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6 months ago  ::  Jan 01, 2013 - 1:21AM #251
Matyr
Date Joined: Jun 19, 2004
Posts: 2,726
I feel like that is pretty apparent from the first bullet point...
Currently working on making a Dex based defender.  Check it out here
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Need a few pre-generated characters for a one-shot you are running?  Want to get a baseline for what an effective build for a class you aren't familiar with?  Check out the Pregen thread here
If ever you are interested what it sounds like to be at my table check out my blog and podcast here
Also, I've recently done an episode on "Refluffing".  You can check that out here
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6 months ago  ::  Jan 01, 2013 - 2:25AM #252
baldhermit
Date Joined: Apr 3, 2010
Posts: 1,081

Since I think this is a build that many new players should find attractive, and yet it has not been posted, let me give it a shot:

   Crossbow Rogue build.

Difficulty * or **. Mostly depending on 2 issues:
- keep track of your attack and damage bonuses from your current position
- understanding the rules about hiding. I recommend reading this:  community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/758....

This little guy is about about shooting people in the back, ideally when they did not know where he was at, and leaving the face to face fighting to his allies.

Please note that in heroic, healing has a range of 5, so you do not want to wander too far away from your party.

As a recommendation, or if you feel brave enough to try and build something like this for yourself, check this out: community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/758...

I picked Drow for the racial feature that makes it easier to hide, but if you have a different preference, any Dex/Cha race will do. I picked the Outlaw theme for RP reasons mostly, though the power of at-will daze is not to be underestimated.

The basic trick of this build is to gain combat advantage due to being hidden from the monster you are attacking, as a result granting you a +2 bonus to attack and allowing you to apply your striker mechanic called Sneak Attack, which deals additional damage. Because of the First Strike feature, at the start of combat you will have Combat Advantage vs any monster. Use it to make an attack, move at least 3 squares, perform a stealth check, and hide. Each successive turn you either attack from a hidden position, or you move first, stealth check, hide and then attack. You want that CA every turn.

Please note this is not the most optimised version of how this build can work, this is purposely made into a simple version. I did not choose Sneak in the Attack as Utility power, the items picked have few if any features that require in-combat tracking.

level 1 Show

level 1 Drow, Rogue Build: Cutthroat Rogue
Rogue Tactics: Cunning Sneak
Rogue: Sharpshooter Talent Sharpshooter
Talent: Sharpshooter Talent (Crossbow)
Background: Dalelands (Dalelands Benefit)

FINAL ABILITY SCORES: Str 10, Con 11, Dex 20, Int 8, Wis 10, Cha 16.

STARTING ABILITY SCORES: Str 10, Con 11, Dex 18, Int 8, Wis 10, Cha 14.

AC: 17 Fort: 10 Reflex: 17 Will: 13 HP: 23 Surges: 6 Surge Value: 5

TRAINED SKILLS Stealth +12, Thievery +10, Perception +5, Streetwise +8, Acrobatics +10, Bluff +8

FEATS Level 1: Crossbow Expertise

POWERS
Lolthtouched: Cloud of Darkness
Rogue at-will 1: Deft Strike
Rogue at-will 1: Sly Flourish
Rogue encounter 1: Unbalancing Shot
Rogue daily 1: Blinding Barrage

ITEMS Leather Armor, Hand Crossbow


Level 5 allows us a second daily that also blinds.

level 5 Show
level 5 Drow, Rogue Build: Cutthroat Rogue
Rogue Tactics: Cunning Sneak
Rogue: Sharpshooter Talent
Sharpshooter Talent: Sharpshooter Talent (Crossbow)
Choose Terrain Type: Level 5 Outlaw Feature (Hills and Mountains)
Background: Dalelands (Dalelands Benefit)

FINAL ABILITY SCORES: Str 10, Con 11, Dex 21, Int 8, Wis 10, Cha 17.

STARTING ABILITY SCORES: Str 10, Con 11, Dex 18, Int 8, Wis 10, Cha 14.

AC: 21 Fort: 13 Reflex: 21 Will: 16 HP: 43 Surges: 6 Surge Value: 10

TRAINED SKILLS Stealth +15, Thievery +12, Perception +7, Streetwise +10, Acrobatics +12, Bluff +10

FEATS
Level 1: Crossbow Expertise
Level 2: Backstabber
Level 4: Clutch of Darkness

POWERS
Lolthtouched: Cloud of Darkness
Rogue at-will 1: Deft Strike
Rogue at-will 1: Sly Flourish
Rogue encounter 1: Unbalancing Shot
Rogue daily 1: Blinding Barrage
Rogue utility 2: Tumble
Rogue encounter 3: Fleeting Spirit Strike
Rogue daily 5: Go for the Eyes

ITEMS Amulet of Protection +1, Point Blank Hand Crossbow +1, Sylvan Leather Armor +1, Rhythm Blade Dagger +1


At level 6 you've picked up Improved Cunning Sneak, allowing you to move only 2 squares before making a Stealth check.

level 8 Show
level 8 Drow, Rogue  Build: Cutthroat Rogue
Rogue Tactics: Cunning Sneak
Rogue: Sharpshooter Talent
Sharpshooter Talent: Sharpshooter Talent (Crossbow)
Choose Terrain Type: Level 5 Outlaw Feature (Hills and Mountains)
Background: Dalelands (Dalelands Benefit)

FINAL ABILITY SCORES: Str 10, Con 11, Dex 22, Int 8, Wis 10, Cha 18.

