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2 years ago ::
Jan 01, 2011 - 2:19PM
#31
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Date Joined:
Sep 22, 2007
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Oh - I occasionally trawl the net and snag cool looking pictures of all sorts of fantasy heros. I have a couple that might also suit - if I knew how to do pictures in a forum post and my internets weren't so damn slow and crappy, I'd offer them. On the other hand, the picture is already cool 
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2 years ago ::
Apr 02, 2011 - 4:07AM
#32
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Date Joined:
Jun 21, 2008
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First of all, cool build! I've been looking for a good int-wis artificer hybrid (other than it-wis ficer-warlord), and this combines cleric and artificer beautifully.
A little question, though. What do you think of Exacting Utterance instead of Spike Wire for Enc 1? While Wire does more damage, Exacting Utterance offers a bit of healing, plus, as I read it, Punishing Eye would trigger another use of the vulnerability outside of the ally's triggering attack. That would make for some huge damage increase for one turn when you have both Eye and Utterance up.
The downside is that it means you'd lose Hymn of Resurgence on Enc 3, but Shocking Feedback is not a bad substitute since it's an interrupt. Both does different things, though, and I'd understand if you don't want to lose hymn.
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2 years ago ::
Apr 02, 2011 - 4:54AM
#33
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First of all, cool build! I've been looking for a good int-wis artificer hybrid (other than it-wis ficer-warlord), and this combines cleric and artificer beautifully.
A little question, though. What do you think of Exacting Utterance instead of Spike Wire for Enc 1? While Wire does more damage, Exacting Utterance offers a bit of healing, plus, as I read it, Punishing Eye would trigger another use of the vulnerability outside of the ally's triggering attack. That would make for some huge damage increase for one turn when you have both Eye and Utterance up.
The downside is that it means you'd lose Hymn of Resurgence on Enc 3, but Shocking Feedback is not a bad substitute since it's an interrupt. Both does different things, though, and I'd understand if you don't want to lose hymn.
Thanks ^^
Yes, i have considered this kind of a change and the build wouldn't be really different. The point is that Hymn is an incredible accuracy i'd not like to lose it. Shocking Feedback is a good power but it is imho inferior to Hymn.
Admittedly, though, Spike Wire isn't that incredible encounter 1 and is surely inferior to EUtterance.
That's a kind of tough choice, admittedly. What really wins, at least from my perspective, is HoR, but i could put your option in an alternative build section
Chauntea/Lathander/Torm Cleric since 1995 My husband married a DM - καλὸς καὶ ἀγαθός
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2 years ago ::
Apr 03, 2011 - 8:52AM
#34
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Date Joined:
Jan 12, 2004
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(obligatory cool flavor yay build blah blah blah)
I have some thoughts about utility powers, particularly because your attack powers are so strong I would rather not give up standard actions, and I just don't like daily powers if I can help it.
1) Would the difference between Bastion of Health (U6) and Resurgent Strength be worth losing Energy Conversion for? You could pick up either Restorative Infusion in the U2 in low levels, and retrain it to Swift Mender at higher levels (where you won't want to use Brand of the Sun as often).
2) Did you consider Recuperative Enchantment at U10? It doesn't eat up any actions, you don't have to worry about what encounter to use it in, and in long adventuring days (where surgeless healing matters), it begins to dramatically outstrip healing figurine in the free surges provided.
3) Similarly, at 16, would you consider bumping down to U10 to pick up whichever you passed up, or possibly Slick Concoction? I'm not a huge fan of Astral Shield on people with powerful at-wills, and there is so much juice in U10.
And on a broader note: Are there any feats you could give up to squeeze in an Invoker MC? With INT/WIS and Deva racials, the extra skill will be put to good use, and I feel like Ritual Casting (w/ the free Hand of Fate) would both round out the loss of some of the above dailies and get you a Raise Dead. It would also open up the Flame of Hope paragon path, which at might be stronger than Spell Commander as you don't have Killswitch's Direct the Strike.
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2 years ago ::
Apr 03, 2011 - 10:20AM
#35
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1) I'm an huge fan of energy conversion and losing such a good immediate interrupt is quite severe. On the other hand bastion of health is really a good power for a ranged cleric but it suffers a bit in our context: lack of charisma and chance to be in melee makes BoH kind of crippled. Resurgent Strength isn't all that power, admittedly, but it's a surge burst 3 and gains benefit from Healer's Lore. As for Fei's request, the difference between the possible builds isn't great but my version benefit a little more for being in melee.
