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Switch to Forum Live View Optimization of an Elven Duskblade, any suggestions?
1 year ago  ::  May 21, 2012 - 3:19PM #11
Tetsuoh
Date Joined: Oct 27, 2009
Posts: 651
Just learned that I have the option of one Flaw Feat at start, and that all books are open to me so long as everything passes GM inspection. The GM would prefer I stick to one expansion set if I utilize them (either Eberron or Faerun) but said it isnt a big issue.

For armor since I'm starting at 5th - I was thinking MW Hide - but I dunno - It seems off balance to me.

The real problem with my choice on armor is this: I don't know my stats yet. I'll be using the standard 4d6 rolls. But I wont be rolling them till possibly sometime near the end of the week. also at the same time if I choose one of my early feats to be the one to increase spell failure to no chance during heavy.... But then that cuts into my utilizing the Knowledge devotion and other such feats earlier on.

Also, I don't think I'm gonna stick with Duskblade till 13th... Let me explain.

It seems to me that the best way to utilize the greater weapon channeling is reach only with whirl like combat abilities to "reach out and touch" as many enemies as possible.

I really hadn't planned on him using a reach weapon. Now I undestand the greater channeling is still usefull, and in fact has great synergy with cleave and greater cleave. But it still just isnt really what I has looking for out of the class. But now that brings up the notion of what prestiges to look into.

What do you all think?
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1 year ago  ::  May 21, 2012 - 4:03PM #12
ObsidianConspiracy
Date Joined: Jul 21, 2010
Posts: 652
Well if you don't want the full channeling you could try Duskblade/Martial Adept/Jade Phoenix Mage?

 Advances your casting to a degree, allows you abilities that synergize with you smacking them up and then casting/channeling spells? Since maneuvres only use a single attack generally
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1 year ago  ::  May 21, 2012 - 4:34PM #13
Maat_Mons
Date Joined: Oct 24, 2005
Posts: 1,544

I wouldn't take battle caster. You'll be able to use mithral or elven darkleaf (Arms and Equipment Guide) to get almost any armor down to medium anyway. That won't be cost-effective right away, but I'd still skip the feat.


Eschew material shouldn't be necessary if you restrict yourself to a light shield or no shield. You can use a longsword in two hands if you want, for the better power attack ratio. That still leaves you with a free hand when not attacking.


It would be easy for you to take abjurant champion (Complete Mage), though it doesn't provide that much benefit to you.


You could always put a level into sand shaper (Sandstorm) for the extra spells known.

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1 year ago  ::  May 22, 2012 - 2:50PM #14
Tetsuoh
Date Joined: Oct 27, 2009
Posts: 651
Okay any suggestions on rods for a duskblade?

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1 year ago  ::  May 22, 2012 - 3:20PM #15
Tempest_Stormwind
Date Joined: Jun 20, 2004
Posts: 4,899

May 22, 2012 -- 2:50PM, Tetsuoh wrote:

Okay any suggestions on rods for a duskblade?



If you've got money left over to spend on rods, you haven't invested enough in your primary offensive or defensive gear. Especially at level 5.

If you meant wands, there's a handbook for that. You're limited as a duskblade, due to a narrowly focused spell list, but eternal wands remain an option, particularly if they function with wand chambers (slot them in your weapon so it's always "in hand"). The handbook, however, is slightly off - see the comment thread below it and you'll see what I mean.

Cancer prognosis: I am now cancer-free.

Weekly Optimization Series: Show
These are NOT all my creations! The lead authors are identified as follows:
[TS] Tempest Stormwind, [AR] Andarious Rosethorn, [RT] Radical Taoist, [SN] Sionnis, [DH] DisposableHero_, [SH] Seishi.

