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2 years ago  ::  Sep 14, 2011 - 12:15PM #1
Surrealistik
Date Joined: Jul 17, 2010
Posts: 639
"Unlimmmiitttteeedd Powwwaaahhhhh!" Darth Sidious, a Cheesewizard

"Do not ask which creature screams in the night. Do not question who waits for you in the shadow. It is my cry that wakes you in the night, and my body that crouches in the shadow. I am Tzeentch Cheesewizard and you are the puppet that dances to my tune..."




The Cheesewizard goes first either with raw Initiative (+36, +37 Mage version, and Danger Sense reroll) or Strategist's Epiphany, uses Archspell + Prismatic Spray + Asmodeus' Royal Command + Talisman of Terror + Skull Mask + Spider Familiar + Spell Focus + Mind Fire + Persistent Poison + Hellbook to use the Prismatic Spray daily as an encounter power twice per encounter with an effect long -12 penalty to saving throws to dominate/ravage everything in a close burst 5 (6 with Enlarge Spell). Cunning Staff applies a recurring -4 penalty to the first saving throw, all but guaranteeing, even against a solo, that the first save will fail. If employing an Orb of Mental Dominion, you will effectively dominate everyone in the encounter for its entire duration, solos included. In otherwords, old school 3.5 style wizard rape.



Supplementary Tricks/Elements/Qualities:

You can also draw and spam Orb of Karmic Resonance dailies as a free action (thanks Battle Harness) to use on particularly troublesome and resistant creatures/solos as needed. Orb of Mental Dominion can likewise help to nullify the higher saves of Solos, allowing for effectively indefinite domination on a hit (requiring ~17 saves before a successful one).

In the meanwhile it continues to dominate stuff with Steal Time and other encounter powers. Steal Time can also allow it to store up an Standard Actions indefinitely each time it hits. This is because the 'stun' effect never ends (the expiry point before which the Standard Action must be used) as it never exists in the first place because the stunned effect is substituted with dominated via Royal Command of Asmodeus.

Against enemies that just can't be dominated or that have lame domination auto-ending effects, it has Face of Death (or Visions of Ruin), which is also an illusion power, thus gaining an additional effect long -2 penalty via Illusionist's Gloves for a total of -12 with a -16 penalty to the first roll, rendering most mobs immobilized and helpless for the rest of the encounter.

Curse Eye Tattoo can be employed to impose an additional -2 (save ends) penalty.

Should have only a 5% chance to miss vs Will on average with a reliable attack bonus of +44 (+45 Mage version): Base +36, +1 power bonus (Serpent's Cunning), +2 CA (obtained reliably via Phase-Mist Shroud and Nethermancy Master), +1 Phase-Mist Shroud (which it can reliably get via Psionic Image), +1 Coordinated Explosion, +2 Arch Spell, +1 Ring of Sorrows, +1 Hellfire Blood (Mage version only). In the unlikely event of a miss or nat 1, use Mark of Six Fingers/Dice of Auspicous Fortune (used preemptively)/Insightful Riposte/Adept's Insight, etc... to turn that frown upside down.

The Mage version is either impervious to surprise via Alertness or gets +1 to hit via Hellfire Blood.

Salves of Power are used to regain use of Prismatic Spray, as well as the Opal Ring of Remembrance.

Against immune enemies it uses Wizard's Wrath to automatically take away their immunities; there is no resisting the Dominator. Multiclass Poisoner deals with those otherwise annoying poison immune mobs. The Mage variant ignores fire resistance to Prismatic's ongoing and fire damage.

With Improved Tome of Readiness cheese it uses the almighty Illusory Wall as an encounter power (Wizard only).

Hellbook allows the Cheesewizard to use Prismatic Spray an additional time per encounter as it swaps out a prepared spell for another use of Prismatic Spray (which isn't preparing).

Versatile Spellbook makes sure the Cheesewizard always has whatever utility power he needs.

Orb of Nimble Thoughts + Staff of the Traveller + Battle Harness gives us 5 quickswitch Teleport 9s per short rest.

Utility Staff +3 on a quickswitch can increase the range of our encounter powers by +3.

Several Staves of the War Mage +1 can be quickswitched to increase the Prismatic Spray burst to size 7.

Finally, while an enemy is subject to Prismatic Spray, the Cheesewizard can force the target to run its speed + 2 around his Storm Pillar, for 100 automatic lightning damage if the target is slowed, or 200 if the target has base speed 6, provoking OAs in addition to the ongoing 15 fire damage. If the target is slowed and has a teleport speed, you can have the target run-teleport as high as possible regardless of slow status, falling through the Storm Pillar's squares to take 75 automatic lightning damage plus fall damage.



