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Sticky: New to D&D? Start here!
2 years ago  ::  Jun 20, 2011 - 2:44PM #41
Tony_Vargas
Date Joined: Sep 26, 2001
Posts: 10,732

Jun 20, 2011 -- 6:48AM, Arronius wrote:

So i've been looking for a while now at starting up a DnD group, but Im at a lose for what equipment I would need to buy. I'll Im really looking for are the rules for playing (combat, exploration, etc...) and character building information for some simple classes. I bought the red box thinking it had a full version of the player handbook, so now I need rules and level up info.
 So my question is, what is the difference between the Player Handbooks, and the DnD Essentials lineup in terms of which has the information neccesairy to play and progress at a feasable cost?


The Player's Handbook 1 has complete information to play all the familiar races (humans, dwarves, elves, halflings  -  and a few less familiar ones), 8 classes, 18 builds of those 8 classes, with all the rules, gear, magic items, rituals, ans whatnot a player needs, complete in one, big, hard-bound $35 book.  The PH2 and 3 do not have complete player rules, but rather have extra races and classes (and feats, and the like), you /need/ the PH1 to use the PH2 or PH3, but don't /need/ either of them unless there's a new race or class in them that you want.

The Essentials line lets you get started with just the Red Box (for two levels, as you've discovered) or just one of the Heroes of the _______ books (softbonus, digest-sized, 20 bucks).  Each of the Heroes books has about half the classes/builds/races as the PH, all the basic rules you need to build a character, a very limited selection of items, gear (except for 'superior weapons), and lacks rituals.  Additional rules are in the Rule Compendium, also 20 bucks. 

Like the Red Box, the Essentials classes are generally intended to be easier to understand, build and play than the PH1 classes.  They are also meant to feel more mechanically distinct, though, which can have the opposite effect if you try to play several different classes over time.

Really, the less you want out of the game, the better Essentials is for you.  If you want to keep it very casual, and not invest much time in your building or playing your character - if you're into D&D more for the socialization and maybe the story than the game, itself - then you can just get one book, and learn to build/play one of the simpler classes (the Slayer is the flat-out simplest, for instance).  If you want to try a variety of classes, customize your characters, or otherwise get 'serious' (obsessively geeky) about the game, then you'd get more for your money out of the PH1 (with all the downloadable errata and Class Compendium articles that update and modify it), and would probably ultimately want all three PHs and all the Heroes of books.



Love 4e?  Concerned about its future? Join the Old Guard of 4e

"You want The Tooth?  You can't handle The Tooth!"  - Dahlver-Nar.

"If magic is unrestrained in the campaign, D&D quickly degenerates into a weird wizard show where players get bored quickly"  - E. Gary Gygax
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2 years ago  ::  Jun 20, 2011 - 3:30PM #42
Anciea
Date Joined: May 7, 2011
Posts: 6
Hello,


I'm new to 4e as well.


Personally, I've chosen to start with only the Essentials line, mostly because it's the new thing in 4e. Later when I'm more comfortable with the rules, I'll use the "main" books wherever I feel the need. For now I find it much less confusing to not use both Essentials and the hardback books.


Take care.


Anciea
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2 years ago  ::  Jun 21, 2011 - 8:50AM #43
ORC_Wyvern
  • CSR
Date Joined: Mar 5, 2001
Posts: 1,068
Hi. I had to remove some content from this thread because trolling and flaming violates the Code of Conduct

Please keep the contents of your posts appropriate and in good taste. Also, please keep in mind the topic, which is advice for newcomers to D&D 4E. Thanks.
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2 years ago  ::  Jun 22, 2011 - 10:45AM #44
crazy_monkey
  • VCL Emeritus
  • The Inquisitor
Date Joined: Apr 5, 2006
Posts: 7,770
Update

The "Beyond Essentials" section now has brief introductions to the various product types.
Quentin Small
WotC Online Community Coordinator
All around helpful simian
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2 years ago  ::  Jun 23, 2011 - 5:44PM #45
Kirt
Date Joined: Aug 9, 2008
Posts: 9
Just getting into D&D! Got the Starter Kit and just picked up the Essentials Rules Compendium! Thanks for the list, crazy_monkey!
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2 years ago  ::  Jun 24, 2011 - 1:29AM #46
Tony_Vargas
Date Joined: Sep 26, 2001
Posts: 10,732

Jun 22, 2011 -- 10:45AM, crazy_monkey wrote:

Update

The "Beyond Essentials" section now has brief introductions to the various product types.


Essentials was supposed to be an expansion of 4e, serving as an 'alternative on-ramp' to the game.  That implies that the old on-ramp, the core PH1/MM1/DMG1 books, is still valid.  They, and the downloadable quickstart, should be right at the top, along with the Red Box and the other Essentials products.  

It may seem 'confusing' to present both paths, but people do come here saying "I have the PH what else do I need?"  Telling such people that they 'need' HotFL or HotFK is doing them a diservice.



Love 4e?  Concerned about its future? Join the Old Guard of 4e

"You want The Tooth?  You can't handle The Tooth!"  - Dahlver-Nar.

