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1 year ago ::
Apr 16, 2012 - 9:34PM
#211
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Date Joined:
Feb 26, 2011
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Ok I was wrong, you're right. I did the math..
That 50% bit is a little low, I mean you can always reliably target 8 enemies, so isnt that automatically like 400% more damage?
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1 year ago ::
Apr 16, 2012 - 9:40PM
#212
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Date Joined:
Jun 19, 2004
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Ok I was wrong, you're right. I did the math..
That 50% bit is a little low, I mean you can always reliably target 8 enemies, so isnt that automatically like 400% more damage?
Well I did a little number crunching myself and came up with some interesting figures. It seems that you can reliably target 8 enemies 112% of the time. Meaning that you have the following equation:
1.12 (From the percentage this will happen) * (200 (I'm rounding down for a single target. With ToB and a daily buff from every class you can easily get 250) * (1.5 (50% damage buff from it being an AOE) * 8 (Minimum number of targets. As discussed earlier this could easily be increased by a factor of ten) = 2688 damage.
And thats just the damage you can rely on, its like a minimum or something. If you really tried you could easily go way way higher.
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1 year ago ::
Apr 16, 2012 - 9:54PM
#213
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Date Joined:
Feb 26, 2011
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No, its around 147 percent, its a bit higher since if you're flying you can catch additional enemies
1.47*(200 )*5(its 400% after all, you missed this)*9 (at least, flying enemies are common. thats what, over 9000 damage?
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1 year ago ::
Apr 16, 2012 - 10:04PM
#214
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Date Joined:
Mar 12, 2011
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@tsi re:unseelie eyes/darkvision i was attempting to make a sly point, much like the ToB discussion here.
Though it does bear noting that I know zero DMs that both pay any attention to the light/vision rules and allow sunrods, outside of LFR. It seems to be a near universal agreement that, when you (as the dm) want light to be an issue, sunrods too easily allow the issue to be ignored.
Taking a theme and a u2 is of variable opportunity cost depending on your class. weapon-based themes are much stronger than implement ones, and some classes have far better u2s than others. Is opportunity cost represented in this thread? Some classes have two or three encounter powers at every level better than any single option on other class lists. Do all of those go on this list, but not the ones for other classes? How does this list assist anyone in making a character?
Baja has said, in PMs, that it's meant as a list of powers people should just generally be aware of existing. I question the value of that. I am confident there are thousands of people unaware of the best heroic tier powers. I am also confident that these people are not reading charop, and that this thread would not help them even if someone linked them to it.
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1 year ago ::
Apr 17, 2012 - 5:37PM
#215
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Date Joined:
Jan 30, 2009
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No, its around 147 percent, its a bit higher since if you're flying you can catch additional enemies
1.47*(200 )*5(its 400% after all, you missed this)*9 (at least, flying enemies are common. thats what, over 9000 damage?
You are clearly underestimating this power. If you are flying and fighting flying enemies, I am fairly certain that you can be assured of having 26 adjacent. and, since they will be adjacent on both your turn and other turns, that is like 600% of the time. That is way more damage.
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1 year ago ::
Apr 17, 2012 - 5:43PM
#216
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You guys fail, because you are completely and utterly missing the point that you could be fighting 55 pixies at the same time, in every direction while flying, and thus dealing over 9000 damage to all of them for a bazillion damage.
Edit: poor math on my part. 53 Pixies. And if we're saying they can't temporarily achieve a height of 2 temporarily, just assume everyone is underwater.
Which, by the way, also by default makes every single Wrathvoker encounter and daily power so much better than gold, they're platinum.
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1 year ago ::
Apr 17, 2012 - 8:40PM
#217
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Date Joined:
Mar 27, 2011
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I am a little confused by this thread. Is Thicket of Blades supposed to be a good power or not? The original poster said it was and there is some math in the middle, but everyone else seems to be hung up on that power and giving really wierd equations for it. So is it worth picking or not?
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1 year ago ::
Apr 17, 2012 - 8:45PM
#218
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Date Joined:
Dec 22, 2010
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It is a decent power but nothing special.
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1 year ago ::
Apr 17, 2012 - 9:28PM
#219
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Date Joined:
Jun 18, 2010
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I am a little confused by this thread. Is Thicket of Blades supposed to be a good power or not? The original poster said it was and there is some math in the middle, but everyone else seems to be hung up on that power and giving really wierd equations for it. So is it worth picking or not?
Your confusion is exactly why this list is not just a poor list, but potentially misleading. ToB is a good power, close burst for lots of marking with relatively high damage and slowing to boot. However, the OP seemed to base his decision on this being a 'best' power based solely on damage which the OP attempted to calculate as the maximum possible damage the power could do (to the extent anyone can tell what the methodology of constructing this list actually is). Substantial parts of the commentary that follows are really just mockery of the maximum possible damage measure; easy pickings because the assumptions behind the measure are so absurd.
Your time is better spent reading the class handbooks.
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1 year ago ::
Apr 19, 2012 - 9:37AM
#220
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I agree with Darren.
It is poor form to claim that Rain of Blows is better than another power overall when contrasting it buffed up and another power in a vacuum.
The original ruling stands. I believe that Rain of Blows is in the great list. It does significant damage relative to the 4000 available powers.
If somoeone wants Rain of Blows to be on the best list for single target damage, then it would have to beat Bedeviling Assault. I currently believe that BA does more damage than RoB.
@fluffmonster - That is not entirely true. I stated reasons multiple ways, not just the max. The max was included in the ways though.
I stated in the third post that RoB does less damage than ToB and Flame Spiral.
Out of the box: 3w to even 2 targets > 3w to 1 target Someone posted the boosted max for RoB as 143. 143 < hitting 5 targets with ToB out of the box
I did not include any other considerations of ToB because I don't believe it necessary yet.
However, I agree with the idea that single target powers should be assessed against other single target powers. So therefore I will be modifying the third post in a few days to state that RoB does less damage than Bedeviling Assault.
@Koddiechanski - Any power on that list is a good power to have. I recommend that you check out a guide based on the class with the most powers you like.
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Concisely: I want a system where players don't have to pick between mechanics and roleplaying. I hope 5E fails asap so a better system can be made asap.
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