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2 years ago ::
Dec 07, 2010 - 8:34PM
#11
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It just seems like that explanation is redundant and raises other questions, like why isn't it all listed in their inventory or why isn't functionality aquired by a mechanics check. as written this aspect is disconnected, as evidence it either does need to be explained away somehow or otherwise altered.
It doesn't need to be written in their inventory because it's in their deck before the game starts, it will stay in the deck for as long as they keep their character, and it cannot be taken from their deck. You don't need to write it down for the same reason you don't write down a character's readied mutations or held omega tech. Salvaging and the omega charge check do not require Mechanics. In fact, nothing about omega tech is skill dependent at all. Why is this in any way disconnected? (From the precedent set by the game, of course -- we could talk all day about how the game is divorced from reality.)
they at least give advice on how to mesh origins. as written, you're just suppose to find the omega tech laying around.
Actually, that's not what's written. Nothing written in the Gamma World rulebook in any way contradicts the suggestion I made. You're reading more than what is written on the page, finding in it the meaning you wanted to find. Ironically, as if you had your own deck of cards, separate from the book's. 
it depends on how satisfactory it is and why it's done. your mileage may vary if it's a necessity that arises from a marketing strategy aimed at getting you to buy more trading cards. to me, it seems like one of many dissociated mechanics that threaten to detract from the roleplay.
Exactly. You went into it expecting to find a marketing strategy, and that's exactly what you found. While I appreciate any link to the Alexandrian, your example doesn't match the concepts put forward by the article, because the explanation as presented requires no house ruling (see the section entitled "Explaining it all away") or breach of narrative.
And really, that whole article is (unfortunately) a long tirade against the separation of narrative and mechanics, which 4e has in spades and Gamma World even moreso. If that's where your primary issue lies, then you're going to spend more time complaining than playing.
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2 years ago ::
Dec 07, 2010 - 8:39PM
#12
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Date Joined:
Aug 22, 2007
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You've run into the collectable aspect of the game now.
A player who puts more money into the game, will have (in theory!) better cards to chose from when making their deck. This is the benefit to them putting more money into the game! This is pretty much the intent - Sell more cards by making your characters better as you get more cards.
If you want it to be like that then that is how you would approach investing in booster pack. But one can also invest in GW booster packs to add variety in game play and their GW experience, just like any other RPG.
...You could also rule that any Rares players want to insert into the game should be inserted into the GM deck, to maintain their open rarity... But I wouldn't suggest doing something like that unless your players also like the idea.
That is similar to my solution, but I will make that call on a card by card bases, thier are other rare cards I find comfortable in player decks. As a group we are all new to this GW so as Gm, the rest will follow my lead. I made this thread to see what others think about powerful omega tech rares like PNJ.
For my Gamma World group, I fully expect to be the only person actually buying cards, so I don't see this coming up as an issue... I may even go through and set up some sort of draft system if we end up playing enough to merit player decks, so they just draft them from my collection.
I am in a similar situation, I will be the one to buy any booster packs and I am. Currently we have 3 Gm decks and 8 booster packs. I own 2 Gm deck (that is another story) and 7 of the booster packs. I think we have enough cards to make player decks, but I was holding off until we understand the game better. When we started we had no idea on how to customize a deck and really what cards are available and what they do.
Thanks to the feed back.
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2 years ago ::
Dec 07, 2010 - 8:46PM
#13
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Date Joined:
Aug 22, 2007
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There's no solid in character justification for this advantage
There's a rather decent one that circulates these boards on a fairly consistent basis: that the character carries around a collection of broken omega junk (represented by the player deck), but every so often finds a piece (battery, hydraulic, duct tape) he or she needs to juryrig it back into working order.
I like that. Currently I am having players describe to me how and where they found the omega tech item they have drawn. But I will keep this idea in mind when we move to using player decks.
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2 years ago ::
Dec 07, 2010 - 9:47PM
#14
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You don't need to write it down for the same reason you don't write down a character's readied mutations or held omega tech.
What reason is that? Because it's disconnected from the rest of the game, right? It is suppose to be random and not possessed all at once, otherwise a character would have it on their sheet, right?
Salvaging and the omega charge check do not require Mechanics. In fact, nothing about omega tech is skill dependent at all. Why is this in any way disconnected?
That's the disconnect, if you are using the explanation that the character has all these parts that somehow become functioning omega tech without a skill check. The character repairs the tech, but doesn't need to be proficient in mechanics? If it's just because they got lucky it isn't any different from the cannon explanation, the player draws a card from a deck, and that still doesn't reconcile in character why the player is prechoosing the range of random loot. The real reason, because WotC wants to sell you cards, sticks out. If suspension of disbelief isn't an issue in your game that's fine. I'm just of the opinion it's a reminder that you're playing a character rather than exploring a post extra-dimensional collision wasteland.
(From the precedent set by the game, of course -- we could talk all day about how the game is divorced from reality.)
Of course, in the same way one could spend all day inventing reasons for why a knight in chess moves in an L shape.
Actually, that's not what's written. Nothing written in the Gamma World rulebook in any way contradicts the suggestion I made.
It doesn't contradict it because it's a blindspot in the game without a cannon explanation. Hence the reason why a reason needed to be invented here.
Exactly. You went into it expecting to find a marketing strategy, and that's exactly what you found. While I appreciate any link to the Alexandrian, your example doesn't match the concepts put forward by the article, because the explanation as presented requires no house ruling (see the section entitled "Explaining it all away") or breach of narrative.
"And if you're slapping on fluff text in order to answer these questions, the answers will be different depending on the fluff text you apply -- and that makes the fluff text a house rule."
