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1 year ago ::
Jan 24, 2012 - 9:26PM
#1
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Date Joined:
Oct 11, 2007
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Stat ceilings (last seen in 2nd edition) used to be really rancid, because in 2nd edition you really only got bonuses at the high end of the stats. (For example, 16 STR was either +1 to hit, +1 damage, or maybe even just +1 damage. Even 18/50 was just +1/+3.)
However, with the flatter stat bonuses in 3.x and 4.0, would it make sense to have a stat ceiling? For example, halflings would have a stat ceiling of 16 on STR (at level 1), rather than a -2.
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1 year ago ::
Jan 24, 2012 - 9:30PM
#2
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Personally, I am a fan of not having any modifiers for stats regarding race. If you want to show that their culture has taught them to utilize a skill or weapon or whatever a bit better than others, that's great. But to say one race is smarter than another is a bit, well, racist. 
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1 year ago ::
Jan 24, 2012 - 9:53PM
#3
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Date Joined:
Sep 20, 2004
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I think I would prefer stat ceilings to stat modifiers. However, if that is the case, and the game gives out regular bonuses to stats the way 4e and SWSE do, stat ceilings will have to grow with level.
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1 year ago ::
Jan 24, 2012 - 10:05PM
#4
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My prefered system is stat penalties BEFORE point buy. So the difference between an orc with 18 strength and a halfling with 18 strength, is 4 build points.
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1 year ago ::
Jan 24, 2012 - 10:16PM
#5
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Date Joined:
Dec 25, 2009
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Personally, I am a fan of not having any modifiers for stats regarding race. If you want to show that their culture has taught them to utilize a skill or weapon or whatever a bit better than others, that's great. But to say one race is smarter than another is a bit, well, racist.
A cheetah is a faster runner than a human. Is this racist to say?
You're forgetting that we're not talking about different 'races' of human. We're talking about different species entirely, and different species will have different qualities.
The difference between madness and genius is determined only by degrees of success.
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1 year ago ::
Jan 24, 2012 - 10:54PM
#6
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I strongly prefere the ceilingless ability score. I like the freedom it gives when creating NPCs and to PCs.
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1 year ago ::
Jan 24, 2012 - 11:01PM
#7
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Stat ceilings in a 4e system are simply a way to ban that race from certain classes [and if you included later stat raises in this, you would completely ban that race-class combination. ]
Now a penalty does much the same thing, but it is an easier to understand system & the idea that the races vary by only two in a stat is rather silly.
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1 year ago ::
Jan 24, 2012 - 11:19PM
#8
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Stat ceilings in a 4e system are simply a way to ban that race from certain classes [and if you included later stat raises in this, you would completely ban that race-class combination. ]
Now a penalty does much the same thing, but it is an easier to understand system & the idea that the races vary by only two in a stat is rather silly.
Only if your players are min/maxing.
Warder
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1 year ago ::
Jan 24, 2012 - 11:38PM
#9
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Date Joined:
Jan 22, 2012
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If it's a choice between stat ceiling and stat penalty, I'll take the ceiling. A 16 stat is already reasonably expensive and an 18 is incredibly expensive, so not being able to get an 18 shouldn't be that awful a penalty.
What about stat bonuses, though? I don't like the way it's done now, making one combination of race/class better than another. A stat minimum makes no sense, though. Who wants a Con below 8 in the first place?
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1 year ago ::
Jan 24, 2012 - 11:58PM
#10
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Date Joined:
May 18, 2003
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Stat ceilings in a 4e system are simply a way to ban that race from certain classes [and if you included later stat raises in this, you would completely ban that race-class combination. ]
Now a penalty does much the same thing, but it is an easier to understand system & the idea that the races vary by only two in a stat is rather silly.
Only if your players are min/maxing.
Warder
not at all. The introduction of main-to-hit-stat which everyone tries to max out as well as possible has lead to this.
It is just not very funny to not be able to do your job just because you don't hit. This has nothing to do with min/maxing (which is: minimizing your flaws while maximizing your strength) but with "reasonable building".
Maybe an elf or an avenger (or anything that can reroll on a regular basis) can afford to not max out their main stat, but others simply can't. At least not as long as D&D keeps its linear stat progression. With a logarithmic one we could have a deal 
I don't need racial ability modifiers at all. Hand them out to the classes and make races affect NADs or skills or weapon proficiencies/boni.
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