So I'm just gonna gripe a little. I've been feeling kinda down about this.
It's like my opinion never matters, or is a nuisance, to the group. I'm usually the sorta person who will go along with whatever the group says just to avoid conflict and keep the fun. However, when something DRASTICALLY goes against what my character would do, I'll speak up. It almost never amounts to anything though and sometimes my character is just shut out completely or recently, taken out of play long enough for the others to do what they want.
In our D&D 3.5 game I play a lawful good cleric (homebrew campaign deity) and I decided early on that I didn't want to be preachy. I have my ways, others have theirs. As long as no innocent gets hurt I'm fine with it. However, there came a point where some members of the group decided to blow up an entire city to end a war because they were the "enemy" (by applying real world science to magic rules and massively abusing the rules....all of which the DM allows a lot, they accomplish horrible, overpowered things). The DM made it clear that innocents, women, children, etc. would be dying too. Anyways, naturally I was hugely opposed to this both in game and out of game. It was ridiculous and unnecessary. It's not the kind of thing that makes the game fun for me. In between sessions though the rest of the group has a lot more contact with the DM than I do. I go into the next game expecting to be able to continue to make my case against the plan. Nope. The one who championed the idea of blowing up the city was contacting the DM out of game and planning the whole thing with the other group members. Next game starts with the city blown up, us sifting through the rubble, and the next arc of the story going. If I had known any of this, I'd have made a new character more in line with the rest of the group's intentions. They didn't want to lose their healer.
Now, that was quite a while ago, but a few days ago that feeling came back. We were playing Hunter: The Reckoning (vampire/supernatural slayers game). Same group, although different DM/Storyteller. One of the players, the DM from the D&D game actually, wanted us all to play as ourselves. It's cool for him, cause he translates well onto a character sheet with high stats in just about anything, excellent fighting ability, lots of guns and other resources. I get kinda depressed when I'm asked to make myself as a character because my specialties are few and don't really fit well in these kinds of games. Plus it just makes it hard to separate in-game stuff with out-of-game stuff, which is probably why I feel so miserable now.
Anyways, there was a disagreement near the end of the session similar to the D&D one, just on a much smaller scale. I was attempting to argue my case (and play my role as an "innocent" creed character) when the player I mentioned before rolled to grab me and throw me in the trunk of a police car. Again, his physical stats were something I couldn't possibly match up against and I was in the trunk for the rest of the game (about ten minutes real time) as they went ahead with what they wanted to do and wrapped up.
Does this seem right to you? Now I just feel useless again because there's nothing stopping this from happening every time I try to play my character. I'm considering graciously bowing out of the game since I felt humiliated by that encounter when I was having fun up until the trunk incident. I mean, the character wasn't me, but it was me. If I'm going to take in-game stuff like this so seriously I should probably separate myself from the game entirely, right?
I know I should just talk to them about it, but I worry that instead of making things better it'd just go the complete opposite way and feel like an artificial improvement "OH, SomeKinda is talking, let us stop what we're doing and listen so we don't upset her again". Or something like that. Plus I worry that I'm just being disruptive to the group because our play styles don't match completely.
Anyways sorry for the long rant. I just really needed to get it off my chest.
They sound like a bunch of jerks. There's two sides to every story, but if just the, "his character (which is based on him) threw my character (which is based on me) into a trunk for ten minutes and the group played without me," is true: you deserve better. Sounds like an ego-maniac, "Hey guys, let's play as us... by the way since I'm so big and tough and smart I obviously have better overall stats than any of you'se guys, and clearly need an in-game advantage to keep my inflated ego satiated. You disagree? Let's arm wrestle for it!"
Get a new group, there's alot of resources that people on these forums can link you to help you find a local gaming store where you can meet people in a somewhat public forum (so you're not taking any risks by going to some stranger's house) and play some 4e encounters or whatever else they got going at their tables. There are also plenty of online groups from what I hear too so you might also try that resource.