It does require house ruling, you just don't consider explaining away the reason why the character suddenly has functional omega tech as repairing without it being assosiated to the repair skill as house ruling. It does present questions, where did it come from, how did it suddenly start working without the need to have the character fix it. That's house ruling and still doesn't smooth the gap between the forced card game element into the roleplay game in character. It's just swapping one set of unanswered questions for another.
And really, that whole article is (unfortunately) a long tirade against the separation of narrative and mechanics, which 4e has in spades and Gamma World even moreso. If that's where your primary issue lies, then you're going to spend more time complaining than playing.
That's why I'm a proponent of dropping the player decks and using the GM deck. It makes sense to keep the random element random and not to bother with creating anymore house rules to justify a thinly veiled sales pitch.
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2 years ago ::
Dec 07, 2010 - 10:27PM
#15
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Date Joined:
Aug 22, 2007
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.., a thinly veiled sales pitch.
I think this opinion sums up your whole arguement. I think it is the reason you don't see the potential for role playing with a player deck in Gamma World. The Op is looking to open discussion about banning of certain cards in player decks and why or why not (I know because I wrote the Op). Clearly you have no intention of such a discussion and have highjacked this thread to air your discontent of the GW booster pack marketing. Make your own thread and beat that old horse some where else. 
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2 years ago ::
Dec 07, 2010 - 10:58PM
#16
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I think it is the reason you don't see the potential for role playing with a player deck in Gamma World.
To go with the explanation offered here it doesn't really jive with roleplaying. It's improving a reason why the universe is trying to sell you cards. It's clearly not being ignored, that is the reason why an explanation needed to be made. I'm just explaining my preference in circumventing the topic.
The Op is looking to open discussion about banning of certain cards in player decks and why or why not (I know because I wrote the Op). Clearly you have no intention of such a discussion and have highjacked this thread to air your discontent of the GW booster pack marketing.
Because the issue isn't related? My first post laid out three reasons, including the game balance issue cited in the OP, why dropping the player deck seemed sensible to me. If FlashbackJon wants to defend the player deck from an roleplay perspective, why not? It is a roleplay game and it seemed like a valid criteria in the context of banning cards to me.
Make your own thread and beat that old horse some where else.
Chill out, I'm not stopping you from taking your Pheonix Neural Jack and going home.
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2 years ago ::
Dec 08, 2010 - 7:17AM
#17
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Date Joined:
Aug 22, 2007
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I think it is the reason you don't see the potential for role playing with a player deck in Gamma World.
To go with the explanation offered here it doesn't really jive with roleplaying. It's improving a reason why the universe is trying to sell you cards. It's clearly not being ignored, that is the reason why an explanation needed to be made. I'm just explaining my preference in circumventing the topic.
The Op is looking to open discussion about banning of certain cards in player decks and why or why not (I know because I wrote the Op). Clearly you have no intention of such a discussion and have highjacked this thread to air your discontent of the GW booster pack marketing.
Because the issue isn't related? My first post laid out three reasons, including the game balance issue cited in the OP, why dropping the player deck seemed sensible to me. If FlashbackJon wants to defend the player deck from an roleplay perspective, why not? It is a roleplay game and it seemed like a valid criteria in the context of banning cards to me.
Make your own thread and beat that old horse some where else.
Chill out, I'm not stopping you from taking your Pheonix Neural Jack
Are you done? Did you make your point. YOu don't like the marketing of booster packs, Got it. Now you can take your gripes and go start your own thread on the subject.
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2 years ago ::
Dec 08, 2010 - 3:58PM
#18
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Are you done?
Quite. Try not to act so shocked next time you come across a rare intentionally overpowered card.
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2 years ago ::
Dec 14, 2010 - 5:25AM
#19
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Date Joined:
Aug 14, 2005
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Addressing the Original Topic - honestly, if your players want to hold onto thier specific characters instead of indulging in the entertainment that is GW Character Creation, let them. I think a major part of the fun is the random generation and the attempts at explaining the bizzarre. The game really isnt focused well on balance, and if your players are all taking multiple copies of that for thier player decks to the point that its a problem, you probably have other issues to work out with your group.
Honestly, I see that you dont seem to want to talk about the problems caused by the booster method, but thats really a large part of where this issue arises from. I think the second post says it pretty well. While I realize PNJ isnt actually one of the booster cards, its still related to the issue that some cards will be inherintly much more powerful than others due to thier system of purchase. Add that to a rule that lets you trim down your deck seriously small.... theres some major potential for abuse.
If you've got a set group, then either your players will abuse that. . . in which case you need to talk to them, or you dont trust your players not to. . . in which which case you have something to think about, or its not actually a problem, because the issue wont come up much.
If you dont have a set group, its probably because you play at official games and then its a moot point anyway.
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2 years ago ::
Dec 14, 2010 - 2:01PM
#20
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Date Joined:
Jun 16, 2008
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If you do not know, the omega tech Pheonix Neural Jack allows a Pc to regain their bloodied value in hp when they drop to 0, It is a cheat death card. Not only that, it's salvageable at 7th level. A super science device like the PNJ is very Gamma World, but it seems just unfair for one Pc to have sole access to it. It is a rare card after all (and we have only one as a group). But I could see it as a card in a Dm's deck giving every player a chance to get thier hands on it.
What do you all think?
Any other player deck restrictions out there, certain cards or other restrictions on player decks?
Myeh, the amount of damage that is spread around during an encounter makes this item OK, once per encounter. The problem is, the card is discarded after use until you can salvage it. Then you're stunned after using it. That might be just the opening a monster needs to put you down for good.
So I think this card is fine. It seems powerful, but in reality...myeh.
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