2) Yes i've considered that but i don't like that power for the implied cheese it offers to good players. I know that Killswitch build has it, but i wanted to stay far from it and use healing figurine or Battle surge.
3) Yes, sure. I'm a really huge fan of AS but slick concoction is incredible. You can even take it at level 10, since once you get at 11, with the incredible Enhanced Resistive Formula, you should have enough healing. On the other hand AS is basically an eternal +2 bonus to AC for your melees (and yourself too), and you get winds of fury at level 17 and the couple of dailies at level 5 and 20 to boost the situational movement you may want.
4) Yes, potent restorables and rapid infusions (to gain back enhanced r.f.) are two possible choices. Flame of Hope is incredible and i wanted to make an alternative build. But the target of this build wasn't really beating KS on enabling (which is impossible), but creating a really universal leader, capable of everything.
Chauntea/Lathander/Torm Cleric since 1995 My husband married a DM - καλὸς καὶ ἀγαθός
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2 years ago ::
Apr 04, 2011 - 11:04AM
#36
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First of all, I'd like to thank you for the awesome and extremely cool build. Been very interested in your build for a little while and figured I'd give it a try.
I'm planning to be using it with one change - Swapping the level 5 Daily for a the new Level 5 Daily from Heroes of Shadow that grants an Undead follower from a dead enemy. That Power combined with the Artificer's ability to grant temp HP equal to an ally's healing surge value, would work very well. (Imagine a Solo with 600 HP that's stuck at 1 HP due to the power, and then gains 150 temp. He'd be a great meat shield.)
My DM just started a new campaign at lvl 11 and I figured I'd give it a try, but my optimizer brain keeps running into problems.
1) Our party consists of:
- 1 Hybrid Lock/Swordmage - Defender
- 1 Slayer (soon to be Blackguard)
- 1 Dragon Soul Sorcerer (Infinite Breaths - but HR to only 1/turn)
- 1 X-Bow Ranger
- and 1 Lightswitch
So while I do have a few candidates for benfits from the PP, I can't seem to get my head wrapped around why I'd pick the Spell Commander over another PP like Flame of Hope, or just run one of the Radiant PPs.
Our DM grants us 2 extra feats (1 Heroic, 1 PP) as a HR, so I have the wiggle room to fit in an MC feat. (IE: Swordmage MC for Heavyblade Implements or Invoker MC for Falme of Hope). Our DM has limited our ability to purchases Uncommon magic items with gold, so going from 1 weapon + 1 implement to 1 Weaplement seems like a good idea. Going Swordmage would let me run a radiant weapon and benefit from radiant feats on all my powers.
Is there a better PP to choose for the Lightswitch build given that my party is suboptimal for Spell Commander and I have 2 extra feats?
2) I am the only healer, but from past experience most of our players have good defenses and do not usually go down very often. This leads me to think that I can skip out on the Hybrid Talent and the Channel Divinity power, but at the same time I'm not sure what I should be taking instead.
3) What do you think of the Deva ED - Soul of the World. It grants bonuses to both Int and Wis, as well as allows you to take powers from another class. I'm not sure what class would be best, but I think it's a solid alternative to Chosen. I know the Chosen of Ioun ED is great, but we are running in a custom world and I'm not likely going to be worshipping a god of Knowledge. Is there another ED you'd pick before Soul of the World? Maybe Avatar of Death?! (Probably going to worship a death god)
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2 years ago ::
Apr 04, 2011 - 11:51AM
#37
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Date Joined:
Jan 12, 2004
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@Daerth: I'm not Nausicaa (obv) but I think I can try to tackle your questions
1) Lightswitch takes Spell Commander so the build has at least a couple ways of granting allies attacks, as part of the "do everything" schtick. If that schtick isn't as important to you, rotating it out would be fine and Flame of Hope is likely an excellent choice (though also worth mentioning are the classic Divine Oracle and the silly-yet-effective Exorcist of the Sacred Flame).
2) Mercy is important because a lot of Lightswitch's healing is pro-active rather than re-active. Particularly without a Gambling Word trigger, Mercy gives you an encounter-frequency way to recover if the enemies either get lucky or ignore your THP shielded guys.
3) Soul of the World is hot (especially with Flame of Hope if you want to second wind for fun and profit), but in the non-demigod realm Sage of Ages is worth a look.
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2 years ago ::
Apr 04, 2011 - 12:47PM
#38
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@Seifalmasy
1) Exorcist of the Sacred Flame seems weak. The level 11 feature depends on you dealing Fire Damage and many of the class abilities only exceptional around demons, devils, shapechangers, or undead. It also seems that being able to reliably deal fire or radiant damage when playing as a hybrid is tough. I suppose I could MC swordmage and run around with a radiant weapon to get by that, but that stilll leaves the issue with the 11 feature that is only on fire damage.
