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Switch to Forum Live View Booming Blade and movement.
1 year ago  ::  Apr 09, 2012 - 3:13AM #11
TheOUCrew
Date Joined: Jun 18, 2009
Posts: 285
Indeed, both powers can be read either way.  But we have a CS response that actually jibes with common sense and doesn't violate RAW.  Do you really want basic slide powers to get rediculous damage?  There's no save, since the storm pillar is player created and not hindering terrain.  And there are plenty of powers out there that give slides with no hit necessary. 

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1 year ago  ::  Apr 09, 2012 - 10:23AM #12
Alcestis
Date Joined: Oct 7, 2009
Posts: 7,884
Storm Pillar is not at all the same. Storm Pillar is specifically per square. Booming Blade is per "away." Whether "away" can be triggered multiple times is highly amibigious, Storm Pillar's wording is not.
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1 year ago  ::  Apr 09, 2012 - 11:21AM #13
Mirtek
  • Dragon Slayer
Date Joined: Aug 4, 2001
Posts: 3,446

Apr 5, 2012 -- 4:41PM, Mand12 wrote:

Also worth noting that by RAW forced movement also triggers it.


But only if applied during the monster's own turn via an interrupt or readied action

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1 year ago  ::  Apr 09, 2012 - 11:40AM #14
mellored
Date Joined: Jul 8, 2008
Posts: 19,459

Apr 9, 2012 -- 11:21AM, Mirtek wrote:

Apr 5, 2012 -- 4:41PM, Mand12 wrote:

Also worth noting that by RAW forced movement also triggers it.


But only if applied during the monster's own turn via an interrupt or readied action


Or dominate, or foce push, or a mark by a paladin, or...

guides Show
my builds Show

F-111 Interdictor Long (200+ squares) distance ally teleporter.  With some warlord stuff.  Broken in a plot way, not a power way.
Thought Switch   Higher level build that grants upto 14 attacks on turn 1.  If your allies play along, it's broken.
Elven Critters Crit op with crit generation.  5 of these will end anything.  Broken.
King Fisher Does an excellent job at keeping an enemy disabled in a few ways.  Strong.
Boominator Fun catch-22 booming blade build with either strong or completely broken damage depending on your reading.
Very Distracting Warlock Lot's of dazing and major penalties to hit.  Overpowered.
Pocket Protector Pixie Stealth Knight. Maximizing the defender's aura by being in an ally's/enemy's square.
Yakuza NinjIntimiAdin: Perma-stealth Striker that offers a little protection for ally's, and can intimidate bloodied enemies. Very Strong.
Chargeburgler with cheese Ranged attacks at the end of a charge along with perma-stealth. Solid, could be overpowered if tweaked.
Void Defender Defends giving a penalty to hit anyone but him, then removing himself from play. Can get somewhat broken in epic.
Scry and Die Attacking from around corners, while staying hidden. Moderate to broken, depending on the situation.
Skimisher Fly in, attack, and fly away. Also prevents enemies from coming close. Moderate to Broken depending on the enemy, but shouldn't make the game un-fun, as the rest of your team is at risk, and you have enough weaknesses.
Indestructible Simply won't die, even if you sleep though combat.
Sir Robin (Bravely Charge Away) He automatically slows and pushes an enemy (5 squares), while charging away. Hard to rate it's power level, since it's terrain dependent.
Death's Gatekeeper A fun twist on a healic, making your party "unkillable". Overpowered to Broken, but shouldn't actually make the game un-fun, just TPK proof.
Death's Gatekeeper mk2, (Stealth Edition) Make your party "unkillable", and you hidden, while doing solid damage. Stronger then the above, but also easier for a DM to shut down. Broken, until your DM get's enough of it.
Domination and Death Dominate everything then kill them quickly. Only works @ 30, but is broken multiple ways.
Battlemind Mc Prone-Daze Protecting your allies by keeping enemies away. Quite powerful.
The Retaliator Getting hit deals more damage to the enemy then you receive yourself, and you can take plenty of hits. Heavy item dependency, Broken.
Dead Kobold Transit Teleports 98 squares a turn, and can bring someone along for the ride. Not fully built, so i can't judge the power
Psilent Guardian Protect your allies, while being invisible. Overpowered, possibly broken
Unnamed Avenger|Runepriest/Hammer of Vengance Do lot's of damage while boosting your teams. Strong to slightly overpowered.
Charedent BarrageA charging ardent. Fine in a normal team, overpowered if there are 2 together, and easily broken in teams of 5.
Super Knight A tough, sticky, high damage knight. Strong.
Super Duper Knight Basically the same as super knight, only far more broken.
Mora, the unkillable avenger Solid damage, while being neigh indestuctable. Overpowered, but not broken.
Swordburst Maximus At-Will Close Burst 3 that slide and prones.  Protects allies with off actions. Strong, possibly over powered with the right party.
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1 year ago  ::  Apr 10, 2012 - 2:49AM #15
TheOUCrew
Date Joined: Jun 18, 2009
Posts: 285

