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Switch to Forum Live View Rule of Three - (2012 March 20th)
1 year ago  ::  Mar 19, 2012 - 9:23PM #1
trebor_rjf
Date Joined: Sep 30, 2006
Posts: 1,080
Rule-of-Three (2012 March 20th)
by Rodney Thompson

You've got questions—we've got answers! Here's how it works—each week, our Community Manager will be scouring all available sources to find whatever questions you're asking. We'll pick three of them for R&D to answer.

Talk about this news here.

 
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1 year ago  ::  Mar 19, 2012 - 9:40PM #2
Resurrection_Man
Date Joined: Jun 7, 2011
Posts: 9,530
Minions were one of 4e's rare valuable creation. I hope they stay. You could damage PCs with them. I wonder if this will still be the case.

Yeah, alignments are finally back! Maybe 5e will be DnD!! I missed DnD.
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1 year ago  ::  Mar 19, 2012 - 9:49PM #3
Chris_Lee66
Date Joined: Feb 15, 2012
Posts: 111
1) Personally, I've always found the minion rule to be a bit too gamist for my taste.  I much perfer this sort of scaling.  That said, I'm a bit concerned about the discussion of damage inflation, especially given that one of the items that most excites me about the upcoming edition being a flattening of the math but will withold judgement until I see the system in action.  Please, please don't use damage as just another means of level inflation.  I like the thought of tenth level characters being challenged by lower level creatures in larger numbers.

2) As a proponent of Editions of Dungeons and Dragons prior to 4th edition, I think that alignment is a central part of Dungeons and Dragons and definitely want to see it in game.  That said, I'd rather the mechanical aspects apply in a less pronounced fashion to beings not touched by some sort of cosmic good or evil in some fashion or another.  As an example, I dislike detect alignment spells a la 3.x detecting the alignment of a corrupt political official.  It's a disservice to the game and often difficult to handle from a DM standpoint. detracting from the game.  Allow those spells and effects to interact with devils, demons, angels, or servants of divine entities.  Leave the rest to whatever sense motive mechanic in the works.  

3)  Classes mechanics don't necessarily differentiate classes, so a repetition of mechanics isn't always a bad thing.  Combat maneuvers for martial characters (forgive my co-opt of the 4th ed term for a second) seems like an excellent direction to take the classes, especially given the concern that a large number of players have expressed in relation to boring and underpowered melee combat.  These sorts of maneuvers could be exactly the sort of flavor that would make combat more entertaining.
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1 year ago  ::  Mar 19, 2012 - 9:49PM #4
Bodyknock
Date Joined: Oct 24, 2007
Posts: 1,785

Mar 19, 2012 -- 9:23PM, trebor_rjf wrote:


Rule-of-Three (2012 March 20th)
by Rodney Thompson

You've got questions—we've got answers! Here's how it works—each week, our Community Manager will be scouring all available sources to find whatever questions you're asking. We'll pick three of them for R&D to answer.

Talk about this news here.

 


Interesting article. Quick comments:

- Using relative hit points to average damage for minions sounds ok. On the other hand a major point for having minions in the first place is that you don't have to track their hit points, they're either dead or not dead, so "minions with hit points" might defeat the purpose. Guess I'll have to see how it actually works in practice to have an opinion one way or another.


- Bringing back nine alignments is ok with me, but then again the five alignment system was ok to. My only gripe about alignments in the older editions was when they caused alignment disputes over whether or not a character was a particular alignment. From the article it sounds like the mechanical effects will be mainly inherent to NPC monsters and such that are "innately aligned" by the core of their nature, and if it's limited to that that's fine. I think most of the conflict happens when player characters are potentially game mechanically affected based on the character's given alignment.


- In terms of different mechanics for different classes I'll be happy if they at least have different mechanics within the same general archetypes of classes. So fighter and rogue using one type of mechanic while other martial characters like barbarians and warlords use other mechanics would work for me. Anything to improve the chance that you can play the sort of class you'd like to play using the sort of game mechanics you like to use is good idea I think.

