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1 year ago ::
Apr 22, 2012 - 10:43AM
#1
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Date Joined:
Oct 25, 2009
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I use my 4e books a LOT. Whether it's rules checks in the RC at the table, session planning, or just casual reading, my books see a lot of page turning action. I've been noticing that my softcovered books are starting to show signs of wear, but differently.
Here's my experience:
- Rules Compendium - this sees the most use and as expected it is getting dog eared at the corners and scuffed up and dirty looking. The good news is that the binding has held together well and no pages have fallen out yet. This is impressive for what is just a glued edge binding which are notorious for page loss.
- Fallen Lands / Forgotten Kingdoms - similar to the the RC in construction and durability. I'm impressed with their ability to hold together despite some pretty heavy use.
- Dungeon Masters Book / Monster Vault - I'm grouping these two together because they see equal amounts of use and appear to have exactly the same type of binding, materials, and general construction (sewn bindings with edge glued). These ones looked like a better construction than the RC but I fear that the glue is drying and they will not age very well.
- Monster Vault: Nentir Vale - this book is on the verge of falling apart after only a few months of use. Granted, I've read the book cover to cover several times, but it just doesn't have a quality binding. The stiching is very loose and the glue is giving way already. Very disappointed.
- Shadowfell boxed set - The main book has a binding similar to that of the Nentir Vale book but overall seems to be better constructed. The stiching seems tight and the glue is holding up well.
- Book of Vile Darkness - The main book (DM book) has a simple edge glue binding that is coming apart after just a few reads through. This is the most disappointing softcover binding so far. There is no doubt that were I to use this book to same level as the RC it would disintegrate and end up hole punched in a binder.
Overall, I've noticed a wide range of quality levels when it comes to the softcover bindings, with the general trend towards decreasing quality. I was wondering if anyone feels the same way I do or maybe has a different experience.
I'm all for hardcover books with the one exception of the RC. It is very nice to have a quick digest sized softcover to throw in the book bag. I hope that the recent trend of returning to hardcover books is the path going forward in D&D Next.
Want to know more about the history of D&D, especially how to play older editions of the game? Check out Crazy Monkey's "Tour through the editions":
http://community.wizards.com/crazymonkey/go/forum/view/133793/225799/Asylum_Play-by-Post
The current edition is BECMI, the most popular form of Basic D&D and the adventure is the classic Red Box quest to kill Bargle the evil magic user. Check it out, learn about the games roots, and enjoy the story as it unfolds.
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1 year ago ::
Apr 22, 2012 - 12:17PM
#2
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though i have all of the books you name, i havent used many of them very much so i cant comment. but the rc and shadowfell get put thru hell in my campaign and they are both fine
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1 year ago ::
Apr 22, 2012 - 3:24PM
#3
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Date Joined:
Oct 24, 2001
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I use my 4e books a LOT. Whether it's rules checks in the RC at the table, session planning, or just casual reading, my books see a lot of page turning action. I've been noticing that my softcovered books are starting to show signs of wear, but differently.
Your experience matches my own, although I do not use the Book of Vile Darkness... at all.
Here are the PHB essentia, in my opinion: - Three Basic Rules (p 11)
- Power Types and Usage (p 54)
- Skills (p178-179)
- Feats (p 192)
- Rest and Recovery (p 263)
- All of Chapter 9 [Combat] (p 264-295)
A player needs to read the sections for building his or her character -- race, class, powers, feats, equipment, etc. But those are PC-specific. The above list is for everyone, regardless of the race or class or build or concept they are playing.
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1 year ago ::
Apr 25, 2012 - 4:17AM
#4
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Date Joined:
Mar 16, 2011
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HotFL and HotFK get the most use out of my softcovers and they are ok, covers are bit dog eared though. Everything else is ok but I take quite good care of my books and keep them on a shelf and I rarely need to carry them around.
(+1 about Book of Vile Darkness. Bit of a white elephant on my shelf, although there's some nice ideas for traps in there. I ought to look at it a bit more. :p)
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1 year ago ::
Apr 25, 2012 - 8:26AM
#5
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My 1st edition PHB, DMG, Monster Manuals, Fiend Folio's, Wilderness Survival Guide etc are all in pretty good condition. And I got those as hand me downs in the 80's as a kid. I have a bookcase full of almost every 3E hardback. These stand up.
My 2nd edition Complete Book of X splats mostly fell apart. Monster Vault of Nenthir Vale fell apart. HOTFK and HOTFL are still intact, mostly by virtue of rarely being used, since I have a hardback 4E PHB.
