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2 years ago ::
Dec 18, 2011 - 9:22PM
#1
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Date Joined:
Apr 27, 2006
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D&D OutsiderFears for Tiers: Come On, I'm Talking to Youby Jared von Hindman Important as they are to players, tiers, levels and experience points don't exist to their characters.Talk about this column here.
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2 years ago ::
Dec 19, 2011 - 2:51AM
#2
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Date Joined:
Oct 28, 2010
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A fine article, and a good reminder of the narrative inherent in the game. Something we often lose sight of a little.
Great work.
Now, if only my forum account didn't get kicked out when I read it.
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2 years ago ::
Dec 19, 2011 - 3:05AM
#3
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Date Joined:
May 13, 2009
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That's a really cool article! Thanks Jared 
Epic Dungeon Master Want to give your players a kingdom of their own? I made a 4e rule system to make it happen! Your Kingdom awaits!Update 5th Sep 2011: Added a sample kingdom, as well as sample of play.
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2 years ago ::
Dec 19, 2011 - 6:51AM
#4
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Date Joined:
Jan 15, 2009
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Agreed Great Article - probably result in itty bitty thread about it 
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2 years ago ::
Dec 19, 2011 - 8:47AM
#5
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Date Joined:
Aug 19, 2005
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Agreed Great Article
I disagree. I thought it was a dreadful article, rambling on, giving nothing but excellent food for thought and a fresh perspective on the "world" of D&D.
I mean, it could at least have included some gratuitous bit of ill-thought-out crunch for us to wail on, but, no! There it goes, just relentlessly opening up new vistas on what our characters and their friends and families might have to live through as part of their un-mundane existence. Pathetic.
There. Now maybe we'll get at thread... 
=======
Balesir
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2 years ago ::
Dec 19, 2011 - 10:07AM
#6
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Date Joined:
Oct 24, 2001
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Balesir: 
Here are the PHB essentia, in my opinion: - Three Basic Rules (p 11)
- Power Types and Usage (p 54)
- Skills (p178-179)
- Feats (p 192)
- Rest and Recovery (p 263)
- All of Chapter 9 [Combat] (p 264-295)
A player needs to read the sections for building his or her character -- race, class, powers, feats, equipment, etc. But those are PC-specific. The above list is for everyone, regardless of the race or class or build or concept they are playing.
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2 years ago ::
Dec 19, 2011 - 10:20AM
#7
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Agreed Great Article
I disagree. I thought it was a dreadful article, rambling on, giving nothing but excellent food for thought and a fresh perspective on the "world" of D&D.
I mean, it could at least have included some gratuitous bit of ill-thought-out crunch for us to wail on, but, no! There it goes, just relentlessly opening up new vistas on what our characters and their friends and families might have to live through as part of their un-mundane existence. Pathetic.
There. Now maybe we'll get at thread...
NO DUDE, you're a poopy-head troll! nyaaaaaaahhhhh! Jared is the man! 
Yeah, he touched on all the good points. I've often wondered what the alternative to PP's would be. The PRC idea wasn't really BETTER. It seems like there should be a way to go from narrative TO a mechanical choice, hmmmmm.
That is not dead which may eternal lie
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2 years ago ::
Dec 19, 2011 - 10:42AM
#8
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Date Joined:
Jan 15, 2009
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humor not lost me happy.
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2 years ago ::
Dec 19, 2011 - 10:56AM
#9
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Glad you guys are digging it. The Hate Love is hilarious.
@ AbdulAlhazred
Just blue skying it here, but an alternative to Paragon Paths/Prestige Paths?
You know how in Lair Assault you get glory points for doing specific things? Or in City of Heroes (shut up, you all play it I know you do) if you kill enough evil mutants you get a shiny but meaningless badge proclaiming as such?
If you want PP to have a narrative impact, you can't just slap it on without context...
So let's say each encounter (or session) has keywords attached to it. Undead, Dragon, Etc...but also Stealth, Betrayal, Sunder, Traps, Subterfuge, Matyr...whatever. I want to crib from the awesome game Freemarket here...because in that game you have "short term memories" that you can use xp to turn into "long term memories" which means that since all your "XP" is linked to the roleplaying and the encounters at the table, character progression is linked to that.
If that makes any sense.
If you held a gun to my head and said "find a middle ground between narrative and mechanical choice"...that's what I'd throw at you before Stockholm's kicked in. The Storyteller at the end of the session rewards you with keywords and the player chooses which apply to his experience & how he'd like to build up his character. Maybe certain players qualify for special ones, based on what they did at the table. Point is that then the shock of hitting Paragon or Epic would be a gradual thing and, even then, it'd link up to what's been going on in the campaign. Been fighting undead for 3 levels and you snagged those keywords? Congrats, you qualify for a divine/smite undead spin on your character class! Experiences (Keywords, here) turn into materia that you can slot into your weapons, armor, skills, etc to develop your character. (Or can now craft anti-zombie armor. I don't know.)
But I think I should stop rambling now.
The joys of brainstorming, right?
-Jared
"who totally isn't using the above keyword mechanic in his home game and didn't jump on an excuse to blather about it"
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2 years ago ::
Dec 19, 2011 - 11:06AM
#10
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If you want PP to have a narrative impact, you can't just slap it on without context...
On the other paw, not every PP really lends itself that well to getting it being an event. An archer Ranger going Battlefield Archer is just continuing to get better at archery, for example. The author also makes the mistake of assuming names mean something (just because your PP is 'guildmaster thief' doesn't mean you either belong to a guild, master it, or are a thief at all. The PP description even says "or maybe you grew up in the criminal world and know what’s what on the street and in a brawl").
Another day, another three or four entries to my Ignore List.
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