Moving D&D General to the bottom of the list is an interesting notion, but IMO it falls into the category of things that solve a one-time problem by creating a recurring one. It helps people the first few times they come to the forum … but then it annoys everyone, every time they come back, by making them scroll to the bottom of the list to find the thing they want. Every time. Bottom of the list. Every time.
The counter to this is that most of us to whom this might apply are already going all over the Boards anyway.
Additionally, the request is not "Bottom of the list". The request is "Bottom of D&D Community" (or anywhere in that group other than "Top of D&D Community"). I think a case could be made for it being above "Off Topic Tavern", but I have no horse in that race.
Here are the PHB essentia, in my opinion:
Three Basic Rules (p 11)
Power Types and Usage (p 54)
Skills (p178-179)
Feats (p 192)
Rest and Recovery (p 263)
All of Chapter 9 [Combat] (p 264-295)
A player needs to read the sections for building his or her character -- race, class, powers, feats, equipment, etc. But those are PC-specific. The above list is for everyone, regardless of the race or class or build or concept they are playing.
A quick count moments ago showed 18 d20 threads that have seen activity in the last week. If all of them were combined into a single forum, they'd all appear on page 1 with room left over for threads that have been inactive for a week or more.
That's the sort of metric that we're looking at when considering consolidation. When looked at that way, I see pulling all the d20 forums together as a plus, because fans could follow all of the activity by checking a single forum instead of clicking through three different ones. If enough new threads are created to keep pushing active threads off page 1, then multiple forums are called for.
Steve
I would oppose this. d20 Modern is a setting as much as a system, and should be included - if anywhere - in the Vintage Worlds system. They're already the red-headed stepchild (politely) of Wizards, and giving them the shaft by mixing their discussion in with CO (and diluting the CO discussion in the process) just flips the bird at everyone involved.
I can see Character Development (if it's that inactive) being rolled in somewhere, but in Optimization? What made that forum worth using was the very high Signal:Noise ratio. You look at nearly any page and I can wager that a minimum of five threads will be handbooks or threads discussing important builds or tactics. Rolling in Character Development there is an illogical place for it, and will FURTHER decrease the S/N ratio. (The reason most of the community left during the earlier fiasco was when most of our work from there was deleted. I know that's not going to happen this time... but deleting threads is essentially the same idea as decreasing the useful signal.)
Having all the active threads in one place is a useful goal. Having all of them in a logical place is stated to be the other useful goal. If no one is active in Character Development - which, by the way, is system-independent and therefore as applicable to 4e as to earlier editions - it could literally be rolled in with Dark Sun (say) and have the same effect on the first goal, but wouldn't solve the second.
These are NOT all my creations! The lead authors are identified as follows: [TS] Tempest Stormwind, [AR] Andarious Rosethorn, [RT] Radical Taoist, [SN] Sionnis, [DH] DisposableHero_, [SH] Seishi.
[TS] The Pinball Brothers: Large And In Charge (Melee, Lockdown, Charge, Juggling) [TS] Ashardalon Reborn: I Will Swallow Your Soul (Melee, Fear, Negative Levels, AoE, Theme) [AR] "A"-Game Paladin: Play That Funky Music, Knight Boy! (Team Support, Melee, Theme, Single-Class) [RT] Uncanny Trapsmith: Get in, make it look like an accident, get out. (Skillmonkey, Stealth/Scout/Infiltration, Unorthodox Methods, Theme) [AR] Wizsassin: *Everything* is permitted. (Spellcaster, Support, Sneak Attack, Utility) [TS] Phantom Rush: General Gish Gouda. (Gish, Theme, Setting-Specific(Eberron), Early-Entry PrC) [TS] Storm Knight: Another kind of gish. (Melee/"Gish", Theme, Setting-Specific(Eberron), Unorthodox Methods) [TS] Inevitable Nightmare: The weapon you only have to fire once. (Melee, "Unorthodox" Methods (no charging), Reliability) [AR] Captain Constitution: The number one threat to America. (Melee, TOUGHTOUGHTOUGH, Defense, Theme) [AR] Nuker: I casts the spells that makes the peoples fall