Softcovers flat out suck. The 5 bucks you save on Amazon or whatever isnt worth the dramatic drop in quality and long term usefulness. Even worse are the crappy little stapled books of rules (modules are ok). So for rule books, its hardbacks all the way.
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1 year ago ::
Apr 25, 2012 - 8:32AM
#6
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ive had 3 or 4 1e UAs fall apart, and my BECMI RC is falling apart too, so hardbacks arent always good either
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1 year ago ::
Apr 25, 2012 - 3:45PM
#7
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Date Joined:
Sep 30, 2006
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i've had the RC for about a year and it's held up like a champ. i've dropped it off my desk about a hundred times and all i have to show for it is a little bit of dog earing on the cover.
i fully anticipated having to buy that book about five times, so i'm pretty happy with how it's turned out.
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1 year ago ::
Apr 26, 2012 - 8:16PM
#8
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ive had 3 or 4 1e UAs fall apart, and my BECMI RC is falling apart too, so hardbacks arent always good either
Yeah, there's a huge difference with the core 3 and everything else for 1e, though my FF is pretty good.
The 4e softcovers I have seem pretty rugged so far. The covers will wear of course, but HotF* and RC etc are not doing bad at all. Considering that many of my 4e hardcovers are close to losing pages already (AV1 pretty much shot) I think the saving of 5 bucks is well worth it, as I can't see where the hardbacks are high enough quality to matter.
Gotta say, I hope WotC will offer some REAL durable bindings for 5e books.
That is not dead which may eternal lie
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1 year ago ::
Apr 28, 2012 - 7:31AM
#9
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Date Joined:
Oct 25, 2009
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Considering that many of my 4e hardcovers are close to losing pages already (AV1 pretty much shot)
I'm glad I'm not the only one noticing this. As my 4e books age, especially books released after the core 3 and before Heroes of Shadow, I'm noticing their bindings starting to let go of pages. This is most noticable on the pages right at the beginning and the end of the book where the paper gets pulled by being attached to the colored heavy paper glued to the hard covers. The worst of my books are AV1 (not surprising seeing the amount of use it gets), Dungeon Delve (very surprising because it doesn't see a huge amount of use) and Manual of the Planes (also used a lot).
I fear that my 4e hardcovers will not last the test of time. In contrast, my core 1e books are still going strong despite 30 years of abuse.
Gotta say, I hope WotC will offer some REAL durable bindings for 5e books.
I'm not holding my breath. Proper book manufacturing is a dying art, and an expensive one. I collect archival quality books of classic novels and they typically run $50 to $100. These books are printed on acid free paper, have drilled, sewn and glued fabric bindings (acid free, archival glue) and have very well made hardcovers that hold the binding securely in place. These are the kinds of books you'll find in good shape in a library 200 years from now.
What's wrong with me? One of my past careers was a librarian and I have a thing for books 
I don't think WotC can make anything close to what I'd like (who's going to buy a $100 D&D book?) and I suspect the bindings we see for 4e are about as good as we're going to get unless WotC jacks up the price by about $10 per hardcover.
The book publishing industry is dying a slow death.
Want to know more about the history of D&D, especially how to play older editions of the game? Check out Crazy Monkey's "Tour through the editions":
http://community.wizards.com/crazymonkey/go/forum/view/133793/225799/Asylum_Play-by-Post
The current edition is BECMI, the most popular form of Basic D&D and the adventure is the classic Red Box quest to kill Bargle the evil magic user. Check it out, learn about the games roots, and enjoy the story as it unfolds.
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1 year ago ::
Apr 28, 2012 - 7:39AM
#10
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Date Joined:
Oct 25, 2009
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Your experience matches my own, although I do not use the Book of Vile Darkness... at all.
Have you read the 4e BoVD? It's surprisingly good. After the pile of garbage that was the 3e BoVD, I was dead set against a 4e version and filled these forums with many pages of anger directed at WotC for sullying 4e with another BoVD. Then I saw it at my local game shop and was extremely surprised with it. I find it to be a useful look at the nature of evil in a fantasy game, a thoughtful analysis of how evil should exist in the D&D world. There's none of the moronic gross-out and sexual torture of the 3e version. It also has some great traps, monsters, and magic items.
It's not a book I use on a regular basis, but I'm quite happy to put it on my shelf with my other 4e books.
Want to know more about the history of D&D, especially how to play older editions of the game? Check out Crazy Monkey's "Tour through the editions":
http://community.wizards.com/crazymonkey/go/forum/view/133793/225799/Asylum_Play-by-Post
The current edition is BECMI, the most popular form of Basic D&D and the adventure is the classic Red Box quest to kill Bargle the evil magic user. Check it out, learn about the games roots, and enjoy the story as it unfolds.
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