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13 months ago ::
May 29, 2012 - 1:32AM
#1
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I have a player starting a new character in my group. Our DM's busy at work as of late so I’m trying to help him out with things like this.
He's made an elf ranger and is very adamant about the longbow.
The range on it is 20/40 and I want to make sure I explain all the rules right to him. So he can shoot anything within 20 squares with no penalty and after 20 and up to 40 he can shoot with a -2 penalty
Partial cover on a monster would = a -2 additional penalty
Full cover would = -5 to hit
or am I confusing these with concealment?
He also is very adamant about staying away from the thick of combat at all times and being hidden. I figured this was a wise move anyway because I believe he gets combat advantage from this.
If anyone has the time to give me a basic run down of all the + and - of range combat in some sort of bullet point format I’d be very grateful so I can just stick it on a little cheat sheet for him to reference for his first few fights.
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13 months ago ::
May 29, 2012 - 2:06AM
#2
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Date Joined:
Mar 21, 2006
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You've got it pretty much right, but make sure he knows EXACTLY how the Hidden status works in 4e.
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13 months ago ::
May 29, 2012 - 2:17AM
#3
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This is CharOp. We not only assume block-of-tofu monsters, but also block-of-tofu DMs.
One reach cheese'd threatening reach Spiked Chain shuts down any non-teleporting quarterback.
You're already refluffing, what not refluff to something that doesn't suck?
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13 months ago ::
May 29, 2012 - 2:39AM
#4
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So, quick summary:
Prime Shot (for rangers): +1
Combat Advantage: +2
Long Range: -2
Cover/Concealment: -2
Total Cover/Concealment: -5
Target is prone: -2
I think that is it for targeting bonuses and penalties. Of course, things like Restrained and the like alter it, but those are really very situational.
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13 months ago ::
May 29, 2012 - 2:49AM
#5
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Date Joined:
Oct 28, 2010
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Note that cover and concealment stack. So, for instance, if the target is behind a low wall (cover) and in fog (concealment), the penalty would be -4.
Also worth noting that being that far back, is often really, really dumb. You're basically not contributing to your party's use of resources (particularly surges and distributing monster attacks evenly), and if you do get attacked (a skirmisher gets away, or an artillery or controller hits you at range), you're well out of range for your party to respond (either by healing you, or by sending the defender over to help). Being permahidden at long range is really not that helpful.
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13 months ago ::
May 29, 2012 - 3:15AM
#6
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Archer Ranger's really want to be up close to exploit Prime Shot, particularly in Paragon. Check out Shoot to Thrill, first or second page of CharOp, to see what an optmized Archer Ranger looks like. Standing "way in the back" is just plain bad.
It makes slightly more sense for a Rogue, particularly post 16, except since SA no longer works with Superior Crossbow ranged Rogue builds aren't really quite as impressive...
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13 months ago ::
May 29, 2012 - 5:31AM
#7
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Date Joined:
Oct 11, 2010
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He should rock a greatbow (or superior crossbow) and get right in peoples' faces. Then shoot them in it. AC won't be terrible with a post racial 20 and hide armor. And as Alcestis said, lots of the ranger's damage and accuracy comes from prime shot.
Called Shot: +5 damage to prime shotted enemies.
Wizards of the Coast can suck it.
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13 months ago ::
May 29, 2012 - 5:52AM
#8
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He should rock a greatbow (or superior crossbow) and get right in peoples' faces. Then shoot them in it. AC won't be terrible with a post racial 20 and hide armor. And as Alcestis said, lots of the ranger's damage and accuracy comes from prime shot. Called Shot: +5 damage to prime shotted enemies.
It gets better if you have a good defender. Flanking works with ranged weapons, so you can flank with (say) your fighter, shoot the guy, and if he takes a swing at you, the fighter gets to take a swing at him.
Another day, another three or four entries to my Ignore List.
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13 months ago ::
May 29, 2012 - 9:05AM
#9
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Date Joined:
Mar 31, 2010
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He should rock a greatbow (or superior crossbow) and get right in peoples' faces. Then shoot them in it. AC won't be terrible with a post racial 20 and hide armor. And as Alcestis said, lots of the ranger's damage and accuracy comes from prime shot. Called Shot: +5 damage to prime shotted enemies.
It gets better if you have a good defender. Flanking works with ranged weapons, so you can flank with (say) your fighter, shoot the guy, and if he takes a swing at you, the fighter gets to take a swing at him.
I'm suddenly kicking myself for not flanking with the Battlemind so I can trigger his Mind Spike! D'oh!
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13 months ago ::
May 29, 2012 - 11:18AM
#10
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Archer Ranger's really want to be up close to exploit Prime Shot, particularly in Paragon. Check out Shoot to Thrill, first or second page of CharOp, to see what an optimized Archer Ranger looks like. Standing "way in the back" is just plain bad.
It makes slightly more sense for a Rogue, particularly post 16, except since SA no longer works with Superior Crossbow ranged Rogue builds aren't really quite as impressive...
Sadly this is the guy who was playing a rogue (that got killed mind you) Who was always going off on his own and doing everything by himself. I think we've managed to beat it into his thick skull that watching him try to do things for an hour at the table isn't fun for the rest of us. I sort of think that’s why he got himself killed. The ranger is supposed to be more party oriented but he has it in his head to RP it like the movies in the sense. Elf hides in shadows / tree shoots things in the head. I know it might not be a great way to play a ranger but I'm in a group that’s very new to 4th and several are very new to tabletop RPG games. Him being one of them. If he sticks with the group I'll nitpick his combat play style later and I cant totally fault a person making choices based on wanting to role play that way vs what works better in combat.
I've read everything posted and this was all a great help. Thank you to the first few who posted that link to hidden club heh.
My only other question really comes with maybe a hint of confusion. What exactly grants combat advantage at range for the shooter vs the monster. Is it just partial cover or do you have to be in total hidden mode for that to happen?
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