Apr 9, 2012 -- 10:23AM, Alcestis wrote:

Storm Pillar is not at all the same. Storm Pillar is specifically per square. Booming Blade is per "away." Whether "away" can be triggered multiple times is highly amibigious, Storm Pillar's wording is not.




I think you are reading extra meaning into the wording.  Let's take a look at both triggers:

Each enemy that moves into a square adjacent to the pillar on its turn takes 1d6 + your Intelligence modifier lightning damage.




vs

if the target is adjacent to you at the start of its next turn and moves away during that turn...




Storm pillar refers to each *enemy* not each square.  Moving into a square is the trigger, but there's nothing to specify that it occurs each time.  The difference in trigger from booming blade isn't signifcant.  Booming blade's trigger is "moves away."  Move has a specific meaning, namely, leaving one square to enter another.  The away part just tells us which direction the move has to be. 

Neither effect specifies how many times it occurs.  And while both powers could arguably be read to trigger multiple times a turn (although that would be pretty silly) there's no distinction that justifies using a different reading for each power. 





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1 year ago  ::  Apr 10, 2012 - 12:37PM #16
Alcestis
Date Joined: Oct 7, 2009
Posts: 7,884
Except iterative damage was established by FAQ for "a square" four years ago. So yes, other then the fact that I am right by RAW, by precedent, and by the standard English reading I am reading to much into it /eyeroll.

"Away" is ambigious, has no such precedent, and has many possible standard English readings. One is clear. One is not.
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1 year ago  ::  Apr 10, 2012 - 2:24PM #17
Mand12
Date Joined: Jun 17, 2010
Posts: 16,942
"away" is not ambiguous, it means "the distance between the two creatures increased."  Same definition as Push, inverse of Pull and Charge.
D&D Next = D&D:  Quantum Edition
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1 year ago  ::  Apr 10, 2012 - 4:00PM #18
Alcestis
Date Joined: Oct 7, 2009
Posts: 7,884

Apr 10, 2012 -- 2:24PM, Mand12 wrote:

"away" is not ambiguous, it means "the distance between the two creatures increased."  Same definition as Push, inverse of Pull and Charge.


"A square" is clear. It happens each square. "Moves away" is not clear, because it is not clear that it happens each time it moves away. I mean there is a credible argument that "it moves away from starting adjacent to you" is how it works, because of the first part of the power. So you'd get the damage each time it moved away from being adjacent. The whole power is ambigious and has at least four, possibly five, readings each of which agrees with the rules to one extent or another.

