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1 year ago ::
Dec 03, 2011 - 3:25AM
#1
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Date Joined:
Sep 23, 2008
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In 3.5 (and all other D&D variants for that matter) every new book brought new monsters with it, mostly UNIQUE monsters and not 10.000 forms of dragonspawn and goblins...
But in the new 4E books I never find new unique monsters anymore...
The new Feywild book did already cut monsters out of its pages and a 4th monster manual is never made, in the new monstervault books there are only already-used monsters and in new books that do have monsters inside (such as the book of vile darkness) appear only clones of previous monsters, such as the never ending dragonspawns that really bore me...
What ever happend with originality? When there are new monsters released into the 4E world? And old classics such as Morkoth, Dao, Vegepygmy, Vargouille, Yellow Musk Creeper, Crysmal, Aurumvorax, Deepspawn and Leucrotta? And when some orginal silly monsters get re-worked into true classics such as Zorbo, Gravorg, Metalmaster/Swordslug and Disenchanters...
And when you are finally starting to create more orginal insect monsters such as Wasps and Mantis, instead of more of the same scorpions and spiders...
I really hope to see at least one more monster manual (fiend folio, monsters of Faerun or landscape-manual), and this time without more Goblins, Dragonspawn, Minotaurs, and other overused monsters, I actually wanna see some Will o Wisp and Lamia variants this time around, something that isn't overused like dragons, elementals and goblins...
Hope more people feel like this.
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1 year ago ::
Dec 03, 2011 - 4:41AM
#2
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Date Joined:
Jan 29, 2005
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In 3.5 (and all other D&D variants for that matter) every new book brought new monsters with it, mostly UNIQUE monsters and not 10.000 forms of dragonspawn and goblins...
But in the new 4E books I never find new unique monsters anymore...
The new Feywild book did already cut monsters out of its pages and a 4th monster manual is never made, in the new monstervault books there are only already-used monsters and in new books that do have monsters inside (such as the book of vile darkness) appear only clones of previous monsters, such as the never ending dragonspawns that really bore me...
What ever happend with originality? When there are new monsters released into the 4E world? And old classics such as Morkoth, Dao, Vegepygmy, Vargouille, Yellow Musk Creeper, Crysmal, Aurumvorax, Deepspawn and Leucrotta? And when some orginal silly monsters get re-worked into true classics such as Zorbo, Gravorg, Metalmaster/Swordslug and Disenchanters...
And when you are finally starting to create more orginal insect monsters such as Wasps and Mantis, instead of more of the same scorpions and spiders...
I really hope to see at least one more monster manual (fiend folio, monsters of Faerun or landscape-manual), and this time without more Goblins, Dragonspawn, Minotaurs, and other overused monsters, I actually wanna see some Will o Wisp and Lamia variants this time around, something that isn't overused like dragons, elementals and goblins...
Hope more people feel like this.
There is a 4e MM... 3 of them, actually. there's also the Dark Sun creature catalog. This all came before the Monster Vault. All the MV did was take some older monsters and update them to the new format that the MM3 and DS book use.
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1 year ago ::
Dec 03, 2011 - 5:12AM
#3
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Date Joined:
Aug 31, 2008
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But in the new 4E books I never find new unique monsters anymore...
Open up the Neverwinter Campaign Guide to Chapter 3. Here is a brief list:
Lord Dagult Neverember
Soman Galt, Mayor of Neverwinter
Aboleth Opener
Aboleth Remnant
Grell Strengler
Nothic Plaguegazer
Nothic Mindwarp
Plaguechanged monster theme (with 7 example powers to add to your monsters)
The Prophet Rohini
Chartilifax, Corrupted Green Dragon
Mordai Vell, Patriarch of Asmodeus
Favria, Dwarf Assassin
Branded Zealot
Hellfire Warlock
Fimbrul Devil
Seared Devil
Valindra Shadowmantle, the Hand of Szass Tam
Unhallowed Wight
Ash Zombie power
Clariburnus Tanthul, Prince of Shade
Shades theme
Thaalud Constructor
Wererat Mugger
Wererat template
Vansi, Spellscarered Orc Commander
Drow Swashbuckler
Drow Informant
Ethraniev Marrowslake
Werewolf Stormcaller
Werewolf template
Addemios Three-Dawn
Dire Corby
Plaguechanged Mind Flayer
Plaguechanged Elder Brain
Kholzourl the Fire-Speaker
Steeder
Drow Spellspinner
Salamander Spearwarden
Salamander Sparker
And each one comes with a full fluff writeup within a section detailing the group's goals, potential encounters, motivations, etc. Not a single goblin, minotaur, or dragonspawn.
I know it doesn't include the ones you seem to want (will o wisp or lamia variants), but it does have a ton of new and unique monsters (as well as a plethora of great campaign nuggets) for you to use in your campaign.
Keep in mind that this is just one book. There are tons more, not just the monster manuals.
