage) [TS] Dread Lord of the Dead: Let the Reaping Begin! (NPC-only, Variable (combat/casting/leadership), Iconic Villain, Theme) [AR] Heavy Crusader: No Rest. No Mercy. No Matter What. (Melee, Damage (No charging), Variable, Theme). [TS] Gun Fu: It's bullet time (Ranged, THEORETICAL, Twin weapons, Theme) [RT] Face First: We should talk. (Psionic, social, mind-control, info-management) [SN] Chaingun Porcupine: Never Enuff Dakka. (Ranged, Skirmishing, Spike Damage, Incarnum) [RT] Always On Edge: The Mortal Draw deals death. (Melee, Generalist, Dungeoneering, Stunt) [AR] Feral Druid: Real feral taste. Zero druid calories. (Melee, offense, damage, murder) [RT] Rusty!: Man's Best Friend (Sentry, Support, Backup, Rearguard) [RT] The T3 (Tashalatora Triple Threat): My Kung Fu is More Powerful (Hybrid, Flex-Function, Melee, Caster) [RT] The #1 Snoipah: Boom. 'Eadshot. (Caster, Theme, Spike, Trapscout) [AR] Dreamblade: Rest in Pieces. (Melee, Damage, Single-Class, Combo/Momentum) [AR] Evasion Tank: “When fighting angry blind men, is best to stay out of the way.” (Melee, Tank, Unorthodox Methods (attack negation), Theme) [DH] Psycarnum Warrior: ↑↑↓↓←→←→BA Start (Melee, Tank, Psionics, Incarnum, 1337 h4x) [AR] Heavy Weapons Elf: WHO TOUCHED MY BOW? (Ranged, Cohort, Damage, Unorthodox Methods (ranged ToB)) [RT] Gnowhere Gnome: A little man who wasn't there (Caster, Stealth, Single-Class, Elusive) [AR] Uberflank: I got your back. (Melee, support, stunt, teamwork) [TS] Flip the Bird: Everyday I'm shuffling (Ranged, harrier, unorthodox methods (ranged ToB / off-turn movement), support) [DH] Eat Sleep Gank: Real Ultimate Power (Stealth, Assassination, Spike, Magic Versatility) [AR] Slash and Burn: Mind, Body, Blade, Flame / Aspects of a greater whole / which delivers death. (Melee, Theme (flex-style), Damage, Stunt) [RT] Edge of the Light: Cut, Fade to Black (Melee, Defense/Offense, Momentum, Tactical) [RT] Quiet Murder: Cut throats, not corners. (Melee, Stealth, Harrier, Tactical) [TS] Wand Overdrive: Say Hello to my little friends. (Caster, support/artillery/variable, wand specialist) [RT] God Hand: What did the five fingers say to the face? (Melee/Gish, Unarmed, SAD, Theme) [AR] Zero Buff Time Gish: Try to keep up! (Gish, Speed, Movement, Opportunity) [TS] Robo Tackle: I Am Iron Man. (Melee, setting-specific (Eberron), positioning, theme, stunt)
I have been playing for quite some time but never a warlock. I am trying to learn how to play one. Mostly I tend to play rogues or fighters to be honest. Being able to blast twice and possibly get sneak attack damage on both would be huge and as stated do the most damage. What I need to do is find a way to maximize my ability to do do sneak attack damage and staying invisible if I am not mistaken would allow me to deprive my enemy of a dex bonus which means I coudl get sneak damage on both blasts correct?
If so then I will probably ditch the fancy sword in favor of something more usefull for defense or helping promote my sneak damage or blast damage. I must have missed a D6 of sneak damage as i only had it at 2D6 for Rogue and 3D6 for Arcane trickster where is the otehr D6 from.
I knowI get 1D6 from Rogues Vest and one from Deadly precision on the sword also 1D6 from Bracers of the Hunter. So a total of 8D6 sneak, and 8D6 Eldritch Blast. That twice in one round is heavy hitting. Thanks for clarifying the swift action versus free either way two blasts a round is great. Thanks for the info it is very helpful.
I have been playing for quite some time but never a warlock. I am trying to learn how to play one. Mostly I tend to play rogues or fighters to be honest.
I guessed this because you were emphasizing attacking with a weapon, which is something only fighter-types and rogue-types (of the silly and outdated, but ubiquitous, "big four" party) usually care about. Spellcasters and warlocks generally care more about hitting with their magical effects.
There's several ways to play a warlock. Draco above posted a link to the warlock handbook; it's well worth reading through that first.
What I need to do is find a way to maximize my ability to do do sneak attack damage and staying invisible if I am not mistaken would allow me to deprive my enemy of a dex bonus which means I coudl get sneak damage on both blasts correct?
Unless the monster can see invisibility or has Blind Fight or has any number of special senses or... yeah, other than all that, invisibility works.