Other Cheese Series Characters:



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2 years ago  ::  Sep 14, 2011 - 1:26PM #2
curiousdragon
Date Joined: Jan 7, 2010
Posts: 1,154
"Immune: Poison" will wreck your day.
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2 years ago  ::  Sep 14, 2011 - 1:28PM #3
Surrealistik
Date Joined: Jul 17, 2010
Posts: 639

Sep 14, 2011 -- 1:26PM, curiousdragon wrote:

"Immune: Poison" will wreck your day.




Nah, Wizard's Wrath; it removes all immunities. I understand that Immune: Fear isn't the only thing I have to worry about.

If there are too many to Wrath, I've always got Illusory Wall and my single target encounter dominations. 

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2 years ago  ::  Sep 14, 2011 - 2:08PM #4
monkeygentleman
Date Joined: Feb 22, 2011
Posts: 1,391
Gah! I've been trying to figure out how to stack save penalties for encounter long daze for a week now! And you've done it with dominate, on multiple enemies!

Bravo to you sir, but damn you for being cleverer than I am.
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2 years ago  ::  Sep 14, 2011 - 2:36PM #5
Surrealistik
Date Joined: Jul 17, 2010
Posts: 639
Thankee good sir.

Also, revising the build to take the Poisoner multiclass so that pesky mobs with poison immunity get ****ed.
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2 years ago  ::  Sep 14, 2011 - 3:09PM #6
Surrealistik
Date Joined: Jul 17, 2010
Posts: 639
Added Persistent Poison so now creatures are at a effect long -12 penalty to save against the poison immunity ignoring Prismatic Spray.
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2 years ago  ::  Sep 14, 2011 - 6:30PM #7
RayjeEliwan
Date Joined: Mar 4, 2010
Posts: 600
OK, where's the cheese coming in? Obviously, this is a highly optimized wizard who's very adept at stacking save penalties, but is that what makes it cheesy? What makes this better or worse (depending on your point of view) than a normal save-penalizer at epic tier?

Perhaps it's just that I'm bad at reading epic statblocks/sheets and really grasping all the nuances, but what pushes this over the top?
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2 years ago  ::  Sep 14, 2011 - 6:57PM #8
Surrealistik
Date Joined: Jul 17, 2010
Posts: 639

Sep 14, 2011 -- 6:30PM, RayjeEliwan wrote:

OK, where's the cheese coming in? Obviously, this is a highly optimized wizard who's very adept at stacking save penalties, but is that what makes it cheesy? What makes this better or worse (depending on your point of view) than a normal save-penalizer at epic tier?

Perhaps it's just that I'm bad at reading epic statblocks/sheets and really grasping all the nuances, but what pushes this over the top?




The fact that, even as optimized L30 builds go, it's game breaking. It always goes first (+35 init with reroll or Strategist's Epiphany against especially high Init mobs), and it almost always hits (thanks to a 95% base hit chance, to say nothing of one time boosters like Emerald Eye), and when it doesn't due to Nat 1s or low rolls vs high Will opponents, it has Dice of Auspicious Fortune and Adept's Insight. It has at least two uses per encounter of a daily that will singlehandedly shut down pretty much every combat in the game, dominating everything in the encounter for its entire duration (due to -16 initial save, and -12 recurring saves, and Karmic Orbs). There is no immunity to it either thanks to Poisoner and Wizard's Wrath. 

The 'cheese' part specifically has to do with collective abuse of Tiefling racial support, Archspell's Daily as Encounter mechanics, and keyword specific save penalizers.

These are all things even an optimized L30 imposer/save penalizer cannot normally do.

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2 years ago  ::  Sep 14, 2011 - 7:16PM #9
Zathris
Date Joined: Nov 6, 2009
Posts: 4,216
Small nitpick thing: You can't ToR Strategist's Epiphany for multiple reasons.  It's not in your spellbook, for one.
"Invokers are probably better round after round but Wizard dailies are devastating.  Actually, devastating is too light a word.  Wizard daily powers are soul crushing, encounter ending, havoc causing pieces of awesome." -AirPower25
Sear the Flesh, Purify the Soul;
Harden the Heart, and Improve the Mind;
Born of Blood, but Forged by Fire;
The MECH warrior reaches perfection.

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2 years ago  ::  Sep 14, 2011 - 7:23PM #10
Surrealistik
Date Joined: Jul 17, 2010
Posts: 639

Sep 14, 2011 -- 7:16PM, Zathris wrote:

Small nitpick thing: You can't ToR Strategist's Epiphany for multiple reasons.  It's not in your spellbook, for one.




Yeah, that's one of the RAW things I wasn't sure on (the other being which of Hellbook or Reserve Maneuver would give me an additional use of Prismatic Spray; my money is on Reserve Maneuver); I dropped Superior Will and Dispater's for Imperious Majesty and Danger Sense; if the monster never gets a chance to act, which it should not, they're not necessary.

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