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13 months ago ::
May 24, 2012 - 3:30PM
#1
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Date Joined:
Dec 30, 2008
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So, running through the playtest this morning, I'm a little worried about Advantages. It seems like they are everywhere, and aren't balanced by an equal ammount of dissadvantages.
Assuming that this edition of D&D goes off the generally 50% chance to hit at level ideal, rolling 2d20 and taking the higher pushes this to a 75% chance to hit.
Now I realize with disadvantages that you get a 75% chance to miss if a dissadvantage is applies, but on my first read through there wasn't nearly as many as there were advantages.
But I'm running my group in a day or two, so we'll see.
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13 months ago ::
May 24, 2012 - 3:55PM
#2
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Date Joined:
May 23, 2012
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I found the advantages to work well, in place of many different extra bonuses for this and that. I'm quite happy with them, and my players (the ones that had played a previous edition) preferred it. It helped run things a bit more smoothly, instead of counting up whatever bonuses from this and that. I'm happy with it.
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13 months ago ::
May 24, 2012 - 3:56PM
#3
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Date Joined:
Apr 21, 2005
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I agree.
I don't think the developers realize this is like giving a +5 to the roll.
That is a LOT different than a +2 from 4E Combat Advantage.
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13 months ago ::
May 24, 2012 - 4:04PM
#4
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Date Joined:
Apr 10, 2008
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I agree.
I don't think the developers realize this is like giving a +5 to the roll.
That is a LOT different than a +2 from 4E Combat Advantage.
It's a little more complicated than a +5 because of the increased variance associated with that. Either the variance matters little (in a situation where you were already very likely to hit), or it matters a lot (in a situation where you were not very likely to hit). Also, increased chance to critical. So the times that you really really needed that advantage (big boss fight) it's a lot better than a static +5
Edit: I don't know if that is a good or bad thing in your book. I'm indifferen't (zero value judgement) right now.
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13 months ago ::
May 24, 2012 - 4:31PM
#5
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Date Joined:
Apr 21, 2005
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It's a little more complicated than a +5 because of the increased variance associated with that.
That is true, however for middle ranged target die rolls (rolls from 7 to 15), the variance is between 21-25%.
Your chances of rolling an 11 or better are 50% with a single roll and 75% with a double roll.
Your chances of rolling a 7 or better are 70% with a single roll and 91% with a double roll.
Your chances of rolling a 15 or better are 30% with a single roll and 51% with a double roll.
So for those ranges that would be the same as +4/5. That's still a huge difference for "most" rolls.
| N |
Single |
Double |
Diff |
| 1 |
100.00% |
100.00% |
0.00% |
| 2 |
95.00% |
99.75% |
4.75% |
| 3 |
90.00% |
99.00% |
9.00% |
| 4 |
85.00% |
97.75% |
12.75% |
| 5 |
80.00% |
96.00% |
16.00% |
| 6 |
75.00% |
93.75% |
18.75% |
| 7 |
70.00% |
91.00% |
21.00% |
| 8 |
65.00% |
87.75% |
22.75% |
| 9 |
60.00% |
84.00% |
24.00% |
| 10 |
55.00% |
79.75% |
24.75% |
| 11 |
50.00% |
75.00% |
25.00% |
| 12 |
45.00% |
69.75% |
24.75% |
| 13 |
40.00% |
64.00% |
24.00% |
| 14 |
35.00% |
57.75% |
22.75% |
| 15 |
30.00% |
51.00% |
21.00% |
| 16 |
25.00% |
43.75% |
18.75% |
| 17 |
20.00% |
36.00% |
16.00% |
| 18 |
15.00% |
27.75% |
12.75% |
| 19 |
10.00% |
19.00% |
9.00% |
| 20 |
5.00% |
9.75% |
4.75% |
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13 months ago ::
May 24, 2012 - 5:49PM
#6
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Date Joined:
Apr 10, 2008
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It's a little more complicated than a +5 because of the increased variance associated with that.
That is true, however for middle ranged target die rolls (rolls from 7 to 15), the variance is between 21-25%.
Your chances of rolling an 11 or better are 50% with a single roll and 75% with a double roll.
Your chances of rolling a 7 or better are 70% with a single roll and 91% with a double roll.
Your chances of rolling a 15 or better are 30% with a single roll and 51% with a double roll.
So for those ranges that would be the same as +4/5. That's still a huge difference for "most" rolls.
| N |
Single |
Double |
Diff |
| 1 |
100.00% |
100.00% |
0.00% |
| 2 |
95.00% |
99.75% |
4.75% |
| 3 |
90.00% |
99.00% |
9.00% |
| 4 |
85.00% |
97.75% |
12.75% |
| 5 |
80.00% |
96.00% |
16.00% |
| 6 |
75.00% |
93.75% |
18.75% |
| 7 |
70.00% |
91.00% |
21.00% |
| 8 |
65.00% |
87.75% |
22.75% |
| 9 |
60.00% |
84.00% |
24.00% |
| 10 |
55.00% |
79.75% |
24.75% |
| 11 |
50.00% |
75.00% |
25.00% |
| 12 |
45.00% |
69.75% |
24.75% |
| 13 |
40.00% |
64.00% |
24.00% |
| 14 |
35.00% |
57.75% |
22.75% |
| 15 |
30.00% |
51.00% |
21.00% |
| 16 |
25.00% |
43.75% |
18.75% |
| 17 |
20.00% |
36.00% |
16.00% |
| 18 |
15.00% |
27.75% |
12.75% |
| 19 |
10.00% |
19.00% |
9.00% |
| 20 |
5.00% |
9.75% |
4.75% |
That's an interesting chart. Do you mind if I copy it to use in a googledoc for my group?
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13 months ago ::
May 24, 2012 - 7:45PM
#7
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Date Joined:
Dec 26, 2009
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I'm quite fond of Advantages, at least in principle.
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13 months ago ::
May 24, 2012 - 8:15PM
#8
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Date Joined:
Dec 21, 2011
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From my first reading (not playing it yet), I tend to like the rule also. It tends to be more exciting than just adding new plusses to a roll. Also, it introduces a bell curve to the d20 game, which I feel is necessary to flatten out the 1 to 20 straight roll.
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13 months ago ::
May 24, 2012 - 9:21PM
#9
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Date Joined:
Feb 15, 2008
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Yeah, I really like the advantage mechanic. It makes the unlikely a little more likely to happen, and it makes something that had a good chance of happening almost guaranteed. And the bell-curve means that having a higher modifier is rewarded more when using advantage, at least as I understand the math of it. This means that someone who is good at something gets overall more from advantage than someone who starts off not being very good. Or in other words, part of what you gain when using advantage is reliability.
"So shall it be! Dear-bought those songs shall be be accounted, and yet shall be well-bought. For the price could be no other. Thus even as Eru spoke to us shall beauty not before conceived be brought into Eä, and evil yet be good to have been."
- Manwë, High King of the Valar
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13 months ago ::
May 24, 2012 - 9:44PM
#10
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Date Joined:
Mar 24, 2008
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I think it's a great idea. Not only does it nix the need for alot of bonus/penalty stacking to a single roll, but it's also a big enough effect that players and NPC's are going to hunt for every way to leverage the mechanic. That puts alot of pressure to come up with every creative idea possible. LOVE IT!
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