[TS] The Pinball Brothers: Large And In Charge (Melee, Lockdown, Charge, Juggling)
[TS] Ashardalon Reborn: I Will Swallow Your Soul (Melee, Fear, Negative Levels, AoE, Theme)
[AR] "A"-Game Paladin: Play That Funky Music, Knight Boy! (Team Support, Melee, Theme, Single-Class)
[RT] Uncanny Trapsmith: Get in, make it look like an accident, get out. (Skillmonkey, Stealth/Scout/Infiltration, Unorthodox Methods, Theme)
[AR] Wizsassin: *Everything* is permitted. (Spellcaster, Support, Sneak Attack, Utility)
[TS] Phantom Rush: General Gish Gouda. (Gish, Theme, Setting-Specific(Eberron), Early-Entry PrC)
[TS] Storm Knight: Another kind of gish. (Melee/"Gish", Theme, Setting-Specific(Eberron), Unorthodox Methods)
[TS] Inevitable Nightmare: The weapon you only have to fire once. (Melee, "Unorthodox" Methods (no charging), Reliability)
[AR] Captain Constitution: The number one threat to America. (Melee, TOUGHTOUGHTOUGH, Defense, Theme)
[AR] Nuker: I casts the spells that makes the peoples fall down! (Spellcaster, damage, blasting, damage)
[TS] Dread Lord of the Dead: Let the Reaping Begin! (NPC-only, Variable (combat/casting/leadership), Iconic Villain, Theme)
[AR] Heavy Crusader: No Rest. No Mercy. No Matter What. (Melee, Damage (No charging), Variable, Theme).
[TS] Gun Fu: It's bullet time (Ranged, THEORETICAL, Twin weapons, Theme)
[RT] Face First: We should talk. (Psionic, social, mind-control, info-management)
[SN] Chaingun Porcupine: Never Enuff Dakka. (Ranged, Skirmishing, Spike Damage, Incarnum)
[RT] Always On Edge: The Mortal Draw deals death. (Melee, Generalist, Dungeoneering, Stunt)
[AR] Feral Druid: Real feral taste. Zero druid calories. (Melee, offense, damage, murder)
[RT] Rusty!: Man's Best Friend (Sentry, Support, Backup, Rearguard)
[RT] The T3 (Tashalatora Triple Threat): My Kung Fu is More Powerful (Hybrid, Flex-Function, Melee, Caster)
[RT] The #1 Snoipah: Boom. 'Eadshot. (Caster, Theme, Spike, Trapscout)
[AR] Dreamblade: Rest in Pieces. (Melee, Damage, Single-Class, Combo/Momentum)
[AR] Evasion Tank: “When fighting angry blind men, is best to stay out of the way.” (Melee, Tank, Unorthodox Methods (attack negation), Theme)
[DH] Psycarnum Warrior: ↑↑↓↓←→←→BA Start (Melee, Tank, Psionics, Incarnum, 1337 h4x)
[AR] Heavy Weapons Elf: WHO TOUCHED MY BOW? (Ranged, Cohort, Damage, Unorthodox Methods (ranged ToB))
[RT] Gnowhere Gnome: A little man who wasn't there (Caster, Stealth, Single-Class, Elusive)
[AR] Uberflank: I got your back. (Melee, support, stunt, teamwork)
[TS] Flip the Bird: Everyday I'm shuffling (Ranged, harrier, unorthodox methods (ranged ToB / off-turn movement), support)
[DH] Eat Sleep Gank: Real Ultimate Power (Stealth, Assassination, Spike, Magic Versatility)
[AR] Slash and Burn: Mind, Body, Blade, Flame / Aspects of a greater whole / which delivers death. (Melee, Theme (flex-style), Damage, Stunt)
[RT] Edge of the Light: Cut, Fade to Black (Melee, Defense/Offense, Momentum, Tactical)
[RT] Quiet Murder: Cut throats, not corners. (Melee, Stealth, Harrier, Tactical)
[TS] Wand Overdrive: Say Hello to my little friends. (Caster, support/artillery/variable, wand specialist)
[RT] God Hand: What did the five fingers say to the face? (Melee/Gish, Unarmed, SAD, Theme)
[AR] Zero Buff Time Gish: Try to keep up! (Gish, Speed, Movement, Opportunity)
[TS] Robo Tackle: I Am Iron Man. (Melee, setting-specific (Eberron), positioning, theme, stunt)