down! (Spellcaster, damage, blasting, damage) [TS] Dread Lord of the Dead: Let the Reaping Begin! (NPC-only, Variable (combat/casting/leadership), Iconic Villain, Theme) [AR] Heavy Crusader: No Rest. No Mercy. No Matter What. (Melee, Damage (No charging), Variable, Theme). [TS] Gun Fu: It's bullet time (Ranged, THEORETICAL, Twin weapons, Theme) [RT] Face First: We should talk. (Psionic, social, mind-control, info-management) [SN] Chaingun Porcupine: Never Enuff Dakka. (Ranged, Skirmishing, Spike Damage, Incarnum) [RT] Always On Edge: The Mortal Draw deals death. (Melee, Generalist, Dungeoneering, Stunt) [AR] Feral Druid: Real feral taste. Zero druid calories. (Melee, offense, damage, murder) [RT] Rusty!: Man's Best Friend (Sentry, Support, Backup, Rearguard) [RT] The T3 (Tashalatora Triple Threat): My Kung Fu is More Powerful (Hybrid, Flex-Function, Melee, Caster) [RT] The #1 Snoipah: Boom. 'Eadshot. (Caster, Theme, Spike, Trapscout) [AR] Dreamblade: Rest in Pieces. (Melee, Damage, Single-Class, Combo/Momentum) [AR] Evasion Tank: “When fighting angry blind men, is best to stay out of the way.” (Melee, Tank, Unorthodox Methods (attack negation), Theme) [DH] Psycarnum Warrior: ↑↑↓↓←→←→BA Start (Melee, Tank, Psionics, Incarnum, 1337 h4x) [AR] Heavy Weapons Elf: WHO TOUCHED MY BOW? (Ranged, Cohort, Damage, Unorthodox Methods (ranged ToB)) [RT] Gnowhere Gnome: A little man who wasn't there (Caster, Stealth, Single-Class, Elusive) [AR] Uberflank: I got your back. (Melee, support, stunt, teamwork) [TS] Flip the Bird: Everyday I'm shuffling (Ranged, harrier, unorthodox methods (ranged ToB / off-turn movement), support) [DH] Eat Sleep Gank: Real Ultimate Power (Stealth, Assassination, Spike, Magic Versatility) [AR] Slash and Burn: Mind, Body, Blade, Flame / Aspects of a greater whole / which delivers death. (Melee, Theme (flex-style), Damage, Stunt) [RT] Edge of the Light: Cut, Fade to Black (Melee, Defense/Offense, Momentum, Tactical) [RT] Quiet Murder: Cut throats, not corners. (Melee, Stealth, Harrier, Tactical) [TS] Wand Overdrive: Say Hello to my little friends. (Caster, support/artillery/variable, wand specialist) [RT] God Hand: What did the five fingers say to the face? (Melee/Gish, Unarmed, SAD, Theme) [AR] Zero Buff Time Gish: Try to keep up! (Gish, Speed, Movement, Opportunity) [TS] Robo Tackle: I Am Iron Man. (Melee, setting-specific (Eberron), positioning, theme, stunt)
A quick count moments ago showed 18 d20 threads that have seen activity in the last week. If all of them were combined into a single forum, they'd all appear on page 1 with room left over for threads that have been inactive for a week or more.
That's the sort of metric that we're looking at when considering consolidation. When looked at that way, I see pulling all the d20 forums together as a plus, because fans could follow all of the activity by checking a single forum instead of clicking through three different ones. If enough new threads are created to keep pushing active threads off page 1, then multiple forums are called for.
Steve
I would oppose this. d20 Modern is a setting as much as a system, and should be included - if anywhere - in the Vintage Worlds system. They're already the red-headed stepchild (politely) of Wizards, and giving them the shaft by mixing their discussion in with CO (and diluting the CO discussion in the process) just flips the bird at everyone involved.
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It hsould be also noted that the SW players still have ALL of thire forums,despite ANOTHER company holding the rights to make a minitures game and an RPG....so i don't see why the D20 modern Forum can't stick aorund in it's current forum even if it's rolled under the catagory of vintage
[QUOTE=ThorvaldHafgrimsson]Life is full of choices. Sometimes you make the good ones, and sometimes you have to kill all the witnesses.[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=NastasiaLorn;] But then you have to pay the liability insurance.[/QUOTE] A note about character and world creation Spoiler:Show
Character and world creation are a form of expression. The point is that some people don't have much to say...
I would oppose this. d20 Modern is a setting as much as a system, and should be included - if anywhere - in the Vintage Worlds system.
This is a valid and interesting point, and we'll reexamine the situation from that perspective. Doesn't mean we'll change our minds, but we'll take a second look under that light.
