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Switch to Forum Live View I rolled pretty bad stats - how can I optimize a Primal type character?
2 years ago  ::  Aug 30, 2011 - 4:36PM #1
FarmerGiles
Date Joined: Oct 13, 2007
Posts: 240
Hi

4th Edition game starting at Level 3.
Annoyingly the DM made us roll 4D6 and choose lowest. Now my friends are
incredibly lucky and have rolled +6 to +8 characters with maybe one negative
stat at -1 involved. Whereas I am always unlucky and have only rolled a piffly
+5 character, and I have no high stat and a really crap stat.

14 , 14 ,
14 , 12 , 10 , 6

Honestly how can that turn into a decent Primal
character? It looks likely that I'm going to play something from the Primal
Power book. Most likely a Barbarian or Shaman depending on what my mates choose
but I haven't ruled out Druid.

Now I know it's only Level 3, but out of
those Primal classes I mentioned, going for most likely a Striker or Leader role
is there any way I can optimize my character given those poor stats? Everyone
else is heading out with multiple +'s and 18's and I can at best get a 16.
:-(

In terms of other characters, one guy is definitely being a
Dragonborn Pit Fighter, the other is likely to be a Wizard, and the third hasn't
decided but he at first went with Cleric, but I think suddenly the Avenger has
caught his attention. If he goes Cleric, chances are I'll end up as Barbarian
for high damage striking, but if he goes Avenger then a leader shaman for
healing/buffing would be nice.


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2 years ago  ::  Aug 30, 2011 - 4:49PM #2
Jay_Ibero_911
Date Joined: Feb 26, 2006
Posts: 5,234
Well first of all, and this can't be stressed enough, BEG your DM to just use the standard point buy/array. 4th edition is very carefully balanced around characters having ability scores in those ranges.

If you are absolutely stuck with those stats, then you have two options: Play something that doesn't make attack rolls itself (Lazy shaman or lazy warlord), or stack up as many other attack bonuses as you can, or don't expect to hit ever.

To do the latter, you will need a race that boosts your primary stat, a class that has a weapon talent or other attack bonus, high proficiency weapon or accurate implement, expertise feat ASAP, and highest enhancement bonus you can get your hands on, plus any other stackable bonuses.

For instance, a human thief getting his dex bonus, with a background for rapier proficiency, light blade expertise, nimble blade, backstabber (bonus feat) and a +1 rapier, along with Ambush+Tactical tricks, you will almost always have CA and so be swinging at:

3 dex +3 proficiency +2 CA +1 expertise +1 Nimble Blade +1 enhancement +1 weapon talent, for +12 vs. AC, so still better than even accuracy.

And 1d8 +2d8 SA +3 dex +2 finesse +1 enhancement +1 expertise=3d8+7

With those stats, forget Barbarian. You won't hit enough to be meaningful. The above thief will throw boatloads more damage out at-will.

Now you could make a reasonable Eagle Shaman and just load up on powers that give attacks to allies and try to never make an attack yourself.
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2 years ago  ::  Aug 30, 2011 - 5:11PM #3
FarmerGiles
Date Joined: Oct 13, 2007
Posts: 240
No chance with the begging, I'm stuck with those crap stats. The only potential highlight is that the others have the mentality that we shouldn't get too attached to these characters, as they are both new to the system and we're playtesting Fantasy Grounds online. So maybe if I'm lucky, there will be a great opportunity for me to get killed doing something heroic! :P


Such a shame Barbarian is out, that was looking like a fun class. I hate how unlucky I always am. The Eagle shaman is best with ranged allies though, and from what I'm expecting the only ranged ally I'll have is a Wizard. Would the Bear one work well, after all it seems like we'll have next to no extra healing among the party.


Really would prefer to stick to a Primal class, but if I REALLY had to think again, does any class work well with crap stats like mine?  
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2 years ago  ::  Aug 30, 2011 - 5:14PM #4
erachima
Date Joined: Sep 4, 2010
Posts: 7,634
There is no excuse for the use of rolled stats in 4e. Getting a playable array for ANY class is as rare as rolling a legal paladin back in the day. You can honestly have a character whose total mods are illegally high (+2s in everything) and still be pathetic at every single class in the game. If you tell your players to roll stats in 4e, you are flat-out instructing them to cheat or lose, and you might as well just let them make up stats instead.

If you must use rolled stats, adapt the system Gamma World uses: roll two dice to find out what your two high stats are (1 = STR, 2 = CON, etc., you get a pre-racial 16 in that, if you roll the same thing twice you get a pre-racial 18 instead), and then 3d6 the other, largely irrelevant ones.

Long story short, I suggest character suicide. Alternatively, you could be a Fighter and sort of work: put your 14s in STR, DEX, WIS, pick a race that boosts strength, use a +3 weapon, and your in-class accuracy bonuses will make you semi-viable regardless.
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2 years ago  ::  Aug 30, 2011 - 5:15PM #5
Mand12
Date Joined: Jun 17, 2010
Posts: 16,931
If you're all new to the system, I strongly recommend you use the Point Buy arrays, or at the very least the Standard Array described in PHB.  You really have no idea how significant it is that you do that.  Insist on doing it.


Really.  Don't take no for an answer, and direct any who protest to us for more thorough explanations.
D&D Next = D&D:  Quantum Edition
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2 years ago  ::  Aug 30, 2011 - 5:23PM #6
FarmerGiles
Date Joined: Oct 13, 2007
Posts: 240
Hey I WANTED the point buy system, but the DM had the final say. And now everything's been rolled, I'm stuck, especially as everyone else rolled much better than I did, they all at least got a 16 as a pre-racial once.

But I can't just suicide for sake of it, I can only "hope" that something comes along that can beat my character to a pulp. For the time being though I need something that can work when my two highest stats are 16 after racials., Primal or not, without duplicating a class already chosen.  
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2 years ago  ::  Aug 30, 2011 - 5:33PM #7
erachima
Date Joined: Sep 4, 2010
Posts: 7,634
As I said, fighter. You have +1 to start and +WIS on OAs, so you can somewhat hit worth a damn, and your marking functions hit or miss.
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2 years ago  ::  Aug 30, 2011 - 5:38PM #8
FarmerGiles
Date Joined: Oct 13, 2007
Posts: 240
We already have a pit fighter. I know my options are limited but two fighters it's going to make me completely redundant and fighters are just boringin general.
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2 years ago  ::  Aug 30, 2011 - 5:43PM #9
ppaladin123
  • Dragon Slayer
Date Joined: Feb 21, 2008
Posts: 1,572
Ugg, he could have at least let you use the official rolling option instead of his own houseruled version.

That said, if you have a post-racial bonus 16 in your primary stat,  take the appropriate expertise feat, and invest in a accurate superior implement you are only really down +1 to hit versus a more typical build. It sucks but it is not fatal.

A panther/stalker shaman could work. You might also go druid, focus on beast form powers, and take the pack outcast theme. At level 5 you will always have combat advantage against any enemy adjacent to you. That will help a little with accuracy.

Either way, maybe focus a bit more than usual on powers that have a nice effect line so that you are still contributing even if you miss.
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2 years ago  ::  Aug 30, 2011 - 5:45PM #10
erachima
Date Joined: Sep 4, 2010
Posts: 7,634
Well then, as we've been telling you, you're basically ****ed, and you need to convince your group to play the game properly.

All light armored classes and all hit-reliant classes are unusable. If you won't take fighter, that means you could maybe build a cleric that just takes effect-line powers and has BCL, but I wouldn't expect that to be very effective or particularly fun.
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