Want to see how the entire group rolls?
[All] Party Optimization Showcase: Dead for Nothing
[TS/RT/AR] Optimization Article: The Flash Step
[RT] Optimization Article: Kung Fu Witchcraft
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1 year ago  ::  May 22, 2012 - 4:16PM #16
Tetsuoh
Date Joined: Oct 27, 2009
Posts: 651

May 22, 2012 -- 3:20PM, Tempest_Stormwind wrote:

May 22, 2012 -- 2:50PM, Tetsuoh wrote:

Okay any suggestions on rods for a duskblade?



If you've got money left over to spend on rods, you haven't invested enough in your primary offensive or defensive gear. Especially at level 5.





Oh another very handy handbook, you always have interesting reads Tempest.

No I meant what I said. BUT I wasn't saying I was looking to buy any at lvl 5. I have enough to worry on what to spend my 9k on, what with weapon abilities, a possible drake - helm and everything else.

BUT what got me was the fact that NO rods were listed in the handbook you showed me. That kinda threw me, after all the duskblade is a caster class still, and there are bound to be rods that fit the class well enough to be included in the handbooks equipment list - and yet there aren't any.

Even Runestaff's are talked about - but not rods.

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1 year ago  ::  May 22, 2012 - 5:33PM #17
Tempest_Stormwind
Date Joined: Jun 20, 2004
Posts: 4,899

May 22, 2012 -- 4:16PM, Tetsuoh wrote:

May 22, 2012 -- 3:20PM, Tempest_Stormwind wrote:

May 22, 2012 -- 2:50PM, Tetsuoh wrote:

Okay any suggestions on rods for a duskblade?



If you've got money left over to spend on rods, you haven't invested enough in your primary offensive or defensive gear. Especially at level 5.





Oh another very handy handbook, you always have interesting reads Tempest.

No I meant what I said. BUT I wasn't saying I was looking to buy any at lvl 5. I have enough to worry on what to spend my 9k on, what with weapon abilities, a possible drake - helm and everything else.

BUT what got me was the fact that NO rods were listed in the handbook you showed me. That kinda threw me, after all the duskblade is a caster class still, and there are bound to be rods that fit the class well enough to be included in the handbooks equipment list - and yet there aren't any.

Even Runestaff's are talked about - but not rods.



That's because rods are never really used for anything - they're explicitly for oddly unique effects rather than anything specific. This means that each one stands completley on its own most of the time, instead of dovetailing and synergizing with existing class features. I mean, things like the Rod of Lordly Might look cool, but really, that's a lot of money for what amounts to bling, when that money could be going for substance. There's a small handful of rods which are generically useful, like the Immovable Rod, but these are also almost never worth the expense when that money could be spent keeping you alive.

Unless a particular unique effect is critical to some other aspect of a build - the quintessential examples are the metamagic rods (see below), the Nightstick to Divine Metamagic users, or the Rod of Undead Mastery to minion-based necromancers - they're generally ignored. The only ones of these that work with duskblades are the metamagic rods, but since duskblades tend to favor two-handed attacks, they generally don't have a hand free for the rod! In your case, though, since you've insisted on a one-handed reach weapon, I might look into the Empower rod (since duskblades are all about Damage Damage Damage Damage, and that's the quintessential damage metamagic feat) as a good place to aim for. Quicken is also a good call, but duskblades get an inherent quickcast that tends to give you enough of that same resource when it really matters. (Not to mention Arcane Channelling already lets you cast a spell and do other stuff in the same round. The fact that the "other stuff" is limited to a simple attack and the spell is limited to a touch spell (typically a debuff or a damage blast) is balanced out by arcane channelling being at will and both of those things being exactly what you'd want to do anyway.)

