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Dungeons & Dra.. D&D Next General D.. Magic Systems... what kind would you like to see?
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1 year ago  ::  Jan 31, 2012 - 10:44AM #51
Grymlok-the-Great
Date Joined: Jan 31, 2012
Posts: 7

Jan 28, 2012 -- 11:16PM, Psyguard wrote:

Of all the Magic systems I've played with in D&D my all time favorite is the True Sorcery one from Green Ronin.

Spellcasters could do just about anything they could think of but not easily and not quickly.  Powerful spells could take many rounds to cast and would inflict non-lethal damage on you when you used them.  At low levels if you tried a large damaging spell you ran a very real risk of taking yourself out of action along with your target, assuming you made the skill check to successfully cast it in the first place.  I spent a lot of time unconscious before I really got a handle on the system.

But I loved the versatility of it. 

Of the different systems WoTC has come out with over the years my preferred one is the Spell Point system they had in the 3.5 Unearthed Arcana.

Monte Cook's World of Darkness   had a good magic system as well.  Very versatile spell point based system with some fatigue rules in it but
it would be far too over powered for a D&D game.  If it was toned down a bit it would be nice to have in 5E




Please, look at alternative spell casting systems. One that is far more open-ended. I like all these suggestions.

A wizard should be able to memorize spells without forgetting them, cast spells above level (at some great peril), create magic items easily, and learn new spells. Please make a system that CAN BE not so crunchy for the story-tellers GMs out there.

Spell points drained when spells are cast, would be great. Run out of spell points, a character can start using his HP to cast spells.

I would also like to see the basic D20 mechanic tied to spell casting. Why should a spell have the same ability to hit a target in nor armor than one in armor? Casting a lower level spell should be easier than casting above-level spells. etc. I never liked that a character coudl simply cast a spell and have its affect occur--even with some saving throws. There should be some difficulty to casting.

If there were a roll, and spell points, there would be all sorts of possibilities for magic items, the use of spell components, conjuring, etc. Add the compoennts, get a +1 to your roll. Have a +2 casting wand of L8 Fireball, your chances just got better of casting that above-level spell.



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1 year ago  ::  Jan 31, 2012 - 11:22AM #52
Steely_Dan
Date Joined: Mar 26, 2007
Posts: 8,628

Jan 30, 2012 -- 1:42PM, Garthanos wrote:


Deeper resources (Healing surges) really are the key to long term staying power.




I would say Healing Surges are more shallow, trite, and arbitrary; but that is neither here nor there.

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1 year ago  ::  Jan 31, 2012 - 1:40PM #53
Garthanos
Date Joined: Jan 15, 2009
Posts: 17,812
I personally think Mana Points requiring extra bookkeeping and additional rules for recovery and so on may not be worth the benefit beyond using tools like hit points. Adding an impairment or something  when somebody attempts to use there more extremes of power without taking extra time and/or when low on hitpoints or something similar could be sufficient "warning" for those who want to recommend cautious.

Improvisation in 4e: Improv. Attacks(by wrecan) - Fave 4E Improvisations

The Non-combatant Adventurer

Reality is unrealistic - and even monkeys protest unfairness

Dynamic Reflavoring : The Fighter : The Wizard : The Swordmage
Creative Character Collection - Featuring:The Faerie Master - Snow White - Joxer - Ironman - Elric - Bloodwright

By virtue of being a player your characters are the protagonists in a heroic fantasy game even at level one

"You have to explicitly give non-casters permission to do awesome, where as with magic it is just assumed they can." -Garthanos

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1 year ago  ::  Jan 31, 2012 - 1:46PM #54
Qmark
  • vitriol and virtue
Date Joined: May 18, 2002
Posts: 16,540

Jan 31, 2012 -- 1:40PM, Garthanos wrote:

I personally think Mana Points requiring extra bookkeeping and additional rules for recovery and so on...


Huh?
Manapoints should just be costs subtracted from a number.  "Boosting" mechanics shouldn't require differential calculus to figure out.

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1 year ago  ::  Jan 31, 2012 - 1:53PM #55
Garthanos
Date Joined: Jan 15, 2009
Posts: 17,812

Jan 31, 2012 -- 1:46PM, Qmark wrote:

Jan 31, 2012 -- 1:40PM, Garthanos wrote:

I personally think Mana Points requiring extra bookkeeping and additional rules for recovery and so on...