I wouldn't continue to play with any group who treated me or any member like that. Guys sometimes mess with eachother bit (usually to establish a social hierarchy), but there's good-natured ribbing (which should goes back and forth) and there's just plain bullying (always goes one way). If you do go back for even one more session with those guys: stand up for yourself. Tell them you're sick of the treatment and if they can't give you the respect you deserve, then you're done. Be bold.
Participating in roleplaying games should not come at the cost of your self respect.
Regarding the D&D situation, that is totally wrong.
First off, allowing the other characters to play outside of the game session and exclude you in blowing up the town is just plain wrong on so many levels. A DM shouldn't do something like that.
I also wonder how much communication went into the party makeup in advance. If you have a party that consists of an evil drow rogue, a goody-good cleric, a psychotic murderous wizard, a lone-wolf thief, a pixie prankster, and a tree-hugging ranger, and you have no connection to each other beyond "so, you're in a tavern and some mysterious dude offers you a job", you're going to wind up with a very fractitious party, and ending up with either a split in the party (and someone rolling a new character, hopefully one who is less of a party irritant) or PvP (No. Just no.).
I've never played Hunter, but a few things that seem odd to me:
First, I play D&D to play things that are different from me. In real life, I'm an out-of-shape, lanky, socially awkward guy with a boring job and a crappy car, and who hates to travel even if I could afford to vacation to exotic places. In D&D, I play an agile badass who travels across the reaches of a fantasy world and stabs people for a living. I think playing myself in D&D would be kind of pointless. I might as well play World of World of Warcraft (www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rw8gE3lnpLQ) People should be free to create whatever character they want, within the confines of the rules.
Secondly, how long does the rest of the party expect you to hang around with them? If you had friends who in real life would lock you in a car trunk and have fun without you, how often would you hang out with them? I can't imagine anyone continuing to work with people like that.
And if someone says "lets play as ourselves - I'm a total badass who is good at everything, so I'll just make myself out to be a godly character," I'm betting they have some serious issues with their self-perception. You are entitled to pity them as a free action.
So on two different occasions you've had a game turn into very-not-fun-time with the same group of people.
The conclusion should be obvious, but if it isn't, I'll clear it up for you: If you continue to game with these people, this is the experience you will continue to have. Find a new group to game with. Stay friends with them if you like them out of game, but don't keep gaming with them unless you're comfortable with the situation continuing to go that direction, because it clearly will.
"Not only are you wrong, but I even created an Excel spreadsheet to show you how wrong you are." --James Wyatt, May 2006
That's just terrible. Were you the only girl in the group? It feels like they were picking on you.
Especially in the second example, turning physical characteristics into stats is lame in a mixed gender group. Mental stats end up being the same, but most of the guys probably get higher physical stats. Right.
If he wants to make himself in the game, let him do it. No reason for everyone to.
Next time he wants to throw you in a trunk in game make him prove he can and kick him in the junk. If that doesn't work just grab them really hard and pull hair. Fight dirty then boost your stats to above his after he fails to throw you in a trunk, because obviously you have better stats than him. Then call him your b!^#& the rest of the time you play those characters. No man likes to be called that. Even more so by a woman. Just kick his ego down until they don't want to play themselves anymore. Or yeah just leave.
First part: Players should never be allowed to deal with the DM out of session in a way that cuts other members out of the way. At best, the DM should only be spoken to in such a way to clarfiy problems and determine whether X action is correct or incorrect given the context of the settings. The DM is meant to be entirely imparial to the members and while he shouldn't obstruct any player actions (E.g. If they wanted a to attempt a robbary the royal treasury dispite the fact it's heavily protected by the Kings Finest warriors and wizards) he shouldn't be making any deals under the table with members of the party. It's his univerce but it is not his duty to play god to empower some playersm ore then others, but to grant equal benfit and penaltys to the entire party.