Cancer prognosis: I am now cancer-free.

Weekly Optimization Series: Show
These are NOT all my creations! The lead authors are identified as follows:
[TS] Tempest Stormwind, [AR] Andarious Rosethorn, [RT] Radical Taoist, [SN] Sionnis, [DH] DisposableHero_, [SH] Seishi.

[TS] The Pinball Brothers: Large And In Charge (Melee, Lockdown, Charge, Juggling)
[TS] Ashardalon Reborn: I Will Swallow Your Soul (Melee, Fear, Negative Levels, AoE, Theme)
[AR] "A"-Game Paladin: Play That Funky Music, Knight Boy! (Team Support, Melee, Theme, Single-Class)
[RT] Uncanny Trapsmith: Get in, make it look like an accident, get out. (Skillmonkey, Stealth/Scout/Infiltration, Unorthodox Methods, Theme)
[AR] Wizsassin: *Everything* is permitted. (Spellcaster, Support, Sneak Attack, Utility)
[TS] Phantom Rush: General Gish Gouda. (Gish, Theme, Setting-Specific(Eberron), Early-Entry PrC)
[TS] Storm Knight: Another kind of gish. (Melee/"Gish", Theme, Setting-Specific(Eberron), Unorthodox Methods)
[TS] Inevitable Nightmare: The weapon you only have to fire once. (Melee, "Unorthodox" Methods (no charging), Reliability)
[AR] Captain Constitution: The number one threat to America. (Melee, TOUGHTOUGHTOUGH, Defense, Theme)
[AR] Nuker: I casts the spells that makes the peoples fall down! (Spellcaster, damage, blasting, damage)
[TS] Dread Lord of the Dead: Let the Reaping Begin! (NPC-only, Variable (combat/casting/leadership), Iconic Villain, Theme)
[AR] Heavy Crusader: No Rest. No Mercy. No Matter What. (Melee, Damage (No charging), Variable, Theme).
[TS] Gun Fu: It's bullet time (Ranged, THEORETICAL, Twin weapons, Theme)
[RT] Face First: We should talk. (Psionic, social, mind-control, info-management)
[SN] Chaingun Porcupine: Never Enuff Dakka. (Ranged, Skirmishing, Spike Damage, Incarnum)
[RT] Always On Edge: The Mortal Draw deals death. (Melee, Generalist, Dungeoneering, Stunt)
[AR] Feral Druid: Real feral taste. Zero druid calories. (Melee, offense, damage, murder)
[RT] Rusty!: Man's Best Friend (Sentry, Support, Backup, Rearguard)
[RT] The T3 (Tashalatora Triple Threat): My Kung Fu is More Powerful (Hybrid, Flex-Function, Melee, Caster)
[RT] The #1 Snoipah: Boom. 'Eadshot. (Caster, Theme, Spike, Trapscout)
[AR] Dreamblade: Rest in Pieces. (Melee, Damage, Single-Class, Combo/Momentum)
[AR] Evasion Tank: “When fighting angry blind men, is best to stay out of the way.” (Melee, Tank, Unorthodox Methods (attack negation), Theme)
[DH] Psycarnum Warrior: ↑↑↓↓←→←→BA Start (Melee, Tank, Psionics, Incarnum, 1337 h4x)
[AR] Heavy Weapons Elf: WHO TOUCHED MY BOW? (Ranged, Cohort, Damage, Unorthodox Methods (ranged ToB))
[RT] Gnowhere Gnome: A little man who wasn't there (Caster, Stealth, Single-Class, Elusive)
[AR] Uberflank: I got your back. (Melee, support, stunt, teamwork)
[TS] Flip the Bird: Everyday I'm shuffling (Ranged, harrier, unorthodox methods (ranged ToB / off-turn movement), support)
[DH] Eat Sleep Gank: Real Ultimate Power (Stealth, Assassination, Spike, Magic Versatility)
[AR] Slash and Burn: Mind, Body, Blade, Flame / Aspects of a greater whole / which delivers death. (Melee, Theme (flex-style), Damage, Stunt)
[RT] Edge of the Light: Cut, Fade to Black (Melee, Defense/Offense, Momentum, Tactical)
[RT] Quiet Murder: Cut throats, not corners. (Melee, Stealth, Harrier, Tactical)
[TS] Wand Overdrive: Say Hello to my little friends. (Caster, support/artillery/variable, wand specialist)
[RT] God Hand: What did the five fingers say to the face? (Melee/Gish, Unarmed, SAD, Theme)
[AR] Zero Buff Time Gish: Try to keep up! (Gish, Speed, Movement, Opportunity)
[TS] Robo Tackle: I Am Iron Man. (Melee, setting-specific (Eberron), positioning, theme, stunt)