Huh?
Manapoints should just be costs subtracted from a number.  "Boosting" mechanics shouldn't require differential calculus to figure out.



Its not difficult its EXTRA, and recording the number of arrows, and which type my archer has is just another peice of bookkeeping...except I dont have another mechanic already in place that I can use.

It is another bit of bookkeeping... (they add up) if you already have a fatigue and recover system in place (and that resource is used for desparate use of magic ie hit point descriptions from AD&D era) I dont think I am getting a huge amount out of having mana points that maybe reflect having energy reserves beyond the normal fatigue.

Improvisation in 4e: Improv. Attacks(by wrecan) - Fave 4E Improvisations

The Non-combatant Adventurer

Reality is unrealistic - and even monkeys protest unfairness

Dynamic Reflavoring : The Fighter : The Wizard : The Swordmage
Creative Character Collection - Featuring:The Faerie Master - Snow White - Joxer - Ironman - Elric - Bloodwright

By virtue of being a player your characters are the protagonists in a heroic fantasy game even at level one

"You have to explicitly give non-casters permission to do awesome, where as with magic it is just assumed they can." -Garthanos

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1 year ago  ::  Jan 31, 2012 - 2:24PM #56
Grymlok-the-Great
Date Joined: Jan 31, 2012
Posts: 7

Jan 31, 2012 -- 1:40PM, Garthanos wrote:

I personally think Mana Points requiring extra bookkeeping and additional rules for recovery and so on may not be worth the benefit beyond using tools like hit points.




Wouldn't bother me at all. I think something like mana or spell points is no different than what spells you have memorized or used. However, a full system of mana would open up a lot of interesting situations and story arcs.

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1 year ago  ::  Jan 31, 2012 - 2:34PM #57
Mand12
Date Joined: Jun 17, 2010
Posts: 17,070

Jan 30, 2012 -- 11:21AM, Mand12 wrote:

the entire psionics system is in the d20 SRD.



Really, I'd suggest the mana point people read through this.  What do you like about it, what tweaks would you suggest, what do you dislike?

D&D Next = D&D:  Quantum Edition
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1 year ago  ::  Jan 31, 2012 - 2:40PM #58
ORC_Booker
Date Joined: Oct 4, 2011
Posts: 133
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1 year ago  ::  Jan 31, 2012 - 4:56PM #59
blake_marlowe
Date Joined: Jan 16, 2008
Posts: 201
i still maintain that healing surges--or their successor--as the limited resource permitting "augmenting" attacks is superior to any alternative proffered thus far.

i agree with garthanos that mana points and its various forms require more bookkeeping. and since in 4e, healing surges constitute "stamina" (don't believe me? try failing a skill challenge in my game), this to me is the most readily-accessible such resource.
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1 year ago  ::  Feb 01, 2012 - 1:30AM #60
Garthanos
Date Joined: Jan 15, 2009
Posts: 17,812

Jan 31, 2012 -- 5:48PM, Lord_Daxl wrote:


On top of that, if you ignore the potential of a combat spell and don't balance it for non-combat situations, eventually someone will use it in a non-combat situation.  This becomes especially problematic with encounter-based spells that they can use over and over.




Got an example I am currently picturing freezing over ponds or the opposite while somebody else is standing on them or swimming in them ... but attacking innanimate objects for some interesting effect is on my good stuff list.

but I also allow improvisational attacks like to heat the enemies weapons with a fire blast spell see my sig...
 

Improvisation in 4e: Improv. Attacks(by wrecan) - Fave 4E Improvisations

The Non-combatant Adventurer

Reality is unrealistic - and even monkeys protest unfairness

Dynamic Reflavoring : The Fighter : The Wizard : The Swordmage
Creative Character Collection - Featuring:The Faerie Master - Snow White - Joxer - Ironman - Elric - Bloodwright

By virtue of being a player your characters are the protagonists in a heroic fantasy game even at level one

"You have to explicitly give non-casters permission to do awesome, where as with magic it is just assumed they can." -Garthanos

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