Second part: While it was incredably mean, I would see this as a oppertunity for incharacter motivation to kill that SOB. Kind of like how in star wars an sith appertice will stall until he/she is strong enough. I have to debate about the DM's way of doing this though, explain the system to me? Did he use points buy to arrange his stats in such a manner, hence is lacking somewhere, or did he say "I want to be awesome like I am in real life" and got everything well boosted?
Either way, it seems fairly obvious with me that you are dealing with at least one jerkoff of immense measure and I would either consider leaving the group, talking to him directly out of character to sort out the differences between you two, or be equally as jerkish back, wait until he gets weakened then kill his character as incharacter vengangce in either setting.
lets answer this in a bit of a convoluted order, first:
there is a reason 4e doesn't pose rolling for stats as one of the original methods of genning characters. It sets up imbalances that suck the fun out of the game if someone is under everyone else. Its great to be the guy on top, but REALLY sucks to be the underdog. If you're going to play in that "play yourself" game, just look at his numbers, copy them, and redistribute them on your sheet in a way that makes sense for you. If he picked (to use D&D numbers as an example) 18 16 18 14 14 18 for his numbers, and trained in 8 skills (or for 3.5, skill ranks to max out 8 skills) then simply adjust those numbers for yourself....say...you're smart but not strong, tough and wiry but not very convincing to the rest of the group....14 STR, 18 DEX 18 CON 18 INT 16 WIS and 14 CHA, and then just pick skills or specializations that make sense to you.
Now, for the cutting you out of things: Step 1: consider getting your group to adopt an "everyone agrees" rule. This requires players to all come to terms with a course of action if its to be done. Even something like "i kill the helpless prisoner and i have super duper high initiative." Its everyone's time, everyone's game, and everyone's fun. That doesn't mean your CHARACTER has to agree, but you, as a player. If an action is something your character probably wouldn't want to do, but you could go along with it or reason sticking around, and the party wants to do that, then great, go with it. If, on the other hand, something is SO out there, SO utterly against your character's ideals that you cannot stay immersed in the game and your character knowing you've done it or allowed it to happen, then it gets veto'd until a workable solution for EVERYONE can be devised. Remember, its not just the DM's game. You're all playing.
Step 2: If step one doesn't work, isn't agreed to, or is violated.
leave.
many people probably will or have already suggested leaving the party out of game. Sadly, that is often not really a workable solution. I'm talking in game - if step 1 isn't agreed to, you probably will have to leave (OOG) or just deal with it, but if they violate step 1, you have a nice easy solution. "my character quits and leaves. I cannot continue playing this character, who would never EVER consider going along with what you've done." I know if it were me, i might be pissed off enough to just leave and ask them to reinvite me to the game when they start a new party, but you might consider making another character. It isn't ideal, but a new character can probably be built in such a way that you may be able to play a different TYPE of character and have fun.
Lastly, to discuss them ignoring you. Stop them mid-game. As soon as it happens, stop them and tell them that you're playing in the game to and you have as much right to play and enjoy it as they do. Continue repeating this at their face, not loudly and screaming, but in a controlled, stern voice for as long as it takes. If you are there to have fun, you have EVERY RIGHT to demand to have some input, and to have that input heard and considered. If your player will disapprove of what they are doing, but will still go along with it, then tell them that....be clear.
We have some players in our group (most of us, at some time or other while we've been playing) who will say something once, and if you didn't hear it, then too bad, i guess your character wasn't listening or something, because they refuse to repeat it.
Don't do this. Make sure, from this point forward, that what you say and do is heard and noticed. Tell them out of game that you WILL NOT be cut out of the group for any reason, unless all of the decide they want to take a vote and have you not play the game with them anymore. They committed to playing a D&D (or whatever system) game with YOU in it, and gosh darn it they're going to GET a D&D game with YOU in it, and not just some bag of healing spells that they can kick around!