Want to see how the entire group rolls?
[All] Party Optimization Showcase: Dead for Nothing
[TS/RT/AR] Optimization Article: The Flash Step
[RT] Optimization Article: Kung Fu Witchcraft
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1 year ago  ::  May 23, 2012 - 12:04PM #18
Deoxhydroxinate
Date Joined: Jun 3, 2007
Posts: 237
A metamagic rod of Extend spell could be very handy (and relatively cheap for the lesser version for around 3k).  Also, isn't there a wand sheath or similar which could be used with Wraithstrike?
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1 year ago  ::  May 23, 2012 - 12:45PM #19
Tempest_Stormwind
Date Joined: Jun 20, 2004
Posts: 4,899

May 23, 2012 -- 12:04PM, Deoxhydroxinate wrote:

A metamagic rod of Extend spell could be very handy (and relatively cheap for the lesser version for around 3k).  Also, isn't there a wand sheath or similar which could be used with Wraithstrike?



Most duskblade spells aren't buffs, though, and since they don't pump their DCs (touch spells don't tend to allow saves and you get enough slots to not need much higher than 15 Intelligence anyway), debuff or damage-over-time spells aren't worth extending. That's why I suggested Empower over Extend.

The wand chamber (CAdv) allows you to "slot" a wand into your weapon so both are "in hand" at the same time. They really are wonderful choices, particularly with swift or immediate wands. The Rules Compendium makes it clear that activating these wands is a swift or immediate action respectively. (Check the comment thread in the wand handbook I linked above for examples of how we're using this in one of our current games.) 

Cancer prognosis: I am now cancer-free.

Weekly Optimization Series: Show
These are NOT all my creations! The lead authors are identified as follows:
[TS] Tempest Stormwind, [AR] Andarious Rosethorn, [RT] Radical Taoist, [SN] Sionnis, [DH] DisposableHero_, [SH] Seishi.