Honestly, there's better options available to you than invisibility. If you want my suggestion, if you're taking Quicken already, consider Eldritch Glaive, which can strike with sneak attacks from a flanking position and potentially can do it more than once per round (Combat Reflexes). It's also a good hybrid of the melee you're used to and the warlock that you're learning. To learn more about the "glaivelock", just google that word.
I must have missed a D6 of sneak damage as i only had it at 2D6 for Rogue and 3D6 for Arcane trickster where is the otehr D6 from.
It was a mistake on my part; I read Sneak Attack off the last line of Arcane Trickster instead of the 6th.
That twice in one round is heavy hitting.
Just to warn you, if you're using the regular blast and not something like Eldritch Chain, 8d6+8d6 twice is only 32d6, or on average 112 damage (assuming every attack hits, which isn't a good assumption - to really figure this out, you'd need to figure out your chance to hit and scale that damage by that amount. And that doesn't correct for crits.). To get a rough sense of how accurate that attack will be, I'd need to know what your Dexterity looks like.
Just for comparison, here's a very basic Rogue 20 specialist sneak attacker.Show
Human Rogue 20 Ability scores 10/15/14/13/8/12 to start, boosting Dexterity every 4th level Feats: Hu Two-Weapon Fighting (reduce TWF penalties) 01 Craven (Heroes of Battle: Add your character level to sneak attack damage) 03 Weapon Finesse (Use Dexterity instead of Strength for attack rolls) 06 Martial Study: Cloak of Deception (Tome of Battle: 1/enc swift action to become invisible for a turn) 09 Martial Stance: Assassin's Stance (Tome of Battle: swift action to gain +2d6 sneak attack until you stop the stance) 12 Shadow Blade (Tome of Battle: Add Dexterity to damage rolls with certain weapons while in Assassin's Stance) 15 Improved TWF (Gain second off-hand attack) 18 Greater TWF (Gain third off-hand attack)
Equipment: +6 gloves of dexterity, two Swords of Subtlety enhanced up to +3 Shadow Hand weapons, +4 Manual of Quickness of Action. (All of this except Shadow Hand is in the DMG; Shadow Hand is a +1 enhancement that gives +1 attack if you know a Shadow Hand maneuver (you do) or +3 if you are using a Shadow Hand maneuver (which we are through Assassin's Stance). Note that the swords of subltety are shortswords, which work with Shadow Blade and weapon finesse. Final Dexterity: 30
Attack bonus when making a sneak attack: Base 15 + 10 Dexterity + 5 Weapon +4 Subtlety ability = +34 Final attack routine: +32/+27/+22 main hand, +32/+27/+22 off-hand; this assumes you aren't flanking Damage per hit: 1d6 + 0 Strength +3 enhancement +10 Dexterity +10d6+20 Sneak Attack = average 71.5 per hit
This simple build can make all its attacks against touch AC if need be (through cheese methods on par with Quicken SLA - mount a sword with a wand chamber slotted with a wand of wraithstrike to trigger with Use Magic Device; these are in the Spell Compendium and Complete Scoundrel), just like the warlock can. Your build would need to get a ranged attack bonus of +12 (on top of your +10 base attack, so things like Dexterity and Weapon Focus) in order to be as accurate as its least accurate attack, so if we assumed the warlock would "always hit", we'll make the same assumption here as the rogue is always at least as accurate.
All-attacks-hit damage: 6*71.5 = 429.
This wasn't even really trying, but I admit I'm being too charitable with that last assumption. This damage drops off pretty quickly if you're not using Wraithstrike cheese, but even if just the first two attacks hit (which is a fair assumption - their attack bonus is about on par with average AC at level 20, which is the "always hit" range), you're looking at 153 damage.
The warlock still has advantages - most notably its support invocations and that it can do that damage at a distance, as well as adding in rider effects via Eldritch Essences (although those mostly depend on a different stat, Charisma) - but you shouldn't be surprised if other characters out-damage it. The warlock, by and large, reaches the peak of its power relative to other classes and the monsters you fight at about level FIVE, and needs serious optimization for damage (glaivelock, Hellfire Warlock, etc) if you want to keep up. Case in point with your build: it took nearly full sneak attack progression and specific gear to reach 112. (Average monster HP at this level is about 400.) Most warlock builds look to diversify or emphasize some other aspect at the higher levels.
These are NOT all my creations! The lead authors are identified as follows: [TS] Tempest Stormwind, [AR] Andarious Rosethorn, [RT] Radical Taoist, [SN] Sionnis, [DH] DisposableHero_, [SH] Seishi.
