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13 months ago ::
May 23, 2012 - 11:38AM
#51
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Which does increase the number of required books from 3 to 4.
Ah... but I'd combine the PHB and DMG into the D&D Rulebook, which has all the rules, classes, races, spells, etc., including a chapter with DMing advice. I don't think there's anything in the DMG that needs to be DM's eyes only.
Rules for making onsters goes itno the Monster Manual.
So everyone needs to by a D&D Rulebook. The DM needs the Monster Manual, and the group decides who needs the Vault. PHB and DMG can be smaller books of play advice.
+5
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13 months ago ::
May 23, 2012 - 3:57PM
#52
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Which does increase the number of required books from 3 to 4.
Ah... but I'd combine the PHB and DMG into the D&D Rulebook, which has all the rules, classes, races, spells, etc., including a chapter with DMing advice. I don't think there's anything in the DMG that needs to be DM's eyes only.
Rules for making onsters goes itno the Monster Manual.
So everyone needs to by a D&D Rulebook. The DM needs the Monster Manual, and the group decides who needs the Vault. PHB and DMG can be smaller books of play advice.
I'm definetly on board with a single smaller Core Rulebook that serves as a basic PHB and DMG. But there's still a nice design space for an actual DMG with advice and optional rules, advice on house rules, and where the non-standard rule modules are as well as advice on world building and planning campaigns. The DMG should be the best of the DMG I & II and the Pathfinder Gamemaster's Guide. Plus everything that can't fit into the Core Rulebook.
Before posting, ask yourself WWWS: What Would Wrecan Say? Spoiler:
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13 months ago ::
May 23, 2012 - 4:09PM
#53
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Which does increase the number of required books from 3 to 4.
Ah... but I'd combine the PHB and DMG into the D&D Rulebook, which has all the rules, classes, races, spells, etc., including a chapter with DMing advice. I don't think there's anything in the DMG that needs to be DM's eyes only.
Rules for making onsters goes itno the Monster Manual.
So everyone needs to by a D&D Rulebook.
The DM needs the Monster Manual, and the group decides who needs the Vault. PHB and DMG can be smaller books of play advice.
This is a great idea!
A D&D Rulebook (call it the “Rules Compendium” for the traditionalists?) that combines the rules for the DMG and the PH offers many significant benefits for the game as a whole.
Then the players only need to buy 1 book to play. 1 book!
Plus the adventure. The adventure itself will list whateve monsters and magic-items treasures exist in the adventure.
It would be an inexpensive buy-in for beginners to start playing D&D.
As players get more advanced, the ones who are DMing can buy the Vaults, the Monster Manuals, Campaign Settings, and the Optional Modules to enrich and finetune their gaming experience.
All of the other books - the Monster Manuals, Vaults, Settings, and Modules - can have labels that say something like “DM Resources”. This label makes it clear the Vaults will remain under the control of the DM, as part of the overall responsibilities to design the setting and mood for the adventure.
One single D&D Rulebook also reduces confusion about which book is necessary for beginners to purchase - which has always been a perennial problem for the D&D curious. There is only one. Buy it and play. It makes purchasing easy.
Combining the rule for the DM rules and players also encourages more players to understand how to become DMs, who can run games themselves. These extra DMs are the ones who expand the player base and ultimately expand the market place and the profitability of the game.
I only see benefits when combining the DMG and PH.
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13 months ago ::
May 23, 2012 - 4:28PM
#54
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@Those who want a combined PHB/DMG: I wouldn't care if the two were combined into one book, so long as each section was distinctly labeled as to which one it was. However, given the number of options DDN will have to include to make people happy, a combined PHB/DMG may be so large as to be unwieldy and to make reference a real pain.
@Thread: I don't care what book you put it in so long as it's one of the main 3. You can make a case for the DMG and the PHB, and maybe even for putting the treasure tables and everything like that in the MM. However, the real question for me is the tools. Will online tools be offered for DDN? If so, will you be able to look up all the magical stuff online? If you can access all of this info from the online tools, then put it in either the DMG or the MM. If players don't want to subscribe to DDI to get that info, then they can just buy the book (which would presumably be cheaper than DDI over just 3 or 4 months).
Why Mechanics-Alignment Integration is Bad
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so why even play a fighter if you can play the paladin the exact same way behaviorally and get added power to boot. "Paladin" is about accepting better game-enhancing mechanics at the price of more rigid in game behavior.
Really? So it goes something like this?
Fighter: "I want to be a paladin."
NPC: "Really?"
Fighter: "Yes."
NPC: "Very well." Starts reading from a holy book while still in-character "Do you accept having to choose and stick to the lawful good alignment, eventhough neither of us actually knows that it exists or what it is?"
Fighter: "I do."
NPC: "Do you reject good game balance because you accidentally rolled a high Charisma?"
Fighter: "What?"
NPC: "I don't know what it means either."
Fighter: "Oh. Umm, ok I do."