"If magic is unrestrained in the campaign, D&D quickly degenerates into a weird wizard show where players get bored quickly"  - E. Gary Gygax
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2 years ago  ::  Jun 25, 2011 - 6:32PM #47
Garthanos
Date Joined: Jan 15, 2009
Posts: 17,736
Unless they have changed there duo on-ramp idea I agree with Tony

Improvisation in 4e: Improv. Attacks(by wrecan) - Fave 4E Improvisations

The Non-combatant Adventurer

Reality is unrealistic - and even monkeys protest unfairness

Dynamic Reflavoring : The Fighter : The Wizard : The Swordmage
Creative Character Collection - Featuring:The Faerie Master - Snow White - Joxer - Ironman - Elric - Bloodwright

By virtue of being a player your characters are the protagonists in a heroic fantasy game even at level one

"You have to explicitly give non-casters permission to do awesome, where as with magic it is just assumed they can." -Garthanos

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2 years ago  ::  Jun 28, 2011 - 12:11PM #48
randelic
Date Joined: Jun 29, 2009
Posts: 3
Awesome list. Thanks!
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2 years ago  ::  Jun 30, 2011 - 9:44AM #49
TheVoid777
Date Joined: Jun 30, 2011
Posts: 3
Hi Everyone!

I'm new to 4e, but played a lot when I was a kid (37 now.)  I'd like to introduce my teens and some of their friends to DnD, but neither of the two bookstores (in my area) had the DnD Starter Kit in stock yesterday.  I did notice the QuickStart online, and it looks like a sizeable adventure.  Would there be much problem just starting with that, or will that get us off on something that doesn't really give the "complete" experience.  I know character creatiion is missing, but that's okay - it would probably bog down our first session anyway.  I want to jump right in for them and get going.

Thoughts?  Recommendations?  We'd like to play this weekend, hence my interest in the free downloadable.

-Void
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2 years ago  ::  Jun 30, 2011 - 9:58AM #50
mellored
Date Joined: Jul 8, 2008
Posts: 19,482
The new Red Box makes a very nice intro to D&D.  It would be my top recomendation.  It comes with stuff you'll need anyways (like dice).  If people havn't played before, it is THE place to start.  Though it's less useful for those who have played other RPG's and such.

But if your looking for free, the quick start isn't horrible.
guides Show
my builds Show

F-111 Interdictor Long (200+ squares) distance ally teleporter.  With some warlord stuff.  Broken in a plot way, not a power way.
Thought Switch   Higher level build that grants upto 14 attacks on turn 1.  If your allies play along, it's broken.
Elven Critters Crit op with crit generation.  5 of these will end anything.  Broken.
King Fisher Does an excellent job at keeping an enemy disabled in a few ways.  Strong.
Boominator Fun catch-22 booming blade build with either strong or completely broken damage depending on your reading.
Very Distracting Warlock Lot's of dazing and major penalties to hit.  Overpowered.
Pocket Protector Pixie Stealth Knight. Maximizing the defender's aura by being in an ally's/enemy's square.
Yakuza NinjIntimiAdin: Perma-stealth Striker that offers a little protection for ally's, and can intimidate bloodied enemies. Very Strong.
Chargeburgler with cheese Ranged attacks at the end of a charge along with perma-stealth. Solid, could be overpowered if tweaked.
Void Defender Defends giving a penalty to hit anyone but him, then removing himself from play. Can get somewhat broken in epic.
Scry and Die Attacking from around corners, while staying hidden. Moderate to broken, depending on the situation.
Skimisher Fly in, attack, and fly away. Also prevents enemies from coming close. Moderate to Broken depending on the enemy, but shouldn't make the game un-fun, as the rest of your team is at risk, and you have enough weaknesses.
Indestructible Simply won't die, even if you sleep though combat.
Sir Robin (Bravely Charge Away) He automatically slows and pushes an enemy (5 squares), while charging away. Hard to rate it's power level, since it's terrain dependent.
Death's Gatekeeper A fun twist on a healic, making your party "unkillable". Overpowered to Broken, but shouldn't actually make the game un-fun, just TPK proof.
Death's Gatekeeper mk2, (Stealth Edition) Make your party "unkillable", and you hidden, while doing solid damage. Stronger then the above, but also easier for a DM to shut down. Broken, until your DM get's enough of it.
Domination and Death Dominate everything then kill them quickly. Only works @ 30, but is broken multiple ways.
Battlemind Mc Prone-Daze Protecting your allies by keeping enemies away. Quite powerful.
The Retaliator Getting hit deals more damage to the enemy then you receive yourself, and you can take plenty of hits. Heavy item dependency, Broken.
Dead Kobold Transit Teleports 98 squares a turn, and can bring someone along for the ride. Not fully built, so i can't judge the power
Psilent Guardian Protect your allies, while being invisible. Overpowered, possibly broken
Unnamed Avenger|Runepriest/Hammer of Vengance Do lot's of damage while boosting your teams. Strong to slightly overpowered.
Charedent BarrageA charging ardent. Fine in a normal team, overpowered if there are 2 together, and easily broken in teams of 5.
Super Knight A tough, sticky, high damage knight. Strong.
Super Duper Knight Basically the same as super knight, only far more broken.
Mora, the unkillable avenger Solid damage, while being neigh indestuctable. Overpowered, but not broken.
Swordburst Maximus At-Will Close Burst 3 that slide and prones.  Protects allies with off actions. Strong, possibly over powered with the right party.
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