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1 year ago  ::  Mar 19, 2012 - 9:55PM #5
FirstTurnKill
Date Joined: Jul 2, 2011
Posts: 2,790
1. I think minions are an unusual edition to the game.  They help the game significantly, but they do give me immersion pause.  I like the idea that they are shooting for "effectively minions" as presented in that answer.

As for the "bounded accuracy," and attack/defenses not scaling with level, is that really much different effectively than having armor function as damage reduction?  I'd suggest looking at the massive poll at the top of this forum about where opinions are on that.  I'm hesistantly worried that will put a lot of onus on gaming the mechanics of the system to effectively become invulnerable.  There aren't enough specifics presented here to see.

2. I honestly don't think anyone was expecting the nine alignments to not be presented as the default alignment grid.  What's interesting, and will be unfortunate to some/many, is reading into the deeper meaning behind the post that DDN will be given a distinctly flavorful presentation (war between Law and Chaos, Rod of Seven Parts, fundamental forces of existence).  I won't lie and say that doesn't help me as a DM and player out tremendously, because it does.  And I am personally excited to play DDN.  For others though, while overriding a default assumption that there is a war between Law and Chaos may be acceptable (like overriding a default assumption about Dwarves getting bonuses against Giants, or some such), I can easily see understandable disapproval in needing to override default assumptions about mechanical alignment.

I hope at least that mechanical alignment effects as presented in core are much more associated with those planar concepts and fundamental forces than they are with personality.

3. Sounds intriguing, not enough detail to comment.

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1 year ago  ::  Mar 19, 2012 - 9:58PM #6
Backspace
Date Joined: Sep 8, 2009
Posts: 152
I like the concept of bounded accuracy. It will be interesting to see how far they run with that idea, and how they handle scaling damage. Too much in combat calculations is a serious problem to overcome.
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1 year ago  ::  Mar 19, 2012 - 10:07PM #7
Crimson_Concerto
Date Joined: Aug 28, 2005
Posts: 9,949
This article is extremely disappointing. The author clearly doesn't understand minions at all, and having alignment mechanics as a core assumption rather than as an optional module is a massive strike against the new edition.

Why, yes, as a matter of fact I am the Unfailing Arbiter of All That Is Good Design (Even More So Than The Actual Developers) TM

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1 year ago  ::  Mar 19, 2012 - 10:07PM #8
Incenjucar
Date Joined: Jun 17, 2002
Posts: 1,515
They do not seem to grasp the actual purpose of minions, which is to reduce the amount of work the DM has to do, allowing them to be used without recording anything or rolling anything. I've already put PCs up against enemies so low in level that they can be one-shotted, but their abilities require as much effort to use as when they were higher-level than the party.
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1 year ago  ::  Mar 19, 2012 - 10:09PM #9
Incenjucar
Date Joined: Jun 17, 2002
Posts: 1,515

Mar 19, 2012 -- 10:07PM, Crimson_Concerto wrote:

This article is extremely disappointing. The author clearly doesn't understand minions at all, and having alignment mechanics as a core assumption rather than as an optional module is a massive strike against the new edition.




Alignment simply existing as a default would be fine. Alignment having mechanics, as they implied, as a default, is very discouraging. I absolutely love Planescape, and hope it has a nice fat set of optional rules regarding alignment, but I still don't want it built into the core game.

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1 year ago  ::  Mar 19, 2012 - 10:12PM #10
Azzy1974
Date Joined: Dec 12, 2011
Posts: 851
1. I like the sound of this. I'd like to learn more about how damage output is going to scale with level, though.

2. I'm truely thankful. I hope that the mechanical bits are easy to take out for those that don't want them. Otherwise, I'm pleased as punch.

3. Sounds about right, I suppose.
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