[TS] The Pinball Brothers: Large And In Charge (Melee, Lockdown, Charge, Juggling) [TS] Ashardalon Reborn: I Will Swallow Your Soul (Melee, Fear, Negative Levels, AoE, Theme) [AR] "A"-Game Paladin: Play That Funky Music, Knight Boy! (Team Support, Melee, Theme, Single-Class) [RT] Uncanny Trapsmith: Get in, make it look like an accident, get out. (Skillmonkey, Stealth/Scout/Infiltration, Unorthodox Methods, Theme) [AR] Wizsassin: *Everything* is permitted. (Spellcaster, Support, Sneak Attack, Utility) [TS] Phantom Rush: General Gish Gouda. (Gish, Theme, Setting-Specific(Eberron), Early-Entry PrC) [TS] Storm Knight: Another kind of gish. (Melee/"Gish", Theme, Setting-Specific(Eberron), Unorthodox Methods) [TS] Inevitable Nightmare: The weapon you only have to fire once. (Melee, "Unorthodox" Methods (no charging), Reliability) [AR] Captain Constitution: The number one threat to America. (Melee, TOUGHTOUGHTOUGH, Defense, Theme) [AR] Nuker: I casts the spells that makes the peoples fall down! (Spellcaster, damage, blasting, damage) [TS] Dread Lord of the Dead: Let the Reaping Begin! (NPC-only, Variable (combat/casting/leadership), Iconic Villain, Theme) [AR] Heavy Crusader: No Rest. No Mercy. No Matter What. (Melee, Damage (No charging), Variable, Theme). [TS] Gun Fu: It's bullet time (Ranged, THEORETICAL, Twin weapons, Theme) [RT] Face First: We should talk. (Psionic, social, mind-control, info-management) [SN] Chaingun Porcupine: Never Enuff Dakka. (Ranged, Skirmishing, Spike Damage, Incarnum) [RT] Always On Edge: The Mortal Draw deals death. (Melee, Generalist, Dungeoneering, Stunt) [AR] Feral Druid: Real feral taste. Zero druid calories. (Melee, offense, damage, murder) [RT] Rusty!: Man's Best Friend (Sentry, Support, Backup, Rearguard) [RT] The T3 (Tashalatora Triple Threat): My Kung Fu is More Powerful (Hybrid, Flex-Function, Melee, Caster) [RT] The #1 Snoipah: Boom. 'Eadshot. (Caster, Theme, Spike, Trapscout) [AR] Dreamblade: Rest in Pieces. (Melee, Damage, Single-Class, Combo/Momentum) [AR] Evasion Tank: “When fighting angry blind men, is best to stay out of the way.” (Melee, Tank, Unorthodox Methods (attack negation), Theme) [DH] Psycarnum Warrior: ↑↑↓↓←→←→BA Start (Melee, Tank, Psionics, Incarnum, 1337 h4x) [AR] Heavy Weapons Elf: WHO TOUCHED MY BOW? (Ranged, Cohort, Damage, Unorthodox Methods (ranged ToB)) [RT] Gnowhere Gnome: A little man who wasn't there (Caster, Stealth, Single-Class, Elusive) [AR] Uberflank: I got your back. (Melee, support, stunt, teamwork) [TS] Flip the Bird: Everyday I'm shuffling (Ranged, harrier, unorthodox methods (ranged ToB / off-turn movement), support) [DH] Eat Sleep Gank: Real Ultimate Power (Stealth, Assassination, Spike, Magic Versatility) [AR] Slash and Burn: Mind, Body, Blade, Flame / Aspects of a greater whole / which delivers death. (Melee, Theme (flex-style), Damage, Stunt) [RT] Edge of the Light: Cut, Fade to Black (Melee, Defense/Offense, Momentum, Tactical) [RT] Quiet Murder: Cut throats, not corners. (Melee, Stealth, Harrier, Tactical) [TS] Wand Overdrive: Say Hello to my little friends. (Caster, support/artillery/variable, wand specialist) [RT] God Hand: What did the five fingers say to the face? (Melee/Gish, Unarmed, SAD, Theme) [AR] Zero Buff Time Gish: Try to keep up! (Gish, Speed, Movement, Opportunity) [TS] Robo Tackle: I Am Iron Man. (Melee, setting-specific (Eberron), positioning, theme, stunt)
Honestly I am not as concerned with maxing out damage every round, and 32D6 in one round isn't bad by any means. I am hoping to play a character I can have fun with that has decent survivability. The warlock class just seems to have so much flavor, and teamed with the Whisper Gnome rogue and my invocations. I can bounce around and toy with enemies, not to mention the fun aspect of possibly earning a living in the pilfering trade LOL. Regarding your question about Dex, The characters Dexterity with magical bonuses is 28. As stated previously my main goal is to have fun with the character. My character is going to be somewhat the reluctant hero who still has his vices. If you have any further suggestions that will lead to that I am all ears, and I am very grateful for all of your help thus far.