STARTING ABILITY SCORES: Str 10, Con 11, Dex 18, Int 8, Wis 10, Cha 14.

AC: 25 Fort: 15 Reflex: 24 Will: 19 HP: 58 Surges: 6 Surge Value: 14

TRAINED SKILLS Stealth +19, Thievery +15, Perception +9, Streetwise +13, Acrobatics +15, Bluff +13

FEATS
Level 1: Crossbow Expertise
Level 2: Backstabber
Level 4: Clutch of Darkness
Level 6: Improved Cunning Sneak
Level 8: Improved Initiative

POWERS
Lolthtouched: Cloud of Darkness
Rogue at-will 1: Deft Strike
Rogue at-will 1: Sly Flourish
Rogue encounter 1: Unbalancing Shot
Rogue daily 1: Blinding Barrage
Rogue utility 2: Tumble
Rogue encounter 3: Fleeting Spirit Strike
Rogue daily 5: Go for the Eyes
Rogue utility 6: Swift Parry
Rogue encounter  7: Snap Shot

ITEMS Sylvan Leather Armor +2, Rhythm Blade Dagger +1, Point Blank Hand Crossbow +2, Amulet of Life +1

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6 months ago  ::  Jan 01, 2013 - 7:48AM #253
Kurald_Galain
Date Joined: Aug 24, 2007
Posts: 1,628
I note that of the three wizards listed in the top post, two are straight controllers and one is a bladesinger. I've seen frequent requests for a blaster wizard, and they're rather straightforward to play. So here I offer a Genasi pyromancer. This is a first draft, if the Powers That Be think this is an acceptable build for the thread I'll expand it further with L1/L5 builds and strategic notes and such.

Spoiler: Show

====== Created Using Wizards of the Coast D&D Character Builder ======
Tim, level 8
Genasi, Wizard (Mage)
School: Evocation School
School: Pyromancy School

Expert Mage Option: Evocation School Expert
Born under a Bad Sign (Born under a Bad Sign Benefit)
 
FINAL ABILITY SCORES
STR 19, CON 10, DEX 10, INT 21, WIS 13, CHA 8
 
STARTING ABILITY SCORES
STR 15, CON 10, DEX 10, INT 17, WIS 13 CHA 8
 
 
AC: 24 Fort: 20 Ref: 22 Will: 19
HP: 60 Surges: 6 Surge Value: 15
 
TRAINED SKILLS
Arcana +14, Dungeoneering +10, History +14, Nature +12, Religion +14
 
UNTRAINED SKILLS
Acrobatics +4, Athletics +9, Bluff +5, Diplomacy +5, Endurance +8, Heal +6, Intimidate +5, Insight +6, Perception +6, Stealth +4, Streetwise +3, Thievery +4
 
POWERS
Basic Attack: Melee Basic Attack
Basic Attack: Ranged Basic Attack
Genasi Racial Power: Firepulse
Wizard Utility: Chameleon's Mask
Wizard Utility: Mage Hand

Wizard Utility: Suggestion
Wizard Attack 1: Flaming Sphere
Wizard Attack 1: Fountain of Flame
Wizard Attack 1: Orbmaster's Incendiary Detonation
Wizard Attack 1: Chill Strike
Wizard Attack 1: Arc Lightning
Wizard Attack 1: Freezing Burst
Wizard Attack 1: Magic Missile
Wizard Utility 2: Moonstride
Wizard Utility 2: Guardian Blades
Wizard Attack 3: Fire Shroud
Wizard Attack 3: Call the Night Wind
Wizard Attack 5: Summon Magma Beast
Wizard Attack 5: Stinking Cloud
Wizard Utility 6: Fire Shield
Wizard Utility 6: Wizard's Escape
Wizard Attack 7: Thunder Cage
Wizard Attack 7: Corrosive Mist
 
FEATS
Level 1: Elemental Empowerment
Level 2: Enlarge Spell
Level 4: Staff Expertise
Level 6: Superior Implement Training (Accurate staff)
Level 8: Elemental Echo
 
ITEMS
Accurate staff of Ruin +2 x1
Gauntlets of Blood (heroic tier) x1
Magic Cloth Armor (Basic Clothing) +2 x1
Magic Amulet +2 x1
====== End ======



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6 months ago  ::  Jan 01, 2013 - 8:29AM #254
svendj
Date Joined: Apr 14, 2010
Posts: 2,137

Dec 31, 2012 -- 6:35AM, baldhermit wrote:

Svendj, I was not aware that the Bladesinger build submitted by you, that is not the reason I selected that one as something we perhaps should want new players to stay away from.
My main issue with the Bladesinger are the basic requirement to boost two ability scores that lead to the same defense. As a whole it is just very poorly designed, and I do not think it is something anyone should want to play.