NPC: "In the name of all that is metagamey and broken, accept these better game enhancing mechanics."
Fighter: "These what?"
NPC: "Just get out there and try to fulfill a million different people's notion of good while not violating and part of any of them."
So the system is designed such that every single hit needs to be described to avoid confusion? Here's a scenario. The players are nudists, everybody in the world are nudists, it's not weird, it's totally normal in this land. They are naked and they fight drakes taking damage throughout, but healing up with surges. Later they meet the guy who raised the drakes.
Part 1: I didn't describe any of the hits. What does he see?
Part 2: Lets say I described the drakes as biting the players, yet they healed up. What does he see?
D20 Modern Toon PC Race.
Mecha Pilot's Skill Challenge Emporium.
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13 months ago ::
May 23, 2012 - 5:01PM
#55
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For me, the answer to what book they should be in is based on where they come from.
If the players can make it, it should be in the PH.
If the DM has sole control over it's placement, then the DMG.
If they take the idea from the poll about some magic items being of generic effect, and player constuctable, with other magic items being unique named objects of strange and wonderful power, I would put the generic enchantments in the PH and keep all the more interesting goodies in the DMG.
As to the idea of wishlists and player begging... in 4E it was easy as pie to make magic gear of a generic nature, the players can make it themsleves, they should stop whining.
Basically, I liked the 4E set up that had magic items in the PH and relics/artifacts in the DMG. I would just have prefered a much smaller list of player available enchants and a much larger list of artifacts/relics/unique named items with a bit more robust guidlines on making your (as the DM) own.
I have an answer for you, it may even be the truth.
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13 months ago ::
May 23, 2012 - 5:15PM
#56
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You could have the first book be all about characters. Have all the character options there.
Then, in the second book, you have all the stuff you need to actually create and run an adventure.
Third, you have the external elements, optional plugins for adventures which are at the DM's discretion. Magic items, monsters, etc.
You could call the first book Men & Magic, the second book Underworld & Wilderness Adventures, the third book Monsters & Treasure.
Wait, I think that's been done.
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13 months ago ::
May 23, 2012 - 7:57PM
#57
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Date Joined:
Nov 13, 2004
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The magic level of the campaign is for the DM to decide, regardless if your assumption of a few mages per town.
Kinda like how the mechanical complexity level is for the player to decide, yet it sounds like Themes & Backgrounds are gonna be in the PH with the option to not use them. Guess it comes down to the baseline style assumption (whether they figure the majority of games allow purchasing some, any, or no magic items). It'd be an easy enough thing for a DM to say "We're playing low-magic, so you can't buy the basic magic stuff in the PH."
4e D&D is not a "Tabletop MMO." It is not Massively Multiplayer, and is usually not played Online. Come up with better descriptions of your complaints, cuz this one means jack ****.
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13 months ago ::
May 23, 2012 - 9:14PM
#58
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Date Joined:
Mar 22, 2008
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The magic level of the campaign is for the DM to decide, regardless if your assumption of a few mages per town.
Kinda like how the mechanical complexity level is for the player to decide, yet it sounds like Themes & Backgrounds are gonna be in the PH with the option to not use them. Guess it comes down to the baseline style assumption (whether they figure the majority of games allow purchasing some, any, or no magic items). It'd be an easy enough thing for a DM to say "We're playing low-magic, so you can't buy the basic magic stuff in the PH."
There's no point in splitting the magical treasure. The DM should be forced to look into two books for magic items.
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13 months ago ::
May 23, 2012 - 9:53PM
#59
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Date Joined:
May 16, 2012
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I apologize for not following etiquette and reading all the previous posts.
I liked the magic items in the PH. As a matter of fact, if the PH had included just 2 more chapters, I would not have needed a DMG at all (wish I had known that before I bought it,though). As things stand, if the dmg 5e isn't drastically different, I won't be buying it.
Parenthood: Gain rage class feature. While enraged, take ongoing psychic damage equal to half the child's level. Dealing damage while enraged is against your Code of Conduct and you will be depowered. ^^Wow, is that really how I came across in that personality thing or was this chosen at random?
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13 months ago ::
May 23, 2012 - 10:11PM
#60
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Date Joined:
Mar 28, 2001
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You could have the first book be all about characters. Have all the character options there.
Then, in the second book, you have all the stuff you need to actually create and run an adventure.
Third, you have the external elements, optional plugins for adventures which are at the DM's discretion. Magic items, monsters, etc.
You could call the first book Men & Magic, the second book Underworld & Wilderness Adventures, the third book Monsters & Treasure.
Wait, I think that's been done.
I like this idea as well; also, it's very nostalgic.
But, if there isn't the nostalgia, I would prefer to have some generic magic items (potions,scrolls, basic wands, etc.) and magical weapon/armor properties in the DMG. Afterwards, release a magic item book (Adventurer's Vault, Magic Item Compendium, whatever) for unique or rare items; collections and artifacts can go in this book as well.
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