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1 year ago ::
Dec 03, 2011 - 7:27AM
#4
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Heroes of the Feywild is a player book. Why would there be monsters there?
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1 year ago ::
Dec 03, 2011 - 9:11AM
#5
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Date Joined:
Oct 19, 2008
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Besides the Dark Sun Creature Catalog and the 3 MMs and The Neverwinter Campaign Guide:
There are 2 MVs, one I thought had the Vargouile in it.
There are 2 Draconomicons, though you did express a disinterest in dragons.
There's a Demonomicon.
The Underdark, Plane Above, Plane Below and Manula of the Planes books all had monsters.
Open Grave, undead galore.
And I think the Ebberon and Forgotten Realms Campaign Guides had monsters too.
Not so sure what other newer things had monsters, as I haven't bought anything newer than Dark Sun.
And I don't actually know what any of those monsters are, either . . .
Perhaps writing an article updating them, provided they all fit a theme together, and then sending it in for review and publication?
"I don't know the key to success, but the key to failure is trying to please everybody." --Bill Cosby (1937- )Vanador: OK. You ripped a gateway to Hell, killed half the town, and raised the dead as feral zombies. We're going to kill you. But it can go two ways. We want you to run as fast as you possibly can toward the south of the town to draw the Zombies to you, and right before they catch you, I'll put an arrow through your head to end it instantly. If you don't agree to do this, we'll tie you this building and let the Zombies rip you apart slowly. Dimitry: God I love being Neutral. 4th edition is dead, long live 4th edition.Salla: opinionated, but commonly right. fun quotes
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1 year ago ::
Dec 03, 2011 - 9:46AM
#6
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Date Joined:
Oct 11, 2010
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most published adventures tend to have some monsters in them as well. maybe not 'new' new monsters, but they're different. and there's a monster builder where you can make or modify anything you want.
Wizards of the Coast can suck it.
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1 year ago ::
Dec 03, 2011 - 11:46AM
#7
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Date Joined:
Jun 24, 2009
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The OP does have a point, though, at least IMHO. One of the great strengths of DnD through the years has been the great range of monsters, from Fiend Folio at least onwards. Yet if you look at the published adventures in 4e, you will see the same monsters popping up again and again and again: how many Kobolds, Ettercaps and Dark Creepers have you fought? I've always been a bit mystified by this. I don't understand why they keep reusing already overused monsters when there is a vast range of underused ones.
"What is the sort of thing that I do care about is a failure to seriously evaluate what does and doesn't work in favor of a sort of cargo cult posturing. And yes, it's painful to read design notes columns that are all just "So D&D 3.5 sort of had these problems. We know people have some issues with them. What a puzzler! But we think we have a solution in the form of X", where X is sort of a half-baked version of an idea that 4e executed perfectly well and which worked fine." - Lesp
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"When I DM Next I feel that I might as well be running a game based off of notes scribbled on a paper napkin." -Reinhart
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1 year ago ::
Dec 03, 2011 - 2:49PM
#8
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There are 41 different Kobolds, over 50 goblins, 18 bugbears...
4e was definitely lacking when it came to creativity for powers and monsters.
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1 year ago ::
Dec 03, 2011 - 3:37PM
#9
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I see 4754 monster entries in the Compendium. Yes, that covers all variations of GENERAL monster types, but it is a bit deceptive Cassan to say that this is different from say 2e, where there were litterally dozens of types of 'goblin'. The only difference was they didn't bother to tell you they were all goblins, you had to dig through them all to find that out. So there were goblins, nilbogs, norkers, xvarts, barghests, redcaps, boggles, etc etc etc. Many of those are now subsumed under goblin and others are still separate entries, but they all AFAIK (except nilbogs) exist in 4e.
In fact you'll have a fairly hard time finding monsters that don't exist in 4e. There are for instance several 'wisp' type monsters. There are quite a few plant monsters as well (74 in the Compendium with the 'plant' keyword). 5-6 of those are treants, but there are a LOT of other types, including woads, dryads, mosslings, myconids, arboreans, and battlebriars, as well as a lot of other one-of-a-kind types like the old hangman tree.
Really, 4e has published as many monsters and as wide a variety of monsters as any other edition from what I can see. We have FIVE monster books, with some moderate overlap between MV and MM1/2/3, but as others have pointed out there are LARGE numbers of monsters in other DM-side books, including all 4 settings and around 10 other books. Some of those, like Demonomicon, contain a LOT of monsters.
I'm just not seeing any dearth of monsters and it is close to impossible not to have available something that fits the bill for almost any purpose unless you're running epic encounters currently.
That is not dead which may eternal lie
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1 year ago ::
Dec 03, 2011 - 3:44PM
#10
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Date Joined:
Sep 19, 2007
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Yeah, I have to wonder what, beyond some of the really silly early montsers like Flumphs (which i think have 4e rules thanks to an april fools dungeon) are really missing from 4e?
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