True, maybe I should shuffle the stats around and make it a STR primary, DEX secondary build.

Dec 31, 2012 -- 6:46AM, ezrider23 wrote:

I'm no opper but i know that Svendj's Bard helped spring board me into making a build that i was going to use in a homegame, went Cleric|Ranger, so i would consider this another great tool of this thread. 


Appreciate it!

Dec 31, 2012 -- 7:57AM, Matyr wrote:

So in the Bladesinger entry in the index I could have a note that says: "If you like the fluff behind this class, make sure you also take a look at the Wizard|Swordmage build located here.  If you want to be a little darker with your magic, how about checking out this 5 star build: *link to Darth Vader build*"


I'll look into it.

Dec 31, 2012 -- 9:36AM, Matyr wrote:

If I had weighed in on the discussion about Ardents it would be to default to something strong, but simpler.  This is a good example of what these builds can highlight.  It should be included in there somewhere that the player should look at the other at-will and why it wasn't included.  I think Ezrider showed how easy it can be to confused about that particular power.


Will do. 

Dec 31, 2012 -- 9:36AM, Matyr wrote:

Svendj you started working on a monk and then stopped.  Should I start working on one, or are you going to go back and finish it?



I will definitely finish it.

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6 months ago  ::  Jan 01, 2013 - 8:46AM #255
Matyr
Date Joined: Jun 19, 2004
Posts: 2,726

Jan 1, 2013 -- 8:29AM, svendj wrote:


Dec 31, 2012 -- 7:57AM, Matyr wrote:

So in the Bladesinger entry in the index I could have a note that says: "If you like the fluff behind this class, make sure you also take a look at the Wizard|Swordmage build located here.  If you want to be a little darker with your magic, how about checking out this 5 star build: *link to Darth Vader build*"


I'll look into it.




This was meant as an index comment for what I plan to do with the Original posts.  You don't need to add anything to your specific threads.

Currently working on making a Dex based defender.  Check it out here
Spoiler: Show
Need a few pre-generated characters for a one-shot you are running?  Want to get a baseline for what an effective build for a class you aren't familiar with?  Check out the Pregen thread here
If ever you are interested what it sounds like to be at my table check out my blog and podcast here
Also, I've recently done an episode on "Refluffing".  You can check that out here
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6 months ago  ::  Jan 01, 2013 - 8:48AM #256
digeverystripe
Date Joined: Oct 12, 2012
Posts: 60
i would like to (patiently!) remind anyone that may have the experience that i wouldn't mind a dark or star pack warlock build.
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6 months ago  ::  Jan 01, 2013 - 12:28PM #257
ezrider23
Date Joined: Jan 27, 2009
Posts: 1,102

Jan 1, 2013 -- 8:48AM, digeverystripe wrote:

i would like to (patiently!) remind anyone that may have the experience that i wouldn't mind a dark or star pack warlock build.



While it would be cool to see one up in the thread, you could attempt a build and create a thread for some help. Most folks here will be glad to help you flesh out a build.

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6 months ago  ::  Jan 01, 2013 - 4:02PM #258
digeverystripe
Date Joined: Oct 12, 2012
Posts: 60
i feel like this isn't the thread to really "fix" a suboptimal build. i'll make another thread for it if that's what people want, but i already had someone offer to make one and i feel like that's just a lot simpler.
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6 months ago  ::  Jan 01, 2013 - 4:10PM #259
Matyr
Date Joined: Jun 19, 2004
Posts: 2,726
I said I would make one, but I haven't gotten around to it.  Its on my list of things to do, just not very high on it atm.
Currently working on making a Dex based defender.  Check it out here
Spoiler: Show
Need a few pre-generated characters for a one-shot you are running?  Want to get a baseline for what an effective build for a class you aren't familiar with?  Check out the Pregen thread here
If ever you are interested what it sounds like to be at my table check out my blog and podcast here
Also, I've recently done an episode on "Refluffing".  You can check that out here
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Cancel
6 months ago  ::  Jan 01, 2013 - 5:20PM #260
ezrider23
Date Joined: Jan 27, 2009
Posts: 1,102
Thus my point of posting the build in it's own brand new thread for questions and commentary. If you are looking for cookie cutter just hold on a while. If it is something you are looking to play even if sub optimal post it up on the board and folks will help where and when they can. 

You will definitely get more feed back when you do some of the work on your own. 
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