[TS] The Pinball Brothers: Large And In Charge (Melee, Lockdown, Charge, Juggling)
[TS] Ashardalon Reborn: I Will Swallow Your Soul (Melee, Fear, Negative Levels, AoE, Theme)
[AR] "A"-Game Paladin: Play That Funky Music, Knight Boy! (Team Support, Melee, Theme, Single-Class)
[RT] Uncanny Trapsmith: Get in, make it look like an accident, get out. (Skillmonkey, Stealth/Scout/Infiltration, Unorthodox Methods, Theme)
[AR] Wizsassin: *Everything* is permitted. (Spellcaster, Support, Sneak Attack, Utility)
[TS] Phantom Rush: General Gish Gouda. (Gish, Theme, Setting-Specific(Eberron), Early-Entry PrC)
[TS] Storm Knight: Another kind of gish. (Melee/"Gish", Theme, Setting-Specific(Eberron), Unorthodox Methods)
[TS] Inevitable Nightmare: The weapon you only have to fire once. (Melee, "Unorthodox" Methods (no charging), Reliability)
[AR] Captain Constitution: The number one threat to America. (Melee, TOUGHTOUGHTOUGH, Defense, Theme)
[AR] Nuker: I casts the spells that makes the peoples fall down! (Spellcaster, damage, blasting, damage)
[TS] Dread Lord of the Dead: Let the Reaping Begin! (NPC-only, Variable (combat/casting/leadership), Iconic Villain, Theme)
[AR] Heavy Crusader: No Rest. No Mercy. No Matter What. (Melee, Damage (No charging), Variable, Theme).
[TS] Gun Fu: It's bullet time (Ranged, THEORETICAL, Twin weapons, Theme)
[RT] Face First: We should talk. (Psionic, social, mind-control, info-management)
[SN] Chaingun Porcupine: Never Enuff Dakka. (Ranged, Skirmishing, Spike Damage, Incarnum)
[RT] Always On Edge: The Mortal Draw deals death. (Melee, Generalist, Dungeoneering, Stunt)
[AR] Feral Druid: Real feral taste. Zero druid calories. (Melee, offense, damage, murder)
[RT] Rusty!: Man's Best Friend (Sentry, Support, Backup, Rearguard)
[RT] The T3 (Tashalatora Triple Threat): My Kung Fu is More Powerful (Hybrid, Flex-Function, Melee, Caster)
[RT] The #1 Snoipah: Boom. 'Eadshot. (Caster, Theme, Spike, Trapscout)
[AR] Dreamblade: Rest in Pieces. (Melee, Damage, Single-Class, Combo/Momentum)
[AR] Evasion Tank: “When fighting angry blind men, is best to stay out of the way.” (Melee, Tank, Unorthodox Methods (attack negation), Theme)
[DH] Psycarnum Warrior: ↑↑↓↓←→←→BA Start (Melee, Tank, Psionics, Incarnum, 1337 h4x)
[AR] Heavy Weapons Elf: WHO TOUCHED MY BOW? (Ranged, Cohort, Damage, Unorthodox Methods (ranged ToB))
[RT] Gnowhere Gnome: A little man who wasn't there (Caster, Stealth, Single-Class, Elusive)
[AR] Uberflank: I got your back. (Melee, support, stunt, teamwork)
[TS] Flip the Bird: Everyday I'm shuffling (Ranged, harrier, unorthodox methods (ranged ToB / off-turn movement), support)
[DH] Eat Sleep Gank: Real Ultimate Power (Stealth, Assassination, Spike, Magic Versatility)
[AR] Slash and Burn: Mind, Body, Blade, Flame / Aspects of a greater whole / which delivers death. (Melee, Theme (flex-style), Damage, Stunt)
[RT] Edge of the Light: Cut, Fade to Black (Melee, Defense/Offense, Momentum, Tactical)
[RT] Quiet Murder: Cut throats, not corners. (Melee, Stealth, Harrier, Tactical)
[TS] Wand Overdrive: Say Hello to my little friends. (Caster, support/artillery/variable, wand specialist)
[RT] God Hand: What did the five fingers say to the face? (Melee/Gish, Unarmed, SAD, Theme)
[AR] Zero Buff Time Gish: Try to keep up! (Gish, Speed, Movement, Opportunity)
[TS] Robo Tackle: I Am Iron Man. (Melee, setting-specific (Eberron), positioning, theme, stunt)


Want to see how the entire group rolls?
[All] Party Optimization Showcase: Dead for Nothing
[TS/RT/AR] Optimization Article: The Flash Step
[RT] Optimization Article: Kung Fu Witchcraft
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1 year ago  ::  May 23, 2012 - 10:03PM #20
Deoxhydroxinate
Date Joined: Jun 3, 2007
Posts: 237
I was thinking of extending wraithstrikes; granted, I doubt you'd need such a thing but it is fun to use. 

The wand chamber was exactly what I was talking about.  Those are extremely handy.
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