Steve
If your only tool is a warhammer, every problem looks like a gnoll.
Also, WotC_Michelle is looking into the feasibility of mirroring certain group forums in the main forums (seems to me someone suggested that earlier in this thread, but I don't have the time to page backward and offer due props; take a bow, whoever you are). That would mean, for example, that the CoCo forums could appear both in the CoCo group and under a "Mirrored Group Forums" heading in these main D&D forums. Posts made in either area would show up in both. This would make public groups far more visible to the community at large, probably boost membership, and (I think) make life a bit easier by cutting down the amount of clicking involved if you want to read public threads and group threads. I won't guarantee anything, but as of my last conversation with Michelle, the tech looks promising.
That's good news. I just want to underscore that someone should talk to the Living Forgotten Realms admins (who receive some payment from WotC for running the campaign) as to what is best regarding the old forum threads vs. their new Group forum threads.
Of the two approaches to hobby games today, one is best defined as the realism-simulation school and the other as the game school. AD&D is assuredly an adherent of the latter school. It does not stress any realism (in the author's opinon an absurd effort at best considering the topic!).
It does little to attempt to simulate anything either. (AD&D) is first and foremost a game for the fun and enjoyment of those who seek the use of imagination and creativity....
In all cases, however, the reader should understand that AD&D is designed to be an amusing and diverting pastime, something which an fill a few hours or consume endless days, as the participants desire, but in no case something to be taken too seriously.
For fun, excitement and captivating fantasy, AD&D is unsurpassed.As a realistic simulation of things from the realm of make-believe or even as a reflection of midieval or ancient warfare or culture or society, it can be deemed only a dismal failure. Readers who seek the later must search elsewhere. - Gary Gygax. 1e DMG.
I've always wondered if an oversimplified version would ever work.
Board Business D&D Rules For Players For DMs Upcoming Releases D&D General
Nope. Rules sets are too different, plus you'd just be asking for Edition Wars.
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We'd like to avoid sub-forums as much as possible, which to me means entirely. If a topic draws enough traffic to merit a forum, then it deserves a place in the main lineup. Sub-forums just add confusion to the "where should I post" question.
Steve
I can get behind that as a motivation, but I remind you of Albert Einstein: Make everything as simple as possible, but no simpler.
For instance, under this system, the d20 Character Optimization forum (a place of pure mechanical help aimed primarily at D&D 3.5) would be merged with the Character Development forum (pure story), the d20 Modern forum (story and lore of a completely different system, which never gets enough support on its own and shoehorning it in here will just sweep it under the rug), and the RPG General board (which is pure off-topic compared to the other three, and has served as a dumping ground for 4e-comparison threads by the community supervisors' own admission). These have nothing to do with each other and will only make finding key threads harder - which is of particular concern on the CO boards, especially after the d20 fiasco a few years ago and forum pruning resorted in losing (and I sincerely wish I were joking here) lifetimes of man-hours of work on the system. (At one point, that board in particular was considered valuable by WotC - several of us were actually recruited by Wizards to give 4e its first stab at true optimization, strictly because we loved the game and were good at spotting mechanical synergies. We couldn't have done that if we didn't have a good resource for this, and one of the hallmarks of that was the high signal:noise ratio on the CO boards.)
I also have a semi-related question: What will happen to sticky threads in subforums that are merged? In the Previous Editions forums (which will become Vintage Rules Discussion, I believe), for instance, you find a number of very useful sticky threads... but they're most useful for the subforum in question.
+1
Hush kitty avatar ... there'll be more Younglings soon.
It's been mentioned, and I agree, that the description for the Future Releases forum (or whatever it's called) should be amended to make clear that the forum is only for speculation about the current edition.
It's been mentioned, and I agree, that the description for the Future Releases forum (or whatever it's called) should be amended to make clear that the forum is only for speculation about [new titles for] the current edition.
but not in that smarmy way it is most frequently used.
Here are the PHB essentia, in my opinion:
Three Basic Rules (p 11)
Power Types and Usage (p 54)
Skills (p178-179)
Feats (p 192)
Rest and Recovery (p 263)
All of Chapter 9 [Combat] (p 264-295)
A player needs to read the sections for building his or her character -- race, class, powers, feats, equipment, etc. But those are PC-specific. The above list is for everyone, regardless of the race or class or build or concept they are playing.
but not in that smarmy way it is most frequently used.