Divine Oracle is always a good classic, but my artificer power won't be targeting will often. I suppose by sticking with Cleric vs Will powers I could get by only missing out on 1 Encounter and 1 Daily due to the Artificer.
Lastly what is your opinion of the Swordmage vs Invoker MC choice? I'd have to MC Invoker to go Flame, but the SwordMage saves me on having to waste treasure drops on an extra item and would let me run the radiant weapon for a little extra damage.
[My DM runs the APL +1,+2,+3,+4 treasure package method, so every 5 levels I get 4 items (3 of which are of my choice). This means that given I upgrade my Cloak, Symbol, Weapon and Armor every opprtunity I'd have little room for the other useful items. I suppose I could stagger the upgrades: Go from a +3 Armor to a +5, a +2 Cloak to a +4, etc.]
2) Yeah I had a feeling that Mercy would be needed, even though my past experience led me to believe that 1 word + 1 infusion (more like 2) was enough. It's an excellent point that half to two-thirds of my healing is proactive and cannot get a downed ally up.
3) Can you explain what you mean by "second wind for fun and profit".
Is there a specific thing I should be looking to do in order to profit from it? (Race, Feats, etc.)
I'd imagine dwarf as the 21 feature to get a SW as a minor. Then what race should I pick at level 24.
Also any advice on class to pick as my feature for level 24?
[Note: My DM allows nearly a full retrain at every level, so at level 24 I could swap every power out if I wanted. How does this interact with the hybrid requirements? Am I still subject to the 1 Cleric/Artificer Encounter/Daily/Utility limitation]
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2 years ago ::
Apr 04, 2011 - 1:31PM
#39
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Date Joined:
Jan 12, 2004
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1) A simple Arcane Admixture fixes the damage type problems. As Magic Weapon will see a lot more use than Brand of the Sun (particularly if you focus on the artificer's interrupt powers), it gives you a reliable way to dish out 2x WIS mod temps, and it happens whether or not you hit. There's something cute about combining that with the Effect: Save on brand of the sun, in terms of never wasting an action missing. Being able to put mini-shields on the guys who didn't get the big-shields seems useful, though it probably doesn't have Flame of Hope's raw power.
The text on Arcane Implement Proficiency: "Choose a kind of implement associated with an arcane class. You can now use that kind of implement." So I don't think you're locked into swordmage if you want the weapliment - make the sword an "implement you can now use" and it should work for all your powers. There may be a rules discussion here I'm missing.
Neither of those two feats are awesome in the abstract, but you said you have feats to spare.
3) Oh didn't mean much, just that the Flame of Hope's level 16 feature looks sort of silly as a standard action, but sort of awesome as a minor, if you Soul of the World into Dwarf (giving the leader a self-heal doesn't suck, either). I can't say I've studied Soul of the World combos very much, so I don't really have any advice for race/class after that. You could pick wizard and retrain into their borken dailies, I guess.
Edit: Ph3 p. 136: "Even if you later change your powers through retraining, power-swap feats, or some other means, you must retain at least one power in each of those four categories [at-will, encounter, daily, utility] from both your classes."
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2 years ago ::
Apr 04, 2011 - 5:47PM
#40
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1) Yeah admixture would fix the fire issue on my MagicWeapon power, since I'll be using that alot more than Brand of Sun. Why do you say I dishes out 2x Wis temp? Isn't it 1xWis...unless you mean due to IIs and IRs.
So I guess I'll be going Flame of Hope.
As for the MC choice, yeah arcane implement prof would get me my heavy blade as an implement.
Question is, is it worth it? I've moved over to Pychic Cheese using a Silver Gith weapon...so now to decide if I need the Cheese on my implement powers or if it's okay to just have it on MagicWeapon and other Weapon based powers.
2) Yeah seems to me like that would make alot of sense. Getting a heal as a minor is great and the 1d6+wis damage / temp HP is nice to have also.
Hoping to have some advice on what to do with Soul of the World. One of our players says I could pick Cavalier since it's a class (and they don't restrict it to only normal non-essential classes) and get it's mount (as that is a utility power), it would still allow me to snag some pally powers also (since Cavalier is a paladin too), but I doubt it would be worth while (since powers are all Str/Cha based).
So looking for some advice on how to proceed in the Epic tier.
@Seif: PS: Thx for all the quick and informative replys Seif.
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