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1 year ago  ::  Apr 10, 2012 - 7:18PM #19
Mand12
Date Joined: Jun 17, 2010
Posts: 16,942
Well, I would argue that you would check the trigger each time a potentially triggering event ocurred.  And since squares of movements are explicitly events, each square of movement would be valid, just as they are for all other triggers.  You're then presented with three questions:

1)  Did it start its turn adjacent to you?  Y/N
2)  If Y, did it move?  Y/N
3)  If Y, was it away?  Y/N

If the answer is yes to all three, then the condition specified in Booming Blade is met.  I'm not clear on how there are any other potential interpretations based on its text.
D&D Next = D&D:  Quantum Edition
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1 year ago  ::  Apr 11, 2012 - 5:44AM #20
mellored
Date Joined: Jul 8, 2008
Posts: 19,459

Apr 10, 2012 -- 7:18PM, Mand12 wrote:

Well, I would argue that you would check the trigger each time a potentially triggering event ocurred.  And since squares of movements are explicitly events, each square of movement would be valid, just as they are for all other triggers.  You're then presented with three questions:

1)  Did it start its turn adjacent to you?  Y/N
2)  If Y, did it move?  Y/N
3)  If Y, was it away?  Y/N

If the answer is yes to all three, then the condition specified in Booming Blade is met.  I'm not clear on how there are any other potential interpretations based on its text.


That part is clear...

But those conditions can be met more then once.

guides Show
my builds Show

F-111 Interdictor Long (200+ squares) distance ally teleporter.  With some warlord stuff.  Broken in a plot way, not a power way.
Thought Switch   Higher level build that grants upto 14 attacks on turn 1.  If your allies play along, it's broken.
Elven Critters Crit op with crit generation.  5 of these will end anything.  Broken.
King Fisher Does an excellent job at keeping an enemy disabled in a few ways.  Strong.
Boominator Fun catch-22 booming blade build with either strong or completely broken damage depending on your reading.
Very Distracting Warlock Lot's of dazing and major penalties to hit.  Overpowered.
Pocket Protector Pixie Stealth Knight. Maximizing the defender's aura by being in an ally's/enemy's square.
Yakuza NinjIntimiAdin: Perma-stealth Striker that offers a little protection for ally's, and can intimidate bloodied enemies. Very Strong.
Chargeburgler with cheese Ranged attacks at the end of a charge along with perma-stealth. Solid, could be overpowered if tweaked.
Void Defender Defends giving a penalty to hit anyone but him, then removing himself from play. Can get somewhat broken in epic.
Scry and Die Attacking from around corners, while staying hidden. Moderate to broken, depending on the situation.
Skimisher Fly in, attack, and fly away. Also prevents enemies from coming close. Moderate to Broken depending on the enemy, but shouldn't make the game un-fun, as the rest of your team is at risk, and you have enough weaknesses.
Indestructible Simply won't die, even if you sleep though combat.
Sir Robin (Bravely Charge Away) He automatically slows and pushes an enemy (5 squares), while charging away. Hard to rate it's power level, since it's terrain dependent.
Death's Gatekeeper A fun twist on a healic, making your party "unkillable". Overpowered to Broken, but shouldn't actually make the game un-fun, just TPK proof.
Death's Gatekeeper mk2, (Stealth Edition) Make your party "unkillable", and you hidden, while doing solid damage. Stronger then the above, but also easier for a DM to shut down. Broken, until your DM get's enough of it.
Domination and Death Dominate everything then kill them quickly. Only works @ 30, but is broken multiple ways.
Battlemind Mc Prone-Daze Protecting your allies by keeping enemies away. Quite powerful.
The Retaliator Getting hit deals more damage to the enemy then you receive yourself, and you can take plenty of hits. Heavy item dependency, Broken.
Dead Kobold Transit Teleports 98 squares a turn, and can bring someone along for the ride. Not fully built, so i can't judge the power
Psilent Guardian Protect your allies, while being invisible. Overpowered, possibly broken
Unnamed Avenger|Runepriest/Hammer of Vengance Do lot's of damage while boosting your teams. Strong to slightly overpowered.
Charedent BarrageA charging ardent. Fine in a normal team, overpowered if there are 2 together, and easily broken in teams of 5.
Super Knight A tough, sticky, high damage knight. Strong.
Super Duper Knight Basically the same as super knight, only far more broken.
Mora, the unkillable avenger Solid damage, while being neigh indestuctable. Overpowered, but not broken.
Swordburst Maximus At-Will Close Burst 3 that slide and prones.  Protects allies with off actions. Strong, possibly over powered with the right party.
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